ganesh Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 Roethlisberger #2, really?!? What do you folks think about that? (I'll never forget that draft and how I was absolutely sold he would become a Buffalo Bill.) And Jacksonville screwed us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikie2times Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 I don't feel like the Brady aspect is the thing that bothers me the most. I do think it assisted him, but it's not what bothers me the most. I think it's possible, in fact, even likely, that this has been going on for some time now. If you want to find a highly correlated statistic to winning% look at turnovers. When you look at how much of a statistical outlier the Patriots have been with fumbles. Something like a 10,000 to 1 rate of occurance just by random variation. That's what bothers me the most. Not even a small part of me believes that number is a result of random variation. Several players have discussed a less inflated ball being easier to carry. So talk about a direct game changer on a PED level. Add 5-6 fumbles a year to the Patriots total, would that make a difference in a game of inches? I think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manther Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 And who knows what new scandal(s) involving Brady* and the Pats** will be common knowledge by then? Well played! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 (edited) I don't feel like the Brady aspect is the thing that bothers me the most. I do think it assisted him, but it's not what bothers me the most. I think it's possible, in fact, even likely, that this has been going on for some time now. If you want to find a highly correlated statistic to winning% look at turnovers. When you look at how much of a statistical outlier the Patriots have been with fumbles. Something like a 10,000 to 1 rate of occurance just by random variation. That's what bothers me the most. Not even a small part of me believes that number is a result of random variation. Several players have discussed a less inflated ball being easier to carry. So talk about a direct game changer on a PED level. Add 5-6 fumbles a year to the Patriots total, would that make a difference in a game of inches? I think so. I would think then, that every team would have the ball inflated to the minimum PSI. At least the smart ones. It will be interesting to see if it becomes the standard throughout the league, and if indeed, the fumble stats are affected. It may indeed have an effect with fumbles, but I doubt that was why they started doing it. I think it might have been an unexpected benefit. Belichick probably thought it was just his great coaching. I don't think Belichick had anything to do with the deflation, because if he did, then the equipment clowns would have talked about Belichick getting pissed when they made mistakes, not Brady. This was Brady's thing, so he could grip the ball better. He may have told Belichick about it, but I don't think it was Belichick's idea, or that he orchestrated it. Edited May 28, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Buffalo Joe Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 Well played! Right?!?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 (edited) Lame, and disingenuous. Montana was losing conference championships instead of Super Bowls. If you want to call him the greatest Super Bowl QB, that's cool. But he was losing in the playoffs. Brady's accomplishments, however they might have been achieved, are unparalleled. Thanks. Edited May 28, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 (edited) I don't feel like the Brady aspect is the thing that bothers me the most. I do think it assisted him, but it's not what bothers me the most. I think it's possible, in fact, even likely, that this has been going on for some time now. If you want to find a highly correlated statistic to winning% look at turnovers. When you look at how much of a statistical outlier the Patriots have been with fumbles. Something like a 10,000 to 1 rate of occurance just by random variation. That's what bothers me the most. Not even a small part of me believes that number is a result of random variation. Several players have discussed a less inflated ball being easier to carry. So talk about a direct game changer on a PED level. Add 5-6 fumbles a year to the Patriots total, would that make a difference in a game of inches? I think so. We've stated the fumble issue numerous times. Now we get to see if our theories are correct. (with the caveat that his balls are fully inflated to NFL rules) Actually, (buried somewhere) IIRC the stats comparison will not be seen until Nov and Dec games. That is when his stats fall the most at away games where he has a 30% drop off in TD's Lame, and disingenuous. Montana was losing conference championships instead of Super Bowls. If you want to call him the greatest Super Bowl QB, that's cool. But he was losing in the playoffs. Brady's accomplishments, however they might have been achieved, are unparalleled. Thanks. man up and stop cradling Tom's* soft balls The graphics say it all. Tom* and Belicheat cheat to win. PERIOD end of story!!! Edited May 28, 2015 by BillsFan-4-Ever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy McFiddish Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 Roethlisberger #2, really?!? What do you folks think about that? (I'll never forget that draft and how I was absolutely sold he would become a Buffalo Bill.) We were only 2 picks away from having him, wish we traded up. Wish the brass listened to the scouting department when they told them to take Russell Wilson and not TJ Graham. That list is certainly not my opinion. I would have Ben either below or tied with Romo and Brees and Rivers above him. I am almost shocked they gave the Pats an asterisk but it is about time the did! I should have started off this post differently since it was my first. Hi everyone am new here, 45 in Lockport and a die hard Bills/Sabres fan my whole life. Have creeped the board before but just signed up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 We were only 2 picks away from having him, wish we traded up. Wish the brass listened to the scouting department when they told them to take Russell Wilson and not TJ Graham. That list is certainly not my opinion. I would have Ben either below or tied with Romo and Brees and Rivers above him. I am almost shocked they gave the Pats an asterisk but it is about time the did! I should have started off this post differently since it was my first. Hi everyone am new here, 45 in Lockport and a die hard Bills/Sabres fan my whole life. Have creeped the board before but just signed up. welcome! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandy McFiddish Posted May 28, 2015 Share Posted May 28, 2015 Thank you Yolo is a pleasure to be here. I am sure many are leary when a newbie comes along but I am definitely not a troll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What a Tuel Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 Lame, and disingenuous. Montana was losing conference championships instead of Super Bowls. If you want to call him the greatest Super Bowl QB, that's cool. But he was losing in the playoffs. Brady's accomplishments, however they might have been achieved, are unparalleled. Thanks. You call that lame and disingenuous? But you fight tooth and nail to protect the patriots* from their actions? Gimme a break. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LOVEMESOMEBILLS Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 (edited) Lame, and disingenuous. Montana was losing conference championships instead of Super Bowls. If you want to call him the greatest Super Bowl QB, that's cool. But he was losing in the playoffs. Brady's accomplishments, however they might have been achieved, are unparalleled. Thanks. Tom Br*dy* lost in the playoffs exactly one time less than Montana. You're going to make that comment when the playoff losses outside the Super Bowl are 7 to 6 ? Really ? You make it sound like it's a big margin. After an 10-0 start to the playoffs, Br*dy's* 11-8 since. I love the line Br*dy's* accomplishments, however they might have been achieved, are unparalleled. Like it doesn't matter the Pats** and Br*dy* have been caught cheating ? See most people believe if you have to cheat to win you have actually won nothing. And I don't want to hear that it didn't help or help much because if that were the case they would have never done it in the first place. Keep fighting the unwinnable fight. Edited May 29, 2015 by LOVEMESOMEBILLS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 (edited) Tom Br*dy* lost in the playoffs exactly one time less than Montana. You're going to make that comment when the playoff losses outside the Super Bowl are 7 to 6 ? Really ? You make it sound like it's a big margin. After an 10-0 start to the playoffs, Br*dy's* 11-8 since. I love the line Br*dy's* accomplishments, however they might have been achieved, are unparalleled. Like it doesn't matter the Pats** and Br*dy* have been caught cheating ? See most people believe if you have to cheat to win you have actually won nothing. And I don't want to hear that it didn't help or help much because if that were the case they would have never done it in the first place. Keep fighting the unwinnable fight. Rice was cheating for some of those Super Bowls, so those were accomplished by a team that was CHEATING. And "cheating is cheating" is the phrase all these whiners fall back on! Brady has more Super Bowl appearances, and the same amount SB wins, he has a more impressive list, PERIOD. This fight has already been "won", because no matter what you say, Brady has the upper hand. I don't even know what their playoff records are. I do know that 6 Super Bowls with 4 wins, is better than only 4. IT"S OBVIOUS!!!! Edited May 29, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What a Tuel Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 Rice was cheating for some of those Super Bowls, so those were accomplished by a team that was CHEATING. And "cheating is cheating" is the phrase all these whiners fall back on! Brady has more Super Bowl appearances, and the same amount SB wins, he has a more impressive list, PERIOD. This fight has already been "won", because no matter what you say, Brady has the upper hand. I don't even know what their playoff records are. I do know that 6 Super Bowls with 4 wins, is better than only 4. IT"S OBVIOUS!!!! That is lame and disingenuous. If Montana was coddled like Brady, he might've played as long as Brady. Or if Steve Young wasn't at his heels. Like I have said before, Brady was caught cheating himself. Then in addition, his team was caught cheating. On top of that, they screwed the Raiders out of a shot. That team is all out of breaks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 (edited) That is lame and disingenuous. If Montana was coddled like Brady, he might've played as long as Brady. Or if Steve Young wasn't at his heels. Like I have said before, Brady was caught cheating himself. Then in addition, his team was caught cheating. On top of that, they screwed the Raiders out of a shot. That team is all out of breaks. Haha, what kind of "breaks" do the Patriots need, they have 4 Super Bowl Rings? Belichick and Brady could retire today, and already have more than enough accomplishments to be considered the greatest of their era. It's already done! It wasn't Montana cheating, but you are trying to marginalize the accomplishments of the Patriot TEAMS, and Jerry Rice was not only a huge part of a team, but played a massive role, directly in Montana's accomplishments. Surely, by the whiners own logic, that taints Montana's AND the 49er's accomplishments. Rice had an advantage both catching, and holding on to the ball (just like the Pats!). And doesn't Rice have notably low numbers for both dropped passes and fumbles? Thought so... Let me state again, I think Brady did it (just like Rice!), but I don't for a minute buy that it was a deciding factor in any of their successes (or the 49er's!). Get over it, whiners. Edited May 29, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattM Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 (edited) Haha, what kind of "breaks" do the Patriots need, they have 4 Super Bowl Rings? Belichick and Brady could retire today, and already have more than enough accomplishments to be considered the greatest of their era. It's already done! It wasn't Montana cheating, but you are trying to marginalize the accomplishments of the Patriot TEAMS, and Jerry Rice was not only a huge part of a team, but played a massive role, directly in Montana's accomplishments. Surely, by the whiners own logic, that taints Montana's AND the 49er's accomplishments. Rice had an advantage both catching, and holding on to the ball (just like the Pats!). And doesn't Rice have notably low numbers for both dropped passes and fumbles? Thought so... Let me state again, I think Brady did it (just like Rice!), but I don't for a minute buy that it was a deciding factor in any of their successes (or the 49er's!). Get over it, whiners. If Montana got half the calls that the Pats* and Brady* have gotten over the years they would have won many more Super Bowls. Who can forget "just give it to them" or the ref "inadvertently" blowing his whistle on Nate Clements' pick six of Brady to seal a game a few years back (among many other awful, one-way calls in that game--so bad that TMQ had to write about the officiating in that game in his column) or more recently the 15 yarder on a key third down stop against Jerry Hughes last year for slapping his own teammate's helmet. That's just against us off the top of my head. Then you have the Tuck Rule, the absolute mugging of Colts' receivers without any calls during the 2004 AFCCG (that even led to a rule emphasis change the next year to help cover it up), the Monday night rip job against the Ravens that got Suggs and others on that team nearly fined, the obvious hold against the Saints last year on the game-winning last play of the game, one of my personal favorites (since the announcers never really understood the call), a very late flag against the Texans on what would have been a game losing pick of Brady that let the Pats* come back to win and on and on and on. If things truly balance out, the Patriots* aren't due for a good call going their way until about 2056. Make no mistake, there are other shoes to drop with respect to the Cheats*. Hold your views on who the GOAT is until all the evidence comes out. Edited May 29, 2015 by MattM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 That is lame and disingenuous. If Montana was coddled like Brady, he might've played as long as Brady. Or if Steve Young wasn't at his heels. Like I have said before, Brady was caught cheating himself. Then in addition, his team was caught cheating. On top of that, they screwed the Raiders out of a shot. That team is all out of breaks. If Montana was coddled like Brady, he might've won more SB's than Brady. We may have not seen Steve Young in SF. waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa waa Get over it, waa waa. They** continued to cheat YEAR AFTER YEAR AFTER YEAR Accept it Troll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 If Montana got half the calls that the Pats* and Brady* have gotten over the years they would have won many more Super Bowls. Who can forget "just give it to them" or the ref "inadvertently" blowing his whistle on Nate Clements' pick six of Brady to seal a game a few years back (among many other awful, one-way calls in that game--so bad that TMQ had to write about the officiating in that game in his column) or more recently the 15 yarder on a key third down stop against Jerry Hughes last year for slapping his own teammate's helmet. That's just against us off the top of my head. Then you have the Tuck Rule, the absolute mugging of Colts' receivers without any calls during the 2004 AFCCG (that even led to a rule emphasis change the next year to help cover it up), the Monday night rip job against the Ravens that got Suggs and others on that team nearly fined, the obvious hold against the Saints last year on the game-winning last play of the game, one of my personal favorites (since the announcers never really understood the call), a very late flag against the Texans on what would have been a game losing pick of Brady that let the Pats* come back to win and on and on and on. If things truly balance out, the Patriots* aren't due for a good call going their way until about 2056. Make no mistake, there are other shoes to drop with respect to the Cheats*. Hold your views on who the GOAT is until all the evidence comes out. If Montana was coddled like Brady, he might've won more SB's than Brady. We may have not seen Steve Young in SF. They** continued to cheat YEAR AFTER YEAR AFTER YEAR Accept it Troll. What is this "Rewrite History Month"? So now you not only want to diminish the Patriots, but also give the 49er's more championships. It's all already in the books. Everyone knows the 70's Steelers were using Steroids....asterisks Jerry "Everybody was doing it" Rice and the 49er's....asterisks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted May 29, 2015 Share Posted May 29, 2015 What is this "Rewrite History Month"? So now you not only want to diminish the Patriots, but also give the 49er's more championships. It's all already in the books. Everyone knows the 70's Steelers were using Steroids....asterisks Jerry "Everybody was doing it" Rice and the 49er's....asterisks MOST PEOPLE would agree had Montana been pampered as much as Cinderfella Brady* YES he would have played longer in SF and won more championships. Explain why Belicheat threw Tommy* under the bus making him the Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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