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billspro

This should be the Bills plan at Qb

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1) Try to sign Kirk Cousins- Bring him in and see if he is a believer in what Sean McDermott is doing. I would offer him a similar contract to Carr and Stafford. If he is trying to be a 30 million per year guy, I'm out. 

 

2) Sign a lower level Vet and trade up to the top 5-10 for Mayfield- I think Mayfield is the best QB prospect in the draft, if he was two inches taller he would be the unquestioned number 1 QB in the class. Darnold and Rosen are much riskier prospects than Mayfield and I am not willing to trade up into the top 5 for either of them. I think both number ones and a number 5 should get it done. I would be willing to part with one assesst in next years draft if need be. 

 

3) Sign one of the Vikings QBs and try to trade down to early round two. In round two I am drafting either Rudolph or White, hopefully I get to pick my favourite of the two. 

 

 

I would be comfortable with any of those QB situations heading into next season. 

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9 minutes ago, White Linen said:

Are you serious?

 

I am serious. And don't call me Shirley. 

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5 minutes ago, blacklabel said:

 

I am serious. And don't call me Shirley. 

 

Can I interest you in a nightcap or don't you wear those?

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6 minutes ago, Elite Poster said:

To say Rosen is much riskier than Baker is questionable

 

For me he is because of his turnovers, injuries, and demeanor. When I watch Rosen I see Cutler. His arm talent and footwork are outstanding but he has very costly turnovers and does not seem to elevate the play of his teammates. I think he will be a starter in the league and may even have a few years with probowl numbers but if the game is on the line I will take Mayfield over Rosen every time.

 

Also, trading for picks 5-10 is much easier than trading into the top 4.

Edited by billspro
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36 minutes ago, billspro said:

1) Try to sign Kirk Cousins- Bring him in and see if he is a believer in what Sean McDermott is doing. I would offer him a similar contract to Carr and Stafford. If he is trying to be a 30 million per year guy, I'm out. 

 

2) Sign a lower level Vet and trade up to the top 5-10 for Mayfield- I think Mayfield is the best QB prospect in the draft, if he was two inches taller he would be the unquestioned number 1 QB in the class. Darnold and Rosen are much riskier prospects than Mayfield and I am not willing to trade up into the top 5 for either of them. I think both number ones and a number 5 should get it done. I would be willing to part with one assesst in next years draft if need be. 

 

3) Sign one of the Vikings QBs and try to trade down to early round two. In round two I am drafting either Rudolph or White, hopefully I get to pick my favourite of the two. 

 

 

I would be comfortable with any of those QB situations heading into next season. 

 

Pretty much my same plan.  I too think Baker is the best QB in this draft and fully agree if he was 6’3 he would be the unquestioned top ranked QB and probably number 1 overall pick.  

 

I too like the idea of signing cousins and using all my picks on the roster, although I think ultimately he will sign with either Jets or Broncos.  But if we draft a QB, Baker is the guy I want the most.  I will still be excited about any first round QB we land, but my preference in order is Baker followed by Rosen, Lamar, Darnold, Allen, Mason.

 

And Baker would cost us less to trade up to get, plus he might even fall to us if Cousins is signed by Jets or Broncos and AZ takes Lamar like I think they will.

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20 minutes ago, billspro said:

 

For me he is because of his turnovers, injuries, and demeanor. When I watch Rosen I see Cutler. His arm talent and footwork are outstanding but he has very costly turnovers and does not seem to elevate the play of his teammates. I think he will be a starter in the league and may even have a few years with probowl numbers but if the game is on the line I will take Mayfield over Rosen every time.

 

Also, trading for picks 5-10 is much easier than trading into the top 4.

 

The Cutler comparison for Rosen is really not the closest 

 

It took Cutler till his SR year to play at a level that Rosen did as a true Freshman 

 

He is way ahead of Cutler at his age honestly. Eli Manning is a closer comp

 

Trent Dilfer loves his football IQ

 

 

Edited by Buffalo716
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28 minutes ago, billspro said:

 

For me he is because of his turnovers, injuries, and demeanor. When I watch Rosen I see Cutler. His arm talent and footwork are outstanding but he has very costly turnovers and does not seem to elevate the play of his teammates. I think he will be a starter in the league and may even have a few years with probowl numbers but if the game is on the line I will take Mayfield over Rosen every time.

 

Also, trading for picks 5-10 is much easier than trading into the top 4.

 

We shouldn't do what is easiest.  We should do what is best.  The odds of drafting a franchise guy are highest in the first two picks (2nd highest in the first 4) then fall after that, because that's where the consensus best QB get drafted.

 

I don't know what "elevate the play of his teammates" means in this post.

 

In the film I've watched, Rosen was throwing this year to a bunch of WR who didn't appear able to catch a cold consistently.  He is a QB who is capable and willing to throw nto a tight window or throw a WR open, and when you've got a QB who does that consistently if his WRs deflect the ball up he will throw picks (part of the difference between 2013 and 2014 Foles, 2016 and 2017 Matty Ryan)

 

There's no question that Mayfield has really stunning passing yard and TD numbers, the "risk" with Mayfield is twofold:

1) as a spread offense guy who has never played under center, will he be able to adjust to a pro offense? and

2) as a short QB, will he be able to adjust and find his passing lanes in the NFL?

It isn't sufficient to be a spirited, competitive "gamer" in the NFL.

 

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1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I don't know what "elevate the play of his teammates" means

 

In the film I've watched, Rosen was throwing this year to a bunch of WR who didn't appear able to catch a cold.  He is a QB who is capable and willing slinging it into a tight window or throwing a WR open, and when you've got a QB who does that consistently if his WRs deflect the ball up he will throw picks (part of the difference between 2013 and 2014 Foles, 2016 and 2017 Matty Ryan)

 

There's no question that Mayfield has really stunning passing yard and TD numbers, the "risk" with Mayfield is twofold:

1) as a spread offense guy who has never played under center, will he be able to adjust to a pro offense? and

2) as a short QB, will he be able to adjust and find his passing lanes in the NFL?

 

Exactly. I love Mayfield as a QB but Rosen is a true pocket passer in the mold of a Eli Manning or Matt Ryan

 

not that Baker can't be better than Rosen , but Rosen as a prospect does have scouts very intrigued do to his skill set and football IQ. Most of the reasons people don't like him are based on the perception of his demeanor 

 

He has carried UCLA for 3 years and they can't catch a cold

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14 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

(Rosen) He has carried UCLA for 3 years and they can't catch a cold

 

I know, right?  I started watching and I'm like WTF, how did this guy manage a decent completion percentage?  I was pretty sure some of the time they weren't running the routes he expected, either - eg a throw with anticipation that would have gone for a 1st down and the WR stopped and turned around 2 yds short, with the DB 4 yds downfield WHAT?

 

That said Mayfield interests me greatly, but I'm not sure I'd describe him as "lower risk" for a high pick.  Seems like his ceiling could be Drew Brees, his floor could be (sorry) Tyrod Taylor (I know he has a better arm, I'm thinking guy who flushes out of the pocket rather than find his lanes).

Edited by Hapless Bills Fan

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5 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

The Cutler comparison for Rosen is really not that valid

 

It took Cutler till his SR year to play at a level that Rosen did as a true Freshman 

 

He is way ahead of Cutler at his age honestly. Eli Manning is a closer comp

 

 

 

 

 

I think Cutler is probably his floor and Eli is probably his ceiling.

 

He also lost all of his road games this past season which is a bit concerning for me.

 

I know I am on the negative side of Rosen evaluation but I feel all the great QBs have an unmatched passion for the game. Brady, Brees, Wentz, and Rodgers all carry themselves a certain way. Rosen does not seem to be that type of guy, I also have never met him so it is solely based of the media.

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5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I know, right?  I started watching and I'm like WTF, how did this guy manage a decent completion percentage?  I was pretty sure some of the time they weren't running the routes he expected, either - eg a throw with anticipation that would have gone for a 1st down and the WR stopped and turned around 2 yds short, with the DB 4 yds downfield WHAT?

 

That said Mayfield interests me greatly, but I'm not sure I'd describe him as "lower risk" for a high pick.  Seems like his ceiling could be Drew Brees, his floor could be (sorry) Tyrod Taylor (I know he has a better arm, I'm thinking guy who flushes out of the pocket rather than find his lanes).

 

My best friend avidly wants us to draft Mayfield and I'm all for it

 

but I constantly remind him that as damn good as he is(and I believe it) The history of The NFL says he has a tough road

 

but I wouldn't bet against him 

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25 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

We shouldn't do what is easiest.  We should do what is best.  The odds of drafting a franchise guy are highest in the first two picks (2nd highest in the first 4) then fall after that, because that's where the consensus best QB get drafted.

 

I don't know what "elevate the play of his teammates" means in this post.

 

In the film I've watched, Rosen was throwing this year to a bunch of WR who didn't appear able to catch a cold consistently.  He is a QB who is capable and willing to throw nto a tight window or throw a WR open, and when you've got a QB who does that consistently if his WRs deflect the ball up he will throw picks (part of the difference between 2013 and 2014 Foles, 2016 and 2017 Matty Ryan)

 

There's no question that Mayfield has really stunning passing yard and TD numbers, the "risk" with Mayfield is twofold:

1) as a spread offense guy who has never played under center, will he be able to adjust to a pro offense? and

2) as a short QB, will he be able to adjust and find his passing lanes in the NFL?

It isn't sufficient to be a spirited, competitive "gamer" in the NFL.

 

 

I would be all for trading up to the #2 spot if I believed in a guy, but I don't. I think this draft has a lot of really good QBs but no great ones. I don't see much separation between the top 5 guys.

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3 minutes ago, billspro said:

I think Cutler is probably his floor and Eli is probably his ceiling.

He also lost all of his road games this past season which is a bit concerning for me.

 

I can see that (both those comparators)

 

Just now, billspro said:

I would be all for trading up to the #2 spot if I believed in a guy, but I don't. I think this draft has a lot of really good QBs but no great ones. I don't see much separation between the top 5 guys.

 

Who do you see as the top 5 guys?

 

Rosen, Mayfield, Darnold, Allen and?  Jackson?

 

I see separation.  But maybe that's just me, and this is the first year I've watched much college film or tried to "soak in" with the college scouting.

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12 minutes ago, billspro said:

 

I think Cutler is probably his floor and Eli is probably his ceiling.

 

He also lost all of his road games this past season which is a bit concerning for me.

 

I know I am on the negative side of Rosen evaluation but I feel all the great QBs have an unmatched passion for the game. Brady, Brees, Wentz, and Rodgers all carry themselves a certain way. Rosen does not seem to be that type of guy, I also have never met him so it is solely based of the media.

 

Cutler is way more of a physical specimen than Rosen. That's why I don't get it

 

Rosen is a Cerebral QB who is perfect fundamentally. By all accounts very QB savvy. And has as good of touch for a kid his age as you can find

 

Cutler is way closer to being Josh Allen. A big , strong athlete with a cannon. Cutler used to truck guys in the SEC

 

Rosen may look "laid back" but nothing about his game says that. He must have a tremendous work ethic to be the FIRST EVER true Freshmen QB starter at UCLA and be a consensus 5* #1 QB and he backed it

 

If YOU MUST compare him to a bad or semi average  QB I think he would be more favorable to a Tim Couch who got screwed in Cleveland. 

Edited by Buffalo716

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44 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

The Cutler comparison for Rosen is really not the closest 

 

It took Cutler till his SR year to play at a level that Rosen did as a true Freshman 

 

He is way ahead of Cutler at his age honestly. Eli Manning is a closer comp

 

Trent Dilfer loves his football IQ

 

 

It's not his lack of intelligence or athletic ability that will be the issue. Mora protected and coddled Josh from the media for his entire time at UCLA. Darnold was just the opposite.  He constantly did local interviews and came across as a down-to-earth kid who just wants to go out and grind. When I use the Jay Cutler comparison it's more about his personality, then his arm strength or throwing ability.

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32 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

There's no question that Mayfield has really stunning passing yard and TD numbers, the "risk" with Mayfield is twofold:

1) as a spread offense guy who has never played under center, will he be able to adjust to a pro offense? and

2) as a short QB, will he be able to adjust and find his passing lanes in the NFL?

It isn't sufficient to be a spirited, competitive "gamer" in the NFL.

 

 

Couldn't agree more. I understand the love for Mayfield. He made things happen, sure. As you said, he's "spirited." But I don't think that style translates to the NFL where he'll be up against superior talent. He made a lot of fun, risky throws in college... that would've been picked off in the NFL.

 

We all want our next Jim Kelly. We want someone to believe in. I get it. But I don't think Mayfield is that guy. Just my opinion, but I have stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

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54 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

The Cutler comparison for Rosen is really not the closest 

 

It took Cutler till his SR year to play at a level that Rosen did as a true Freshman 

 

He is way ahead of Cutler at his age honestly. Eli Manning is a closer comp

 

Trent Dilfer loves his football IQ

 

 

 

100% agree. I also don't think Rosen carries himself like Cutler in any way. 

Edited by GunnerBill

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16 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

My best friend avidly wants us to draft Mayfield and I'm all for it

 

but I constantly remind him that as damn good as he is(and I believe it) The history of The NFL says he has a tough road

 

but I wouldn't bet against him 

He does have a tough road. Cowherd even today calls Baker 5-11. Most successful  NFL QB's have been 6-3 and up. Not to say a Russell Wilson can't pop up from time to time, but it is very rare. If Baker was 6-3, all 32 teams would want him. If you take him you are definitely rolling the dice.

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9 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

It's not his lack of intelligence or athletic ability that will be the issue. Mora protected and coddled Josh from the media for his entire time at UCLA. Darnold was just the opposite.  He constantly did local interviews and came across as a down-to-earth kid who just wants to go out and grind. When I use the Jay Cutler comparison it's more about his personality, then his arm strength or throwing ability.

 

I acknowledge and respect that side of the coin. He certainly was more protected... but Sam wasn't the 5* prodigy . Just a uber gifted 4* QB that got redshirted like USC always does

 

Rosen was UCLA... Well see how he handles NFL media pressure 

Edited by Buffalo716

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2 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

I acknowledge and respect that side of the coin. He certainly was more protected... but Sam wasn't the 5* prodigy . Just a uber gifted 4* QB that got redshirted like USC always does

 

Rosen was UCLA... Well see how he handles NFL media pressure 

And that's the problem. Josh has been told and touted since his junior year at St John Bosco he will be the next great NFL qb. He stepped on the Rose Bowl field  with a little bit of an inflated head. And sometimes that showed up in his style of play. yes he had receivers that dropped a ton of balls but it seemed like he did not lift up his fellow players enough. Last year I asked Jim Mora at a Rose Bowl spring event with other local media there about why we rarely see or hear Josh interviewed. He simply change the subject. It was like he was protecting him from something, maybe his own personality or maybe some of the controversial comments he's made. Every player has red flags and there's just something different  about Josh Rosen. I have no doubt Beane will do his homework. 

17 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

I acknowledge and respect that side of the coin. He certainly was more protected... but Sam wasn't the 5* prodigy . Just a uber gifted 4* QB that got redshirted like USC always does

 

Rosen was UCLA... Well see how he handles NFL media pressure 

I just don't think he's going to be able to handle it. I'm not saying he's going to lose it like Ryan Leaf, but he may just decide to do other things and that's where his passion for football has been put up for debate? If someone could convince me that he's 100% vested in the NFL for the long term, then he's the qb you go after at all costs!

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So...Cousins, Keenum and Rudolph?  

 

Yeah, sure.  Why not?

 

Man, just when I thought it would be impossible to start another Cousins thread.....

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