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Cynical

ND loses appeal - Has to vacate wins

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https://www.ndinsider.com/football/notre-dame-football-to-vacate-wins-after-ncaa-denies-appeal/article_88e31422-b28a-11e7-a1a8-63391e5141e7.html

 

I know the NCAA wants schools to self report violations, but every time I read something like this, I ask myself what's the incentive for the school.

 

IIRC, there was a study done a few years that showed schools that self reported got bigger penalties than schools that lawyered up after the NCAA came sniffing around.

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20 minutes ago, Cynical said:

 what's the incentive for the school.

Integrity.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

:lol:

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...integrity?.....the famed Barry Switzer said the only difference between coaching da Cowboys versus Oklahoma was, "I didn't have a salary cap in Oklahoma"..........

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Brian Kelly downplayed his role, #asexpected. the initial announcement was made in November 2016. "It was student-on-student cheating," he told reporters. "This matter has nothing to do with me and my status here."

BK never takes ownership of anything in his program. Watch him blame players after losses, the man was egg hatched.

 

that said, vacating wins is stupid. The games happened. Think of something meaningful, ncaa. I agree with ND’s response. And meanwhile, UNC still hanging out there with no sanctions.

Edited by YoloinOhio

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On ‎2‎/‎13‎/‎2018 at 11:10 PM, YoloinOhio said:

Brian Kelly downplayed his role, #asexpected. the initial announcement was made in November 2016. "It was student-on-student cheating," he told reporters. "This matter has nothing to do with me and my status here."

BK never takes ownership of anything in his program. Watch him blame players after losses, the man was egg hatched.

 

that said, vacating wins is stupid. The games happened. Think of something meaningful, ncaa. I agree with ND’s response. And meanwhile, UNC still hanging out there with no sanctions.

You make an excellent observation when you compare this situation to what happened at UNC. When you consider what the infractions over academic fraud were that occurred for more than a decade in North Carolina and compare what happened at Notre Dame and were self-reported you ask yourself where is the common sense? When the NCAA gets involved in disciplinary issues it is predictably erratic and grotesquely disproportional in its rulings. NCAA is the definition of obtuse. 

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Schools like Notre Dame and Stanford won't be able to compete with dumb dumb schools like Alabama if they don't make some concessions for the football players. They want them to get good grades at one of the top colleges in the country AND spend all day every day lifting weights, training, watching film, etc. Good luck. They didn't go there to play school.

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On ‎2‎/‎15‎/‎2018 at 11:33 PM, kdiggz said:

Schools like Notre Dame and Stanford won't be able to compete with dumb dumb schools like Alabama if they don't make some concessions for the football players. They want them to get good grades at one of the top colleges in the country AND spend all day every day lifting weights, training, watching film, etc. Good luck. They didn't go there to play school.

Alabama is far from a "dum dum" school. It has grown academically in leaps and bound since Coach Saban arrived and delivered hundreds of millions of dollars to the school.  And please, are you trying to say that all Notre Dame players are Fulbright Scholars? :):):)  Sure, ok!

Notre Dame and Stanford were already rich schools. They have won titles, no? Did they do so with a squad full of intellectuals?

 

I recommend patience. At some point down the road, maybe one of these teams will belong on the same field as Alabama. Perhaps if you combined the best players from these 2 schools they could even keep it somewhat close against the Crimson Tide. This might be possible in the future but not today.  Hate as you will but this championship was sweet. Saban runs the best program in the country. This is why our own coach tries to imitate him. I don't blame him.

 

 

ROLL TIDE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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27 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

Alabama is far from a "dum dum" school. It has grown academically in leaps and bound since Coach Saban arrived and delivered hundreds of millions of dollars to the school.  And please, are you trying to say that all Notre Dame players are Fulbright Scholars? :):):)  Sure, ok!

Notre Dame and Stanford were already rich schools. They have won titles, no? Did they do so with a squad full of intellectuals?

 

I recommend patience. At some point down the road, maybe one of these teams will belong on the same field as Alabama. Perhaps if you combined the best players from these 2 schools they could even keep it somewhat close against the Crimson Tide. This might be possible in the future but not today.  Hate as you will but this championship was sweet. Saban runs the best program in the country. This is why our own coach tries to imitate him. I don't blame him.

 

 

ROLL TIDE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Right, that was my point. I don't think all of ND's players are smart enough to be there so they either need to help them pass (cheat) or they would have to go to a school with lower academic standards. How many players are smart enough to go to a school like ND or Stanford PLUS are amazing athletes? Not many. It's usually one or the other

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5 hours ago, kdiggz said:

Right, that was my point. I don't think all of ND's players are smart enough to be there so they either need to help them pass (cheat) or they would have to go to a school with lower academic standards. How many players are smart enough to go to a school like ND or Stanford PLUS are amazing athletes? Not many. It's usually one or the other

I  see what you mean and totally agree.

 

My daughter is a Dartmouth Grad. She would fit in just fine intellectually with students from Stanford or ND. Now, she would also probably be in the top 1% of their football teams. Not every college athlete is Ryan Fitzpatrick.

 

I'm not sure what the answer is.

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On 2/17/2018 at 1:29 PM, Bill from NYC said:

I  see what you mean and totally agree.

 

My daughter is a Dartmouth Grad. She would fit in just fine intellectually with students from Stanford or ND. Now, she would also probably be in the top 1% of their football teams. Not every college athlete is Ryan Fitzpatrick.

 

I'm not sure what the answer is.

The answer is to start thinking of these college teams like the ‘club’ teams they are. Hardly any of the basketball players even stick around to get a degree! How can anyone even call these college teams anymore?

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Posted (edited)
On 2/17/2018 at 10:27 AM, kdiggz said:

Right, that was my point. I don't think all of ND's players are smart enough to be there so they either need to help them pass (cheat) or they would have to go to a school with lower academic standards. How many players are smart enough to go to a school like ND or Stanford PLUS are amazing athletes? Not many. It's usually one or the other

 

As someone who went to school there for 7 years and has had relatively close contact with the team in the years after I can say that there are maybe a handful of kids who fall under that umbrella; I even tutored some of them. The football team is absolutely part of the school and cheating is not common. Sure, there are some pretty cake classes that they take, like sports management or current jazz (both fun classes), but I studied with those kids and they actually did the work.  

 

Unlike many other big D1 schools where football players pledge frats so they live off-campus and walk around  like celebrities, we don't have a greek system.  Football players live in the dorms with everyone else and aren't inaccessible so it's not as easy for them to get away with cheating or taking illegal benefits. The school is academically competitive and believe me most of those rich kids wouldn't bat an eye to report someone screwing up the curve for a class. 

Edited by ndirish1978

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On 2/18/2018 at 8:34 PM, SoCal Deek said:

The answer is to start thinking of these college teams like the ‘club’ teams they are. Hardly any of the basketball players even stick around to get a degree! How can anyone even call these college teams anymore?

Exactly, despite the occasional exception, education has absolutely nothing to do with the purpose of big time college athletics. Academia will be a much improved and more honest place once they are willing to admit this. 

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