MrEpsYtown Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 40 minutes ago, reddogblitz said: In that playoff game, Teddy was 17 for 24 for 146 yards and 0 TDs. Come on man, You'd crucify Hotrod for a performance like that. In fact we are for his 134 yard performance. I mean we can agree to disagree. My overall point is that the numbers do not tell the entire story. In fact numbers in football can sometimes mean very little. Remember all of those Broncos 1000 yard backs after Terell Davis? Remember the numbers Fitzpatrick put up? Bridgewater is a quarterback and Tyrod is not. They both have a bunch of question marks, but the bottom line is teams shut down Tyrod by making him a "quarterback." Watching him miss wide open guys and fail to make throws my high school quarterback can make is the problem. He also manages to accomplish all this while taking sacks for holding the ball too long and running around in circles. He only got hurt in Jacksonville because he wouldn't throw the dang ball. The guy is just not good. I wish he was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 8 hours ago, Hebert19 said: If cousins is gone there are no upgrades in FA. And we are far from a QB away so o can't see us pissing away draft picks. So yup. Tt may be best option. Or his long lost cousin? If AJ McCarron wins his case he is a upgrade over Taylor. I would rather have McCarron over Cousins. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsfanAZ Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 I dont think any OC can make Taylor throw the ball. Taylor should be traded or cut. Every defense he played against all said just contain him and make him be a QB.....what else is there to say? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 7 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said: I mean we can agree to disagree. My overall point is that the numbers do not tell the entire story. In fact numbers in football can sometimes mean very little. Remember all of those Broncos 1000 yard backs after Terell Davis? Remember the numbers Fitzpatrick put up? Bridgewater is a quarterback and Tyrod is not. They both have a bunch of question marks, but the bottom line is teams shut down Tyrod by making him a "quarterback." Watching him miss wide open guys and fail to make throws my high school quarterback can make is the problem. He also manages to accomplish all this while taking sacks for holding the ball too long and running around in circles. He only got hurt in Jacksonville because he wouldn't throw the dang ball. The guy is just not good. I wish he was. all of this bs hyperbowl is really part of the problem and why so many fight over TT. Exactly stuff like this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEpsYtown Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 8 minutes ago, John from Hemet said: all of this bs hyperbowl is really part of the problem and why so many fight over TT. Exactly stuff like this I don't know man. Am I exaggerating, perhaps slightly, but really not much. I just think the problem is that so many people cling to this idea that he is a good quarterback and for the other half he clearly is not. Numbers people want to defend those numbers, but anybody who watches the game in depth can see that he is terrible. I think the fact that people can honestly defend his play is ludicrous and I think that is where there is a divide. It's just indefensible. He simply can't play quarterback from the pocket. Teams want guys who can, or have shown the potential to do so. Tyrod never will and that's why I think he will have a tough time finding a job and why I don't think a trade is possibly. It's why Alex Smith fetched a good corner and third. It's why AJ McCarron will probably fetch a 2nd. It's why Teddy Bridgewater will probably get a contract he doesnt necessarily deserve and why people keep paying guys like Josh McCown. It's even why guys like Blaine Gabbert continue to get shots. Tyrod is just not a good quarterback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 (edited) 9 hours ago, Hebert19 said: Unkess we can trade him behind the scenes ala Smith. Here's why I think this is the case. 1. Cousins is not coming here. He will end up in Denver or NYC. 2. Cost to trade up will be too high. Especially if they aren't sold that one of these guys are the next elite AN. 3. We have more holes than qb. If we trade up we would put a rookie out there with a ****ty team and we know how that turns out. 4. Bradford and Bridgewater are NOT upgrades. Before wasting money on them we have to ask. Are they really better. Draft well...sign some people to plug holes and this team will make playoffs again and have more money and options next year for draft. That's my take... I agree with two of your four points. #1 seems likely to be true, as does the first half of #3. Yeah, we have more holes than QB, and we know how putting a rookie out there with a ****ty team turns out. It turns out in many many different possible ways. One of the ways is the way it turned out when they did it with Troy Aikman and Peyton Manning. The way it turns out is sometimes awful, sometimes sensational and everywhere in between. The trade up cost won't be too high. It'll be very high. There's a difference. If one of these guys turns out to be a Goff or a Wentz, it'll be easily worth it. Going up and paying a whole lot for a good QB is the reason they got all those high picks in the first place. Bradford is absolutely an upgrade - without the slightest question - if he stays even reasonably healthy. I don't have enough confidence in that happening to want it to happen. But yeah, he's better than Tyrod. And Bridgewater isn't yet but stands an excellent chance of being better reasonably quickly. Of course, being better than Tyrod isn't good enough. We need more. But Bridgewater could easily turn into a top ten guy. There's no reason to think he's showed anything near his ceiling yet. More, there are other extremely reasonable options, such as picking a bridge QB who would fit the Bills offensive system in ways that Tyrod does not and never has. Again and again we hear from Tyrod's fans that the Bills should have changed the offense to suit his talents. And yet we heard from McDermott and Beane that there is a requirement for playing QB for them that Tyrod shows no sign of ever achieving. You have to be able to be efficient playing from the pocket. So while Tyrod is a better QB than guys like McCown or Moore or Fitz, they fit the system they are trying to implement for the long run and Tyrod does not. And bringing in a guy like them saves money and brings in a QB mentor for our young draftee besides. Letting Tyrod go will cost this team $8.6 against the salary cap. Whereas keeping him and playing him for only one year would cost us $23 mill against the cap, about $18 mill in 2018 and $5.6 mill in 2019 after he's on a different roster. For a guy who doesn't fulfill the requirement they want of a guy who can play from the pocket. Edited February 1, 2018 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEpsYtown Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said: So while Tyrod is a better QB than guys like McCown or Moore or Fitz, they fit the system they are trying to implement for the long run and Tyrod does not. And save money and bring in a QB mentor for our young draftee besides. Agreed. All of those guys would probably be better bridge QBs with the new system being installed. Honestly, though people like to defend Tyrod with numbers, but if you look at the numbers, a 38 year old McCown was better across the board in 2 less games. Is he better than Moore and Fitz, yeah probably but is he even close to the Bradfords of the world? I don't think so. Edited February 1, 2018 by MrEpsYtown Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jr1 Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 he holds 6 team records and people act like he's the worst QB ever https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyrod_Taylor#Buffalo_Bills_records 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, reddogblitz said: In that playoff game, Teddy was 17 for 24 for 146 yards and 0 TDs. Come on man, You'd crucify Hotrod for a performance like that. In fact we are for his 134 yard performance. You're right, wildly unimpressive. But much much less acceptable in a 7th year QB than in an 2nd year guy. That's the difference. Edited February 1, 2018 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transplantbillsfan Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 56 minutes ago, greeneblitz said: Yeah right, I'd bet money that the coaching staff puts near 100% of our problems on offense on the fact that Tyrod Taylor was under center, they can't drop him fast enough, Nathan Peterman will start before they bring Taylor back. However we all know what should and likely will happen, they'll draft a QB at some point in round one and go into the season with a expectation that the rookie will start on day one, they'll likely have some type of fake "competition" in training camp, but anybody that follows football knows the normal drill, short of having a franchise QB on the roster. You'd lose that bet... you realize Dennison was fired, right? 40 minutes ago, Call_Of_Ktulu said: If AJ McCarron wins his case he is a upgrade over Taylor. I would rather have McCarron over Cousins. What tells you McCarron is an upgrade over Taylor? All 79 career passes? 41 minutes ago, BillsfanAZ said: I dont think any OC can make Taylor throw the ball. Taylor should be traded or cut. Every defense he played against all said just contain him and make him be a QB.....what else is there to say? Then why didn't every defense he played against just contain him and make him be a QB 22 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said: I don't know man. Am I exaggerating, perhaps slightly, but really not much. I just think the problem is that so many people cling to this idea that he is a good quarterback and for the other half he clearly is not. Numbers people want to defend those numbers, but anybody who watches the game in depth can see that he is terrible. I think the fact that people can honestly defend his play is ludicrous and I think that is where there is a divide. It's just indefensible. He simply can't play quarterback from the pocket. Teams want guys who can, or have shown the potential to do so. Tyrod never will and that's why I think he will have a tough time finding a job and why I don't think a trade is possibly. It's why Alex Smith fetched a good corner and third. It's why AJ McCarron will probably fetch a 2nd. It's why Teddy Bridgewater will probably get a contract he doesnt necessarily deserve and why people keep paying guys like Josh McCown. It's even why guys like Blaine Gabbert continue to get shots. Tyrod is just not a good quarterback. Nonono... John was right. It was an idiotic exaggeration Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transplantbillsfan Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 25 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said: I agree with two of your four points. #1 seems likely to be true, as does the first half of #3. Yeah, we have more holes than QB, and we know how putting a rookie out there with a ****ty team turns out. It turns out in many many different possible ways. One of the ways is the way it turned out when they did it with Troy Aikman and Peyton Manning. The way it turns out is sometimes awful, sometimes sensational and everywhere in between. The trade up cost won't be too high. It'll be very high. There's a difference. If one of these guys turns out to be a Goff or a Wentz, it'll be easily worth it. Going up and paying a whole lot for a good QB is the reason they got all those high picks in the first place. Bradford is absolutely an upgrade - without the slightest question - if he stays even reasonably healthy. I don't have enough confidence in that happening to want it to happen. But yeah, he's better than Tyrod. And Bridgewater isn't yet but stands an excellent chance of being better reasonably quickly. Of course, being better than Tyrod isn't good enough. We need more. But Bridgewater could easily turn into a top ten guy. There's no reason to think he's showed anything near his ceiling yet. More, there are other extremely reasonable options, such as picking a bridge QB who would fit the Bills offensive system in ways that Tyrod does not and never has. Again and again we hear from Tyrod's fans that the Bills should have changed the offense to suit his talents. And yet we heard from McDermott and Beane that there is a requirement for playing QB for them that Tyrod shows no sign of ever achieving. You have to be able to be efficient playing from the pocket. So while Tyrod is a better QB than guys like McCown or Moore or Fitz, they fit the system they are trying to implement for the long run and Tyrod does not. And bringing in a guy like them saves money and brings in a QB mentor for our young draftee besides. Letting Tyrod go will cost this team $8.6 against the salary cap. Whereas keeping him and playing him for only one year would cost us $23 mill against the cap, about $18 mill in 2018 and $5.6 mill in 2019 after he's on a different roster. For a guy who doesn't fulfill the requirement they want of a guy who can play from the pocket. Doubling down I see... still honestly think it's only a 5% chance we retain Taylor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 18 minutes ago, jr1 said: he holds 6 team records and people act like he's the worst QB ever https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyrod_Taylor#Buffalo_Bills_records It is truly amazing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 11 minutes ago, jr1 said: he holds 6 team records and people act like he's the worst QB ever https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyrod_Taylor#Buffalo_Bills_records all of this bs hyperbowl is really part of the problem and why so many fight over TT. Exactly stuff like this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 53 minutes ago, MrEpsYtown said: I mean we can agree to disagree. My overall point is that the numbers do not tell the entire story. In fact numbers in football can sometimes mean very little. Remember all of those Broncos 1000 yard backs after Terell Davis? Remember the numbers Fitzpatrick put up? I agree with you on this. However, you did bring up the playoff game. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 (edited) 20 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said: Doubling down I see... still honestly think it's only a 5% chance we retain Taylor Yup, I'm still realistic. Hard to understand why anyone would disagree about a coach who replaced the guy with a 5th round rookie. Laugh on, Captain Obsession. And by the way, I love the emoticons. I hear they're huge with the twelve-year old girls. Edited February 1, 2018 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ol Dirty B Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 I'm not a hater of him by any stretch. I just don't see him back in buffalo. After benching him for Peterman then throwing him in there in the second half for no reason, after the coaching staff made one of the worst decisions in the history of coaching. I hope he ends up with talent around him somewhere and can be productive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Anyone saying any quarterback does or doesn’t fit the system the Bills will be running are nuts. And wrong. We have no idea what system they will be running. I doubt McDermott, Daboll and Beane themselves have finalized an offense yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 Just now, Ol Dirty B said: I'm not a hater of him by any stretch. I just don't see him back in buffalo. After benching him for Peterman then throwing him in there in the second half for no reason, after the coaching staff made one of the worst decisions in the history of coaching. I hope he ends up with talent around him somewhere and can be productive. I read this EVERYWHERE about how they benched him in week 12 so that means they have no confidence in him and he is done. Maybe Coach McDermott, after seeing how the season played out and the won loss record etc, changed his mind? Maybe the new OC likes him? It's easy for us to say cut him and bring in some rookie or Fitz or heck anybody. But when every win and loss goes on your permanent record, you may think differently about it. Coaches like to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyC81 Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 9 hours ago, Jamie Muellers Ghost said: If I was Tyrod I would ask for a trade or release. Actually what I’ve been thinking. They keep screwing him over. He should just tell them to stick it. He’d get another starting job. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ol Dirty B Posted February 1, 2018 Share Posted February 1, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, reddogblitz said: I read this EVERYWHERE about how they benched him in week 12 so that means they have no confidence in him and he is done. Maybe Coach McDermott, after seeing how the season played out and the won loss record etc, changed his mind? Maybe the new OC likes him? It's easy for us to say cut him and bring in some rookie or Fitz or heck anybody. But when every win and loss goes on your permanent record, you may think differently about it. Coaches like to win. It is a possibility I'm not denying that. I actually hope Tyrod isn't here more for Tyrod rather than the Bills. They've treated him like ****, and I like the guy as a person and player. He's as proven as the coach that many have collectively chosen to jam their heads up his ass in unison and proclaim a prophet. Edited February 1, 2018 by Ol Dirty B Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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