Changes coming to Bills front office?

[oldmanfan]

 

His was a rhetorical question which I answered anyway.

 

I have covered this a million times here. If you are too busy to go back and read the thread then watch the video for yourself where the owner of the Bills couldn't say who will make the decisions for the Bills in the draft room.

And again he answered it. You just didn't like the answer.

[Bill_with_it]

 

Pegula said it was a collaborative process. You are twisting that into the idea that Whaley doesn't have final say over the 53, and why? I have no idea, since I posted a link in this very thread where Pegula, Whaley, and McDermott all say, in plain English, that Whaley has final say over the 53.

 

http://www.newyorkupstate.com/buffalo-bills/index.ssf/2017/01/doug_whaley_sean_mcdermott_weigh_in_on_who_has_control_of_buffalo_bills_roster.html

 

So there's no need to speculate over who would break the tie in the altogether unlikely scenario that the GM doesn't agree with the HC on who to pick.

 

It's Whaley...that's what having final say over the 53 means.

 

Arguing semantics about this is silliness when it's in print.

 

Lastly, try following a discussion on occasion instead of being so quick to throw darts. I mean, I don't mind refuting silly accusations (like, for example, that I called the owner a liar--I'm assuming that's what "anoiar" means --or misinformed), but it kind of makes you look silly when you go in guns blazing against what amounts to nothing more than a straw man.

Nice article from Jan 13.

Know something else that hasnt changed since Jan 13:

Communications depart wrong.

Also, I hear we dont have an image consultant because we didnt have one on the 13 when that article was published.

Here is one from yeaterday from the owners mouth:

 

 

On Tuesday, Pegula said the Bills' decision on whom to select at No. 10:

"It's just like everything else I think most businesses do in their life. If somebody feels more strongly about something than somebody else, then maybe you lean in that direction."

Does the Pronoun somebody equate to the proper noun Doug Whaley. It could, however it could also mean Sean, Monos, Terry, Kim, or Russ. He said what he said yesterday. Im sorry if it doesnt agree with your opinion or an old article.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

And again he answered it. You just didn't like the answer.

 

 

....does he have to say a damn thing or anything?.....he's not Jones or Snyder, camera hounds like Chucky Schumer...add in the mindless Jeb Clampett York or Jr Spanos who INHERITED Daddy's teams......has Paul Allen or Bidwell Jr been in the news lately?.....Kraft is ok but he's grinding his axe with Goober Goodell over Deflategate......but he is classy......

[Mr. WEO]

 

Pegula said it was a collaborative process. You are twisting that into the idea that Whaley doesn't have final say over the 53, and why? I have no idea, since I posted a link in this very thread where Pegula, Whaley, and McDermott all say, in plain English, that Whaley has final say over the 53.

 

http://www.newyorkupstate.com/buffalo-bills/index.ssf/2017/01/doug_whaley_sean_mcdermott_weigh_in_on_who_has_control_of_buffalo_bills_roster.html

 

So there's no need to speculate over who would break the tie in the altogether unlikely scenario that the GM doesn't agree with the HC on who to pick.

 

It's Whaley...that's what having final say over the 53 means.

 

Arguing semantics about this is silliness when it's in print.

 

Lastly, try following a discussion on occasion instead of being so quick to throw darts. I mean, I don't mind refuting silly accusations (like, for example, that I called the owner a liar--I'm assuming that's what "anoiar" means --or misinformed), but it kind of makes you look silly when you go in guns blazing against what amounts to nothing more than a straw man.

 

That would be a meaningful distinction if you believe Whaley could overrule a pick McD insisted on (this may be hypothetical). I don't think that would stand.

[thebandit27]

Nice article from Jan 13.

Know something else that hasnt changed since Jan 13:

Communications depart wrong.

Also, I hear we dont have an image consultant because we didnt have one on the 13 when that article was published.

Here is one from yeaterday from the owners mouth:

 

 

On Tuesday, Pegula said the Bills' decision on whom to select at No. 10:

"It's just like everything else I think most businesses do in their life. If somebody feels more strongly about something than somebody else, then maybe you lean in that direction."

Does the Pronoun somebody equate to the proper noun Doug Whaley. It could, however it could also mean Sean, Monos, Terry, Kim, or Russ. He said what he said yesterday. Im sorry if it doesnt agree with your opinion or an old article.

Good grief.

 

For someone that was upset about others' apparently "twisting" the narrative, you sure can Chubby Checker your way across the dance floor!

 

You've taken quotes from all 3 of the owner, GM, and HC that made it crystal clear that Whaley has final say over the 53-man roster and chosen to obfuscate the situation because the owner called the draft a collaborative process.

 

Simple 4th grade logic could tell anyone that the guy with final say over the 53 will be the tie breaker in the event of a disagreement that isn't going to take place.

 

That you need it spelled out so blatantly shouldn't surprise me based on some previous interaction, but I am often amazed by the strangest things.

 

I also find it beyond hilarious that you're referencing a change in the communications dept as some type of evidence that they've changed the personnel hierarchy since January

 

Sorry, I'm inclined to believe all 3 of Pegula, McDermott, and Whaley that Whaley has final say over the 53. Especially since literally every piece of team-provided information supports that notion.

 

What's more likely: that what every member of the front office says is true, or that some idea that you've cooked-up based on a non-commital response is true?

 

Sorry if that doesn't agree with your conspiracy theory.

[oldmanfan]

 

 

....does he have to say a damn thing or anything?.....he's not Jones or Snyder, camera hounds like Chucky Schumer...add in the mindless Jeb Clampett York or Jr Spanos who INHERITED Daddy's teams......has Paul Allen or Bidwell Jr been in the news lately?.....Kraft is ok but he's grinding his axe with Goober Goodell over Deflategate......but he is classy......

You and I are of similar minds old time. Have been for years now.

[thebandit27]

 

That would be a meaningful distinction if you believe Whaley could overrule a pick McD insisted on (this may be hypothetical). I don't think that would stand.

I think he theoretically COULD, but I sincerely doubt that he would.

[Mr. WEO]

I think he theoretically COULD, but I sincerely doubt that he would.

 

I think there is zero chance it would be allowed. Plus, Whaley wouldn't have the stomach for such a bold move.

[Bill_with_it]

Good grief.

 

For someone that was upset about others' apparently "twisting" the narrative, you sure can Chubby Checker your way across the dance floor!

 

You've taken quotes from all 3 of the owner, GM, and HC that made it crystal clear that Whaley has final say over the 53-man roster and chosen to obfuscate the situation because the owner called the draft a collaborative process.

 

Simple 4th grade logic could tell anyone that the guy with final say over the 53 will be the tie breaker in the event of a disagreement that isn't going to take place.

 

That you need it spelled out so blatantly shouldn't surprise me based on some previous interaction, but I am often amazed by the strangest things.

 

I also find it beyond hilarious that you're referencing a change in the communications dept as some type of evidence that they've changed the personnel hierarchy since January

 

Sorry, I'm inclined to believe all 3 of Pegula, McDermott, and Whaley that Whaley has final say over the 53. Especially since literally every piece of team-provided information supports that notion.

 

What's more likely: that what every member of the front office says is true, or that some idea that you've cooked-up based on a non-commital response is true?

 

Sorry if that doesn't agree with your conspiracy theory.

You are completely wrong. I took a quote from the owner when asked directly about the situation you are refering too. The owners mouth stated these words yesterday not two months ago.

On Tuesday, Pegula said the Bills' decision on whom to select at No. 10 overall in the upcoming NFL draft will be a "group effort," adding, "It's just like everything else I think most businesses do in their life. If somebody feels more strongly about something than somebody else, then maybe you lean in that direction."

 

 

The owner stated Rex and Whaley were safe two years ago. I guess since he stated it two years ago Rex is still safe. Things change its clear that Whaley has no complete control over the roster as you think he does. The owner made that completely clear. Doug Whaley has a name and it isnt "somebody". Keep your chin up and quit with the insults.

Edited March 29, 2017 by Bill_with_it

[jeffismagic]

Good grief.

 

For someone that was upset about others' apparently "twisting" the narrative, you sure can Chubby Checker your way across the dance floor!

 

You've taken quotes from all 3 of the owner, GM, and HC that made it crystal clear that Whaley has final say over the 53-man roster and chosen to obfuscate the situation because the owner called the draft a collaborative process.

 

Simple 4th grade logic could tell anyone that the guy with final say over the 53 will be the tie breaker in the event of a disagreement that isn't going to take place.

 

That you need it spelled out so blatantly shouldn't surprise me based on some previous interaction, but I am often amazed by the strangest things.

 

I also find it beyond hilarious that you're referencing a change in the communications dept as some type of evidence that they've changed the personnel hierarchy since January

 

Sorry, I'm inclined to believe all 3 of Pegula, McDermott, and Whaley that Whaley has final say over the 53. Especially since literally every piece of team-provided information supports that notion.

 

What's more likely: that what every member of the front office says is true, or that some idea that you've cooked-up based on a non-commital response is true?

 

Sorry if that doesn't agree with your conspiracy theory.

 

Let's step away from the Bills and see what "control of the 53 man roster" means in real life for other teams.

 

Here are similar Browns mentions of control of 53 man roster for the GM and game day roster by the coach.

 

Haslam promoted Farmer from assistant general manager to GM. Farmer immediately took control of the team’s football operations and will have final say on its 53-man roster. New coach Mike Pettine will have final say on the 46-man, game-day roster, Haslam said.

 

http://www.ohio.com/sports/browns/new-browns-gm-ray-farmer-has-control-of-53-man-roster-will-report-directly-to-owner-jimmy-haslam-in-aftermath-of-stunning-shakeup-1.465923

 

Ok, so far so good.

 

Now let's see how Farmer's "control of the 53 man roster" worked in the draft room in 2014.

 

Homeless man convinces Browns owner to draft Johnny Football!

 

[Rico]

Simple question: do you believe anything that comes from OBD?

If Pegs had done the right thing and completely cleaned house after 2014? Absolutely. With the same chumps and losers still running the team? Absolutely not. The lifers and the people they hired don't deserve the benefit of the doubt after SO much failure. People can post all the links and quotes coming out of OBD that they want, but it's all irrelevant to the big picture. Now, if Pegs fires Lil Doug, that's different, as actions speak louder than words. The action that would speak the loudest though would be to finally start winning. Until then, take anything & everything they say with a large grain of salt. Edited March 29, 2017 by Rico

[thebandit27]

You are completely wrong. I took a quote from the owner when asked directly about the situation you are refering too. The owners mouth stated these words yesterday not two months ago.

On Tuesday, Pegula said the Bills' decision on whom to select at No. 10 overall in the upcoming NFL draft will be a "group effort," adding, "It's just like everything else I think most businesses do in their life. If somebody feels more strongly about something than somebody else, then maybe you lean in that direction."

 

 

The owner stated Rex and Whaley were safe two years ago. I guess since he stated it two years ago Rex is still safe. Things change its clear that Whaley has no complete control over the roster as you think he does. The owner made that completely clear. Doug Whaley has a name and it isnt "somebody". Keep your chin up and quit with the insults.

Control over the 53 has been covered--ignore it if you do choose.

 

One thing has been made clear by all 3 men; the other is nothing more than speculation on your part.

 

That's really the extent of the discussion: should we believe direct quotes from Pegula/Whaley/McDermott or your speculation?

 

Now let's take a step back and remember that this debate is all based on a hypothetical disagreement that is very unlikely to occur in the first place. So I suppose if you'd like to theorize about an unlikely hypothetical based on a non-commital response, then have at it; I won't stop you.

 

As for insults, well, did you expect that an accusation that I called the owner a liar to be met with sugar and spice?

 

Let's step away from the Bills and see what "control of the 53 man roster" means in real life for other teams.

 

Here are similar Browns mentions of control of 53 man roster for the GM and game day roster by the coach.

 

Haslam promoted Farmer from assistant general manager to GM. Farmer immediately took control of the teams football operations and will have final say on its 53-man roster. New coach Mike Pettine will have final say on the 46-man, game-day roster, Haslam said.

 

http://www.ohio.com/sports/browns/new-browns-gm-ray-farmer-has-control-of-53-man-roster-will-report-directly-to-owner-jimmy-haslam-in-aftermath-of-stunning-shakeup-1.465923

 

Ok, so far so good.

 

Now let's see how Farmer's "control of the 53 man roster" worked in the draft room in 2014.

 

Homeless man convinces Browns owner to draft Johnny Football!

 

If the point here is that an owner can always overrule his staff, well, didn't we already know that?

[Fan in Chicago]

 

His was a rhetorical question which I answered anyway.

 

I have covered this a million times here. If you are too busy to go back and read the thread then watch the video for yourself where the owner of the Bills couldn't say who will make the decisions for the Bills in the draft room.

I watched the video before my posts today. He answered that question. You claim he didn't because it won't fit your narrative.

[jeffismagic]

I watched the video before my posts today. He answered that question. You claim he didn't because it won't fit your narrative.

 

Very well.

 

When asked if Whaley would make the call in the draft room or break a tie if Whaley and McDermott disagreed Terry said:

 

“Obviously when I say it’s a group effort, it’s just like everything else I think most businesses do in their life. If somebody feels more strongly about something than somebody else then maybe you lean in that direction,” Pegula said.

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/Bills-owner-Terry-Pegula-delivers-a-unifying-message/e9f6ce92-103a-46a0-b9e0-31f5fbded5ea

 

Who is the one that leans in the direction if someone feels strongly?

 

I think it's quite clear that it's the Pegulas.

Edited March 29, 2017 by jeffismagic

[Bill_with_it]

Control over the 53 has been covered--ignore it if you do choose.

 

One thing has been made clear by all 3 men; the other is nothing more than speculation on your part.

 

That's really the extent of the discussion: should we believe direct quotes from Pegula/Whaley/McDermott or your speculation?

 

Now let's take a step back and remember that this debate is all based on a hypothetical disagreement that is very unlikely to occur in the first place. So I suppose if you'd like to theorize about an unlikely hypothetical based on a non-commital response, then have at it; I won't stop you.

 

As for insults, well, did you expect that an accusation that I called the owner a liar to be met with sugar and spice?

There is no debate Terry stated that with regard to the number 10 pick:

"If somebody feels more strongly about something than somebody else then maybe you lean in that direction". Will the tenth overall selection be on the 53? Yes. Can somebody be someone other than Doug Whaley? Yes.

If these two questions were yes then there is no possible way that you can come to the conclusion that Doug Whaley maintains the 53 complete control, because he doesnt. It was made clear to everyone except apparently you and a few others yesterday. If you choose not to believe the owner thats your fault.

Edited March 29, 2017 by Bill_with_it

[oldmanfan]

 

Very well.

 

When asked if Whaley would make the call in the draft room or break a tie if Whaley and McDermott disagreed Terry said:

 

Obviously when I say its a group effort, its just like everything else I think most businesses do in their life. If somebody feels more strongly about something than somebody else then maybe you lean in that direction, Pegula said.

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/Bills-owner-Terry-Pegula-delivers-a-unifying-message/e9f6ce92-103a-46a0-b9e0-31f5fbded5ea

 

Who is the one that leans in the direction if someone feels strongly?

 

I think it's quite clear that it's the Pegulas.

As I said, he answered the question. You claimed hecdidn't

[BUFFALOKIE]

As Whaley showed at his infamous press conference, he is not sure what his duties are (other than to execute Pegula's orders), or anyone else in the organization. He claimed to be out of the loop on the Ryan firing, and didn't know the reason for it.

If McDermott is bringing in personnel from Carolina to help straighten out the mess here, I am all for it. Whaley should have been axed when Ryan was let go.

I never saw this "infamous" press conference, but it occurs to me that "don't know" and "not in the loop" should not be taken at face value. It's ludicrous to believ DW didnt/does not know the truthfull answer to those questions and what his role was/is. The man is not a dummy. He took/takes it on the chin because things didnt/dont go well. I have the inclination that maybe he was shielding some one else. Maybe he just took the high road instead of throwing others under bus. Maybe he deflected/absorbed other unwanted attention. Edited March 29, 2017 by BUFFALOKIE

[thebandit27]

There is no debate Terry stated that with regard to the number 10 pick:

"If somebody feels more strongly about something than somebody else then maybe you lean in that direction". Will the tenth overall selection be on the 53? Yes. Can somebody be someone other than Doug Whaley? Yes.

If these two questions were yes then there is no possible way that you can come to the conclusion that Doug Whaley maintains the 53 complete control, because he doesnt. It was made clear to everyone except apparently you and a few others yesterday. If you choose not to believe the owner thats your fault.

Your logic - unclear response clearly means that what was said by all 3 men involved in the process isn't true

 

My logic - very clear response that is the same from all 3 men involved clearly means that what they said is true

 

I think we're done here.

[Bill_with_it]

Your logic - unclear response clearly means that what was said by all 3 men involved in the process isn't true

 

My logic - very clear response that is the same from all 3 men involved clearly means that what they said is true

 

I think we're done here.

You are correct we are done. Your logic means that the Bills first rounder wont make the 53, or somebody exclusively means Doug Whaley, or Terry is a liar. Thats your ill founded logic.

[yungmack]

 

Very well.

 

When asked if Whaley would make the call in the draft room or break a tie if Whaley and McDermott disagreed Terry said:

 

“Obviously when I say it’s a group effort, it’s just like everything else I think most businesses do in their life. If somebody feels more strongly about something than somebody else then maybe you lean in that direction,” Pegula said.

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/Bills-owner-Terry-Pegula-delivers-a-unifying-message/e9f6ce92-103a-46a0-b9e0-31f5fbded5ea

 

Who is the one that leans in the direction if someone feels strongly?

 

I think it's quite clear that it's the Pegulas.

And that's fine, you think it's Pegs. Some around here think it's Whaley. Some believe it's McD. Fact is, you really don't know and neither do I.