welp, so much for Chris Christie eh?

[OCinBuffalo]

Great track record, quit as governor and then run for the Senate.

 

 

She's a joke

Yeah. Ask Martin Basheer how funny that joke is. If she's a joke, then why can't you, and far too many others, not stop talking about her? Will you now do the same thing with Christie? That would be fascinating.

 

I put the Palin thing in there on purpose ....to demonstrate this point. Palin was merely an example, but you took the bait. (No, Azalin doesn't count, because he was talking tactics, not Palin.)

 

This is derangement: especially when I specifically outline the problem "attacking Palin unfairly gives her power", and then you repeat the behavior, despite the warning.

 

What is that?

 

What tells us that the same behavior that is exhibited toward Palin, won't be directed at Christie, with the same results....even though people like me are wisely telling you to: just stop. But, I don't see you stopping yourselves, because not only do you lack intellectual honesty, you lack basic honesty, and have: ever since the Clinton/Lewinsky thing. You've accepted lying, as "normal and OK". Real lying. Not "I made a bad choice based on WMD intelligence" Bush "lying". No. Real lying.

 

Today:

You've been burned by this same thing, over and over. There's not a single leftist in the media(um, Katie Couric comes to mind. What's she doing now?) that hasn't taken a serious beating as a result of bad behavior directed toward Sarah Palin. The worst actors have gotten 3x the beating they tried to give Palin.

 

Yet, you are still at it? This self-destructive behavior, is predicated on yet another lie = "all women conservatives are traitors or stupid". Apparently your need to protect/live the lie, outweighs your need to not look like an abject fool. Thus, you end up looking like abject fools quite often.

 

Now do you see why I say: you've accepted lying?

 

I could be wrong...and there's a long way to go with this, but, I think that's the root cause here. Flat out lying has been "OK" ever since Clinton/Lewinsky for you.

 

We see Benghazi, the IRS, the NSA, Fast and Furious, and of course Obamacare: the lies just keep on coming, and your need to protect them, keeps on making you look foolish.

 

Fascinating.

Edited January 20, 2014 by OCinBuffalo

[TheMadCap]

 

 

We see Benghazi, the IRS, the NSA, Fast and Furious, and of course Obamacare: the lies just keep on coming, and your need to protect them, keeps on making you look foolish.

 

Fascinating.

 

People like you make me sick. Focusing on phony scandals, trying to shift our attention from a true abuse of power and whT will ultimately go down as the Crime of the Century. The closure of two lanes of traffic, which made some commuters late for work. The nerve of you and your ilk...

Edited January 20, 2014 by TheMadCap

[John Adams]

Gator and OC: Don't you see what you're doing? When you smack each other around, you merely give support to the other 95% of posters here who don't take you seriously.

[Tiberius]

Gator and OC: Don't you see what you're doing? When you smack each other around, you merely give support to the other 95% of posters here who don't take you seriously.

 

What is it you want dude? If me and OC exchange arguments that's bad in some way? What the hell are you talking about? Why do you care about our reputation on this board and why in the world should I care what you think?

[DC Tom]

What is it you want dude? If me and OC exchange arguments that's bad in some way? What the hell are you talking about? Why do you care about our reputation on this board and why in the world should I care what you think?

 

He doesn't care. He's mocking you.

 

Jesus...

[Tiberius]

 

 

He doesn't care. He's mocking you.

 

Jesus...

 

I guess you are right, he was just being a troll and not contributing anything but a personal attack.

[Azalin]

They are out to get Christie and to protect Obama, is that right?

 

to be honest, I think it's plain that Christie is a target sinply because he polls way out in front of all other republicans among the general public when asked who they would most like to see as the next president, just like Hillary does among democrats. Hillary only needs to ride out any potential fallout from Benghazi, since she holds no office right now. otherwise, I'm sure that right-leaning media would be throwing all kinds of charges at her to see if anything might stick. if you can get any kind of scandalous allegations to stick to a candidate, it will follow them through their entire career, not just cause them trouble during elections. high-profile or effective political office-holders should expect this sort of thing, even from ambitious members of their own party.

[Tiberius]

 

 

to be honest, I think it's plain that Christie is a target sinply because he polls way out in front of all other republicans among the general public when asked who they would most like to see as the next president, just like Hillary does among democrats. Hillary only needs to ride out any potential fallout from Benghazi, since she holds no office right now. otherwise, I'm sure that right-leaning media would be throwing all kinds of charges at her to see if anything might stick. if you can get any kind of scandalous allegations to stick to a candidate, it will follow them through their entire career, not just cause them trouble during elections. high-profile or effective political office-holders should expect this sort of thing, even from ambitious members of their own party.

 

I guess Hillary is coming out with a book now about her time as secretary of state so the right will probably have some fun picking that apart. Christie really messed up I think. Or I think one of his subordinates screwed him bad. Can't imagine this came from the top, Christie does not seem stupid. Unfortunately for him and the GOP the biggest Dem mess in decades--Obamacare--doesn'tent stick to Hillary. And it will be hard for any Republican to run in the general election to repeal a law that does undeniably helps people keep their health care. But who knows? Benghazi won't matter, it won't win any independent voters.

[Azalin]

Unfortunately for him and the GOP the biggest Dem mess in decades--Obamacare--doesn'tent stick to Hillary.

I'm not quite sure about that, mainly because 20 years ago the mess was called 'Hillarycare'. the idea was incredibly unpopular back then....it just serves to show how public opinion can change so much in such a relatively short time.

[Tiberius]

I'm not quite sure about that, mainly because 20 years ago the mess was called 'Hillarycare'. the idea was incredibly unpopular back then....it just serves to show how public opinion can change so much in such a relatively short time.

 

Hmmm....will be interesting to see how each side handles the health care issue in 2016

[IDBillzFan]

Hmmm....will be interesting to see how each side handles the health care issue in 2016

 

Obamacare will handle itself because when millions of people start losing their employee coverage, the GOP will remind everyone that the Democrats own Obamacare in its entirety, and when it continues to fail the majority of people as it is failing them now, Hillary could be a black lesbian war vet and people wouldn't vote for her. By the time she starts dishing the dirt to distance herself from Obama, and Obama leaks one last Benghazi bomb with HIllary's name on it, Dems will be so FUBARed, you're going to wish John Kerry was back on the ticket.

[keepthefaith]

Mayor of Hoboken just finished a long interview on CNN. She came off as credible although it's clear that there were discussions about development projects which were not at all tied to Sandy relief. Was she pressured? To what extent? Was relief delayed or not given? Hard to say hearing one side of the story.

[Doc]

Was this like, say, giving millions of dollars to a state so that they'd vote yes for a bill?

[DC Tom]

Mayor of Hoboken just finished a long interview on CNN. She came off as credible although it's clear that there were discussions about development projects which were not at all tied to Sandy relief. Was she pressured? To what extent? Was relief delayed or not given? Hard to say hearing one side of the story.

 

Was she pressured any more or less than Wall Street or Detroit's bondholders?

[keepthefaith]

Was she pressured any more or less than Wall Street or Detroit's bondholders?

A softball interview for sure. Apparently she declined to give Fox an interview.

[Koko78]

Was she pressured any more or less than Wall Street or Detroit's bondholders?

 

We'll have to ask Ambassador Zimmer in a few years.

[OCinBuffalo]

I'm not quite sure about that, mainly because 20 years ago the mess was called 'Hillarycare'. the idea was incredibly unpopular back then....it just serves to show how public opinion can change so much in such a relatively short time.

I don't know about this: it seems to me that Obamacare, the concept, has never been popular(underscored by Scott Brown being elected).

 

For a time, the "who is better at handling health care" numbers favored Ds. Is that what you're talking about? Well, it doesn't matter now. In fact, those #s are now lower than they have been since HillaryCare. People trust Rs more on health care now, and I haven't seen anything new that says this isn't true.

 

Of course, let's not forget..."they are going to love it". Someday. Sometime. Somewhere. For some reason. Where, when, and why? We never get the answer to those questions. But, we are supposed to accept the premise.

 

Once again, it's just a lie. And, it's a lie that they are far too willing to "believe" and then parrot.

[Azalin]

I don't know about this: it seems to me that Obamacare, the concept, has never been popular(underscored by Scott Brown being elected).

 

For a time, the "who is better at handling health care" numbers favored Ds. Is that what you're talking about? Well, it doesn't matter now. In fact, those #s are now lower than they have been since HillaryCare. People trust Rs more on health care now, and I haven't seen anything new that says this isn't true.

 

Of course, let's not forget..."they are going to love it". Someday. Sometime. Somewhere. For some reason. Where, when, and why? We never get the answer to those questions. But, we are supposed to accept the premise.

 

Once again, it's just a lie. And, it's a lie that they are far too willing to "believe" and then parrot.

as far as I know, 'Hillarycare' was never presented to anyone as anything other than 'guaranteed health care for all'. I don't remember a single detail given about how it would work, who would run it, etc. it never made it as far as 'we have to pass it to know what's in it'.

 

things have changed since 1992-1994. a larger portion of the population seem willing to allow the federal government to 'solve' certain issues by either increased regulation or by taking entire industries over completely. even more believe that the feds 'ought to do something' about nearly everything. many in my family that used to be against government healthcare in the 90's have changed, and are now for it. even the way we discuss the issue - the 'healthcare system' - implies that it's not an actual industry that has grown into what it is, but something that was constructed by design, which needs to be repaired in order to make it run properly again.

 

neither party can fix it. in my opinion, they're the ones screwing it up....all of them. people are either too disinterested, too stupid, or both to realize that every single time the feds get involved in anything, it becomes less effecient, more costly, and is soon in need of even more 'fixing'.

 

if and when Obamacare fizzles out, I have no doubt that republicans will rush in to fix it, and I have absolutely no faith in their ability to do so. as long as people continue to expect help from the feds, it's just going to be more of the same.

[Nanker]

DeBlasio taking a page out of the Christie book?

 

“Mayor If you’re listening, please plow these streets,” said Sonny Budharaja of Harlem.“None of the streets have been plowed, like, no matter which way you go, it’s like this everywhere,” he said. “I guess the mayor is focusing more on other boroughs like last time.” He said he had never seen worse conditions. “I’ve never seen anything like this. This is the first time,” he said. “I’ve been living in New York City for 30 years. This is horrendous.”

And a New York Post report Tuesday evening quoted some residents of the affluent Upper East Side, who accused de Blasio of ignoring them in an effort to “get us back.”

[OCinBuffalo]

as far as I know, 'Hillarycare' was never presented to anyone as anything other than 'guaranteed health care for all'. I don't remember a single detail given about how it would work, who would run it, etc. it never made it as far as 'we have to pass it to know what's in it'.

 

things have changed since 1992-1994. a larger portion of the population seem willing to allow the federal government to 'solve' certain issues by either increased regulation or by taking entire industries over completely. even more believe that the feds 'ought to do something' about nearly everything. many in my family that used to be against government healthcare in the 90's have changed, and are now for it. even the way we discuss the issue - the 'healthcare system' - implies that it's not an actual industry that has grown into what it is, but something that was constructed by design, which needs to be repaired in order to make it run properly again.

 

neither party can fix it. in my opinion, they're the ones screwing it up....all of them. people are either too disinterested, too stupid, or both to realize that every single time the feds get involved in anything, it becomes less effecient, more costly, and is soon in need of even more 'fixing'.

 

if and when Obamacare fizzles out, I have no doubt that republicans will rush in to fix it, and I have absolutely no faith in their ability to do so. as long as people continue to expect help from the feds, it's just going to be more of the same.

Oh I understand. More than you know.

 

Thusfar, I can pretty much prove that government involvement...has basically FUBARed the heath care process. That's how I look at things(properly) in health care. I look at process, not patients. Patients are a useless standard, due to the obvious fact that every patient is different.

 

In terms of process? I can point to multiple areas where the government in fact hurts quality as well as performance(no those words are not the same). In fact, I can demonstrate causation in amount of damaged process via amount of recent government douchebaggery.

 

And, there are entire sections of process that are completely useless. They don't serve any purpose for the patient or the provider. Instead, they are a means to fill out a form. No one has been able to prove that these forms help anyone with anything, that they wouldn't be doing on their own. They are merely the "make work" which gives the government employee something to do, and, has the added benefit of being the source of their authority.

 

As far as Rs go? You're probably right. However, you never know.