Trump and Russia

[K-9]

18 hours ago, DC Tom said:

 

And who defines "hostile?"

We define hostile as a nation and as individuals every day. I define Russian trolling in the form of creating fake accounts, fake news, and fake events in order to drive wedges between disparate groups in the US in order to sow discord and confrontation as hostile. 

7 hours ago, GG said:

 

And how would social networks do that without tying into government's databases to identify the bad actors?

They could start by vetting the material posted; perhaps creating a grace period to allow for that. I don't pretend to have the answers and I realize it's a heck of a technological challenge but it has to start somewhere. 

[Deranged Rhino]

45 minutes ago, K-9 said:

We define hostile as a nation and as individuals every day.

 

But "we" don't. The government does. And even they are divided on most of those classifications.

 

Which brings us back to the initial problem, no matter how you slice it the solution you're suggesting ends in an outside party determining for the individual what material they can and cannot read/disseminate. 

[Deranged Rhino]

Wow... I mean, I know she's trying to move books but:

Brazile blasts 'incompetence' in response to email hack at Wasserman Schultz-led DNC

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/11/07/brazile-blasts-incompetence-in-response-to-email-hack-at-wasserman-schultz-led-dnc.html

[DC Tom]

4 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said:

Wow... I mean, I know she's trying to move books but:

Brazile blasts 'incompetence' in response to email hack at Wasserman Schultz-led DNC

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/11/07/brazile-blasts-incompetence-in-response-to-email-hack-at-wasserman-schultz-led-dnc.html

 

That's the nearest I've seen a Democrat come to taking responsibility for the Democratic Party since...ever.

[Deranged Rhino]

Good piece on the VIPS memo, both sides shown:

 

CIA DIRECTOR MET ADVOCATE OF DISPUTED DNC HACK THEORY — AT TRUMP’S REQUEST

Edited November 7, 2017 by Deranged Rhino

[K-9]

2 hours ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

But "we" don't. The government does. And even they are divided on most of those classifications.

 

Which brings us back to the initial problem, no matter how you slice it the solution you're suggesting ends in an outside party determining for the individual what material they can and cannot read/disseminate. 

Yes, “we” do. The Kremlin hiring trolls to work out of a troll farm to impersonate Americans with disparate views on highly charged subjects with no other motive than to fan the flames of discord and conflict is a hostile act. I will not be convinced otherwise. Russia is not our friend in this world and never has been. We had a window before Putin came into power but that opportunity is long gone.

 

About the initial problem, again, I am suggesting no no such thing. Those in control of the social media platforms are not an outside party in the least. They have a responsibility to the public trust and better internal controls can be put in place to vet the sources using their platforms. 

 

Im out. But thanks for the give and take.

[3rdnlng]

4 hours ago, Deranged Rhino said:

Wow... I mean, I know she's trying to move books but:

Brazile blasts 'incompetence' in response to email hack at Wasserman Schultz-led DNC

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/11/07/brazile-blasts-incompetence-in-response-to-email-hack-at-wasserman-schultz-led-dnc.html

From your link:

 

"Brazile asked aloud why agents didn’t directly call Wasserman Schultz, considering she was a member of Congress. She also writes that Eric Holder, the U.S. attorney general at the time, stopped her at then-President Obama’s birthday party in August 2016 to say that the DNC “was not very responsive” to the FBI inquires."

 

Hmmmm.

 

DONNA BRAZILE THINKS ERIC HOLDER WAS AG IN AUGUST OF 2016.

Edited November 8, 2017 by 3rdnlng
Clarity.

[DC Tom]

Just now, K-9 said:

Yes, “we” do. The Kremlin hiring trolls to work out of a troll farm to impersonate Americans with disparate views on highly charged subjects with no other motive than to fan the flames of discord and conflict is a hostile act. I will not be convinced otherwise. Russia is not our friend in this world and never has been. We had a window before Putin came into power but that opportunity is long gone.

 

About the initial problem, again, I am suggesting no no such thing. Those in control of the social media platforms are not an outside party in the least. They have a responsibility to the public trust and better internal controls can be put in place to vet the sources using their platforms. 

 

Im out. But thanks for the give and take.

 

"We" can't even decide if it is right now, amongst ourselves.  And the country as a whole can't even decide what color a dress is on the internet.  So good luck with that.

[Deranged Rhino]

15 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Im out. But thanks for the give and take.

 

*******************************************

(unrelated - but posts were merged)

 

And here comes the backlash (though, to be fair, the backlash already started):

 

Funny, for the past 12 months "insiders" have been lauded by the DNC for their brave work in exposing Trump... What changed?

 

The DNC “Cancer” Is Donna Brazile

 

Craven insiders—not joint fundraising agreements—are what’s destroying the party.

 

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2017/11/the_dnc_cancer_is_donna_brazile.html

Edited November 7, 2017 by Deranged Rhino

[reddogblitz]

On 11/6/2017 at 10:54 AM, Taro T said:

 

Quite likely.  Not expecting that to be prevalent anytime soon though, unfortunately.

 

Really. This latest revelation that real news outlets like CNN, Huff Post, Washington Post, BuzzFeed, and the Miami Herald quoted "Russian bot" tweets reinforces my suspicion that most news reporters sit around and read Twitter and get thier stories from there. So much for the days of verifying sources.

Edited November 8, 2017 by reddogblitz

[DC Tom]

18 minutes ago, reddogblitz said:

 

Really. This latest revelation that real news outlets like CNN, Huff Post, Washington Post, BuzzFeed, and the Miami Herald quoted "Russian bot" tweets reinforces my suspicion that most news reporters sit around and read Twitter and get thier stories from there. So much for the days of verifying sources.

 

It's hardly new.  Reporters were bitching during the Bush administration that the White House wouldn't spoon-feed them information, and they had to go look for it, like reporters. 

 

Or just make **** up, like Dan Rather.

[Tiberius]

28 minutes ago, reddogblitz said:

 

Really. This latest revelation that real news outlets like CNN, Huff Post, Washington Post, BuzzFeed, and the Miami Herald quoted "Russian bot" tweets reinforces my suspicion that most news reporters sit around and read Twitter and get thier stories from there. So much for the days of verifying sources.

You are the one going on suspicion. Kind of funny. You accusing the media of doing what you are actually doing. Tom, who agrees with the propaganda that flows out of the B-Man sewer, agrees with you. 

 

Journalism is doing a great job, they have dug out tons of stuff the American public wouldn't know about without good, solid journalism. 

[3rdnlng]

28 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

You are the one going on suspicion. Kind of funny. You accusing the media of doing what you are actually doing. Tom, who agrees with the propaganda that flows out of the B-Man sewer, agrees with you. 

 

Journalism is doing a great job, they have dug out tons of stuff the American public wouldn't know about without good, solid journalism. 

I know. Did you hear about the 145 million dollars given to the Clinton Foundation because HRC facilitated the transfer of 20% of our uranium to Russia? The media really caught HRC in collusion with Russia.

[Deranged Rhino]

Suddenly it's "controversial" to even listen to opposing opinions that threaten the narrative... at least to the Washington Post. 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2017/11/07/trumps-cia-director-mike-pompeo-keeps-doing-controversial-and-suspiciously-pro-trump-things/?utm_term=.9767f31fd41c

[reddogblitz]

2 hours ago, Tiberius said:

You are the one going on suspicion. Kind of funny. You accusing the media of doing what you are actually doing.

 

No, I'm not. I'm going from this Huffington Post article where they admit THEY did. Here's the link that evidently is no longer available. It was the cover story a few days ago.  Maybe you can get to it.

 

https://m.huffingtonpost.com/entry/facebook-regulation_us_59e5211ee4b0ca9f483a14bd?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009

 

Also a CNBC article about "legitimate" news sources using tweets as a source.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2017/11/03/the-washington-post-miami-herald-infowars-and-other-us-sites-spread-russian-propaganda-from-twitter.html

The tweet that opened a story in the Washington Post on Feb. 11, 2016 seemed innocuous: It was an attempt to illustrate Syrian territory occupied by clashing government and ISIS forces.

Problem is, the account behind that tweet — @WarfareWW — was one of 2,752 Twitter trolls identified this week as tied to the Russian government and suspended for spreading disinformation.

 

Edited November 8, 2017 by reddogblitz

[Deranged Rhino]

PACER shows there are now 30 sealed federal indictments. We don't know for sure they're related to Mueller's investigation, but that's the speculation. 

 

That's up from 12 over the weekend. 

[LeviF]

The day is November 8, 2017.  It is 4:28pm eastern.

 

Donald Trump was elected president one year ago today.

 

He has been president for 292 days, four hours, and 42 minutes.

 

Still no impeachment or resignation.

[B-Man]

7 minutes ago, LeviF91 said:

The day is November 8, 2017.  It is 4:28pm eastern.

 

Donald Trump was elected president one year ago today.

 

He has been president for 292 days, four hours, and 42 minutes.

 

Still no impeachment or resignation.

 

The funny part is when you go back and read the first few pages of this thread.......................or this gem......

 

[Deranged Rhino]

29 minutes ago, LeviF91 said:

The day is November 8, 2017.  It is 4:28pm eastern.

 

Donald Trump was elected president one year ago today.

 

He has been president for 292 days, four hours, and 42 minutes.

 

Still no impeachment or resignation.

 

I've heard from my friends here in LA he's actually in exile now, the whole Asia trip is a hoax and he's really on the run... with the USN. 

 

[3rdnlng]

33 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

I've heard from my friends here in LA he's actually in exile now, the whole Asia trip is a hoax and he's really on the run... with the USN. 

 

That has to piss off Admiral Chelsea.

[reddogblitz]

1 hour ago, B-Man said:

 

The funny part is when you go back and read the first few pages of this thread.......................or this gem......

 

 

Be careful what you ask for. Pence would be far worse if you are a Dem. Congress would actually work with him and pass a lot of scary conservative stuff.

[DC Tom]

1 hour ago, 3rdnlng said:

That has to piss off Admiral Chelsea.

 

Rear Admiral Chelsea.  

 

Or did she get a promotion.  She got a promotion, didn't she?  

[3rdnlng]

19 minutes ago, DC Tom said:

 

Rear Admiral Chelsea.  

 

Or did she get a promotion.  She got a promotion, didn't she?  

Yes, and it was inevitable. A foregone conclusion.

[Deranged Rhino]

This should give everyone pause who's been following the mainstream narrative of Russian hacking: 

 

 

This is yet another toolkit designed to mimic Russian hackers and obfuscate any investigations into the origin point of a cyber attack. Between Marbles and now this, the CIA specifically (cough - Brennan/Hayden) and NSA by extension (cough - Clapper) had not only the technology to "fake" a Russian "hack" of the DNC servers, but had been actively deploying said technology for the past 8 years. 

 

For the past 5 years it's been legal for both the USIC and State to propagandize its own people, priming the pump so to speak, which in turn makes using these obfuscation tools all the more effective when you paint the target on a nation you've spent years convincing the public is an imminent threat to the security of the United States of America. 

 

That's how you wage an information war. 

[Deranged Rhino]

The spin in this is hilarious - deflect, deflect, deflect... Tony Podesta is done, the Times is trying to distance itself from him by making his brother out to be an almost separate person, as if he had NOOOOO connection to the Podesta Group's influence. 

 

Why is the Podesta Group suddenly unable to pay the salaries of its employees?

Why has the money pumped into the Podesta Group stopped? 

Russia Scandal Befalls Two Brothers: John and Tony Podesta

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/10/us/politics/john-tony-podesta-mueller-russia-investigation.html

[B-Man]

@JohnPodesta Met With Fusion GPS Founder After Trump Dossier Was Published

 

I'm confused John, I  Thought you testified differently ?

 

 

Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta met with the founder of the opposition research firm behind the Trump dossier just after the dirty document was published earlier this year, according to a new report in The New York Times.

 

The revelation is significant because Podesta, a longtime Democratic operative, recently told the Senate Intelligence Committee that he did not know who paid the research firm, Fusion GPS, to produce the dossier, which BuzzFeed published on Jan. 10.

 

Podesta testified before the Senate Intelligence Committee before it was publicly revealed that the Clinton campaign and DNC had hired Fusion GPS. In that interview, Podesta denied knowing anything about who paid for the investigation.

[Deranged Rhino]

2 hours ago, B-Man said:

@JohnPodesta Met With Fusion GPS Founder After Trump Dossier Was Published

 

I'm confused John, I  Thought you testified differently ?

 

 

Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta met with the founder of the opposition research firm behind the Trump dossier just after the dirty document was published earlier this year, according to a new report in The New York Times.

 

The revelation is significant because Podesta, a longtime Democratic operative, recently told the Senate Intelligence Committee that he did not know who paid the research firm, Fusion GPS, to produce the dossier, which BuzzFeed published on Jan. 10.

 

Podesta testified before the Senate Intelligence Committee before it was publicly revealed that the Clinton campaign and DNC had hired Fusion GPS. In that interview, Podesta denied knowing anything about who paid for the investigation.

 

If you ever need a laugh, look at podesta's Twitter feed on any given night. He tweets something then gets pounded by responses. 

 

Sorry, John. People get mad when you sell out the country in order to line your own pockets. 

[B-Man]

Media excited over opportunity to talk about Trump-RUSSIA again

 

We don't see much coverage when Trump is overseas unless there is opportunity to beat him up, criticize him or embarrass him. The last kerfuffle follows on the heels of the koi fish fiasco, which ended up embarrassing the media as it was revealed they had edited footage of the president feeding koi fish with Japan's President Abe. I can't believe I just typed those words: a fiasco about the president feeding the fish improperly while overseas. This is what the fourth estate has become.

 

The latest "scandal" involves Trump's remarks about his recent meeting with RUSSIAN President Vladimir Putin. Business Insider describes Trump as "walking back" his original comments on the meeting.

 

On Saturday, Trump said that Putin insisted during a meeting on the sidelines of the Asia-Pacific Economic Cooperation summit that Russia did not interfere in the election, and that he believed the Russian leader meant it.

 

"He said he didn't meddle. He said he didn't meddle," Trump told reporters aboard Air Force One. "I asked him again. You can only ask so many times. I just asked him again. He said he absolutely did not meddle in our election. He did not do what they are saying he did."

 

He added that whenever they had met, Putin denied ordering Russia's election meddling. "I believe, I really believe that when he tells me that, he means it," Trump said. "But he says, 'I didn't do that.' I think he is very insulted by it, which is not a good thing for our country."

 

The remarks were spun to mean that President Trump believed Putin's denials rather than Trump saying Putin appeared to believe his own denials.

 

These are two different things but only one gets lots 'o headlines. This kind of crap is why people do not believe the media any longer, especially when the media is always reminding us how smart and nuanced they are yet demonstrates a simpleton-like understanding of anything that comes out of Trump's mouth

 

https://pjmedia.com/blog/liveblogevent/mondays-hot-mic-32/entry-217228/

Edited November 13, 2017 by B-Man

[Tiberius]

45 minutes ago, B-Man said:

Media excited over opportunity to talk about Trump-RUSSIA again

 

We don't see much coverage when Trump is overseas unless there is opportunity to beat him up, criticize him or embarrass him. The last kerfuffle follows on the heels of the koi fish fiasco, which ended up embarrassing the media as it was revealed they had edited footage of the president feeding koi fish with Japan's President Abe. I can't believe I just typed those words: a fiasco about the president feeding the fish improperly while overseas. This is what the fourth estate has become.

 

The latest "scandal" involves Trump's remarks about his recent meeting with RUSSIAN President Vladimir Putin. Business Insider describes Trump as "walking back" his original comments on the meeting.

 

On Saturday, Trump said that Putin insisted during a meeting on the sidelines of the Asia-Pacific Economic Cooperation summit that Russia did not interfere in the election, and that he believed the Russian leader meant it.

 

"He said he didn't meddle. He said he didn't meddle," Trump told reporters aboard Air Force One. "I asked him again. You can only ask so many times. I just asked him again. He said he absolutely did not meddle in our election. He did not do what they are saying he did."

 

He added that whenever they had met, Putin denied ordering Russia's election meddling. "I believe, I really believe that when he tells me that, he means it," Trump said. "But he says, 'I didn't do that.' I think he is very insulted by it, which is not a good thing for our country."

 

The remarks were spun to mean that President Trump believed Putin's denials rather than Trump saying Putin appeared to believe his own denials.

 

These are two different things but only one gets lots 'o headlines. This kind of crap is why people do not believe the media any longer, especially when the media is always reminding us how smart and nuanced they are yet demonstrates a simpleton-like understanding of anything that comes out of Trump's mouth

 

https://pjmedia.com/blog/liveblogevent/mondays-hot-mic-32/entry-217228/

“I just know that [Trump] has been very determined to try to delegitimize any effort to come up with the truth in terms of this investigation,” Brennan said. “His attacks on the intelligence community, on the assessment, the attacks on the media, this is an effort to, again, try to undermine those quarters that could pose a serious threat to him. Also, I think it shows the insecurity that he still feels about the election and how Russian interference may have contributed, in fact, to that election. So, I think there’s a combination of factors that are motivating the president at this time.”

[Tiberius]

On 11/11/2017 at 4:47 PM, Deranged Rhino said:

The spin in this is hilarious - deflect, deflect, deflect... Tony Podesta is done, the Times is trying to distance itself from him by making his brother out to be an almost separate person, as if he had NOOOOO connection to the Podesta Group's influence. 

 

LOL, but they are separate people!!  Even a wacko like you should know two people are not they same person

[Tiberius]

Well now, this is interesting: 

https://www.theatlantic.com/amp/article/545738/

Just before the stroke of midnight on September 20, 2016, at the height of last year’s presidential election, the WikiLeaks Twitter account sent a private direct message to Donald Trump Jr., the Republican nominee’s oldest son and campaign surrogate. “A PAC run anti-Trump site putintrump.org is about to launch,” WikiLeaks wrote. “The PAC is a recycled pro-Iraq war PAC. We have guessed the password. It is ‘putintrump.’ See ‘About’ for who is behind it. Any comments?” (The site, which has since become a joint project with Mother Jones, was founded by Rob Glaser, a tech entrepreneur, and was funded by Progress for USA Political Action Committee.)

The next morning, about 12 hours later, Trump Jr. responded to WikiLeaks. “Off the record I don’t know who that is, but I’ll ask around,” he wrote on September 21, 2016. “Thanks.”

 

The messages, obtained by The Atlantic, were also turned over by Trump Jr.’s lawyers to congressional investigators. They are part of a long—and largely one-sided—correspondence between WikiLeaks and the president’s son that continued until at least July 2017. The messages show WikiLeaks, a radical transparency organization that the American intelligence community believeswas chosen by the Russian government to disseminate the information it had hacked, actively soliciting Trump Jr.’s cooperation. WikiLeaks made a series of increasingly bold requests, including asking for Trump’s tax returns, urging the Trump campaign on Election Day to reject the results of the election as rigged, and requesting that the president-elect tell Australia to appoint Julian Assange ambassador to the United States.

[Doc]

A nothingburger with cheese.

[Deranged Rhino]

39 minutes ago, Doc said:

A nothingburger with cheese.

 

The full text paints quite a different picture (than Tibs' article, not your comment.)  

 

 

Full convo:

 

More from Assange: 

 

 

 

Edited November 14, 2017 by Deranged Rhino

[Deranged Rhino]

And of course... this is old news repackaged as new: 

(July, 11, 2017)

 

 

[B-Man]

Now It’s The Democrats Who Have A ‘Russian Problem.’.............................NOW? 

--Richard Pollack 

Democratic fingerprints are all over a growing number of Russia-related scandals, including payments to Fusion GPS for its Russian-sourced Trump dossier, lobbying on behalf of Russia’s largest bank to lift economic sanctions, former President Barack Obama’s administration’s approval of the sale of Uranium One to Russia, and giving twenty percent of America’s uranium reserves to Moscow.

 

Republican Senators Lindsey Graham of South Carolina and Chuck Grassley of Iowa have called for the appointment of a special prosecutor to look into the mounting scandals tying Democrats to Russia.

 

“The bottom line is very simple, says former U.S. Attorney Joseph diGenova in an interview with The Daily Caller News Foundation. “The Russian connection now is owned by the Democratic Party.”

 

What are the Democratic ties to Russia?

[Deranged Rhino]

Why are all the posted images from Twitter now blue and illegible? Or is that only for me. 

 

The Don Jr tweets of the exchange with Assange have an easter egg. Anyone else find it?

[Tiberius]

A guy with such a bad memory and such conflicts of interest probably should not be anywhere near the justice department, unless he is under investigation. Oh wait, he probably is

 

The Post reports:

When asked previously about whether he believed surrogates from the Trump campaign had communications with the Russians, Sessions said, speaking before the House Judiciary Committee. “I did not, and I’m not aware of anyone else that did, and I don’t believe it happened.”

Now, Sessions said he recalled a March 2016 meeting with Trump campaign foreign policy adviser George Papadopoulos. Papadopoulos, in pleading guilty to lying to FBI agents, has admitted he told Trump and a group of other campaign officials, including Sessions, that he had contacts who could help arrange a meeting between Trump and Putin.

“I do now recall the March 2016 meeting at Trump Hotel that Mr. Papadopoulos attended, but I have no clear recollection of the details of what he said at that meeting,” Sessions said. “After reading his account, and to the best of my recollection, I believe that I wanted to make clear to him that he was not authorized to represent the campaign with the Russian government, or any other foreign government, for that matter. But I did not recall this event, which occurred 18 months before my testimony of a few weeks ago, and I would gladly have reported it had I remembered it because I pushed back against his suggestion that I thought may have been improper.”

[Deranged Rhino]

3 hours ago, Deranged Rhino said:

The Don Jr tweets of the exchange with Assange have an easter egg. Anyone else find it?

 

An easter egg that was spread far and wide by the Atlantic and every outlet that picked up on the story... 

[K-9]

5 hours ago, Tiberius said:

A guy with such a bad memory and such conflicts of interest probably should not be anywhere near the justice department, unless he is under investigation. Oh wait, he probably is

 

The Post reports:

When asked previously about whether he believed surrogates from the Trump campaign had communications with the Russians, Sessions said, speaking before the House Judiciary Committee. “I did not, and I’m not aware of anyone else that did, and I don’t believe it happened.”

Now, Sessions said he recalled a March 2016 meeting with Trump campaign foreign policy adviser George Papadopoulos. Papadopoulos, in pleading guilty to lying to FBI agents, has admitted he told Trump and a group of other campaign officials, including Sessions, that he had contacts who could help arrange a meeting between Trump and Putin.

“I do now recall the March 2016 meeting at Trump Hotel that Mr. Papadopoulos attended, but I have no clear recollection of the details of what he said at that meeting,” Sessions said. “After reading his account, and to the best of my recollection, I believe that I wanted to make clear to him that he was not authorized to represent the campaign with the Russian government, or any other foreign government, for that matter. But I did not recall this event, which occurred 18 months before my testimony of a few weeks ago, and I would gladly have reported it had I remembered it because I pushed back against his suggestion that I thought may have been improper.”

Jeez, Jeffy Gump/Forrest Sessions remembers some detailed things about stuff he previously didn't recall or believe ever happened. His hypocrisy regarding the use of "I don't recall" testimony was called out by a few at that hearing today. 

[Tiberius]

George Papadopoulos claimed last year that Donald Trump telephoned him to discuss his new position as a foreign policy adviser to his presidential campaign and that the two had at least one personal introductory meeting that the White House has not acknowledged.

Papadopoulos also claimed that he’d been given a “blank check” to choose a senior Trump administration job and authorized to represent the candidate in overseas meetings with foreign leaders, and at a campaign event in New York. 

Papadopoulos made the claims in several interviews with two Greek journalists during and after the 2016 election, one of whom detailed them for POLITICO. They contradict assertions by Trump, Attorney General Jeff Sessions and other Trump officials that Papadopoulos was a bit player in the campaign whom they barely remember.

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/11/17/george-papadopoulos-trump-greece-russia-245668