YoloinOhio Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 The chant for next season: We need to LOSE to WINston Well done I think some of you are missing the point... I am really not questioning who is more talented, mainly because I have watched Jamies for 4 of his 6 games and agree is supremely talented. However, to compare him at this point and say is a HUGE upgrade becasue EJ's team lost to NC State and FL last year ... well, for one FSU hasn't played those teams yet this year. To me, it just seems early on Winston to declare him as the better FSU QB. Which I don't care ultimately, because I only care about what kind of QB EJ is for the Bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardinalScotts Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 (edited) and how many guys on the field last night will play in the NFL ? Also people seem to think a guy won't improve he will be the same as he was in college which is SO off the mark Edited October 20, 2013 by CardinalScotts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 You guys are homers, not objective or you would see that Winston is clearly superior to EJ period. Had EJ been drafted by say the Jets you as a bills fan would be laughing and bashing them for wasting a first round pick on the guy. Bottom line the same inept front office lucked into the Legend of Kiko but screwed the pooch on the first round QB. So we will be sitting here 3 years from now with ANOTHER bust at QB, another Captain checkdown it seems. So if you were running the Bills, you would have stuck with Fitzy or Kolb and tried to draft EJ in the 3rd when he would have already been gone since other teams indicated they wanted him sooner, missed out on the guy they wanted, and gone with Barkley or one of the others? I am just curious. and how many guys on the field last night will play in the NFL ? Also people seem to think a guy won't improve he will be the same as he was in college which is SO off the mark Pryor is a great example. I know someone who works in a NFL front office who said Pryor will never play QB in the NFL, he will only play if he is willing to change positions to TE or WR. That's the difference between the coaching and playbook he got at OSU and what he is getting now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWATeam Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 It's the eye test. The reason Winston hasn't won the bowl games EJ did is only because he hasn't played in them yet. And Winston's first bowl game could very well be the BCS Championship, something EJ never sniffed. Winston is already better than EJ ever was as a college player. How they turn out in the NFL is obviously TBD. But Jameis is certainly the more talented of the two. I don't necessary see that right now. He is obviosly playing at an extremly high level right now, higher than EJ ever did in college in fact. However, I have a hard time comparing the two right now. First the talent issue. I don't see Jameis as an explosive athelete, in fact it looks to me like EJ is probably faster. Also, someone mentioned his steller mechanics. I don't really see that either. He seems to have a long release and has a bit of a vince young "flick." Second the overall team is much better than it has been in years. I can't really think of an FSU WR that has been drafted very high in the last few years, now it looks like they have two studs. I think that it is WAY to early for all of these definative statements that are coming out, but that is the world today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 I don't necessary see that right now. He is obviosly playing at an extremly high level right now, higher than EJ ever did in college in fact. However, I have a hard time comparing the two right now. First the talent issue. I don't see Jameis as an explosive athelete, in fact it looks to me like EJ is probably faster. Also, someone mentioned his steller mechanics. I don't really see that either. He seems to have a long release and has a bit of a vince young "flick." Second the overall team is much better than it has been in years. I can't really think of an FSU WR that has been drafted very high in the last few years, now it looks like they have two studs. I think that it is WAY to early for all of these definative statements that are coming out, but that is the world today. My point exactly, but you captured it much better. Overreaction is the new normal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 To be clear, the tweets were from national and local (to Ohio) sportswriters who I follow. There were some FSU fans who replied to the tweets and agreed. I don't follow any FSU fans, so maybe they did tweet the same, but I don't know. I did see one person, not sure if an FSU fan, reply something to the effect that to be that much better than EJ would be an incredible feat. Just remember, the legendary Tee Martin won the NC for UT the year after Peyton left and didn't do so in any of his 4 years, nor did he beat their rival Florida. Some UT fans will still say Martin was a better UT QB than Peyton for that reason. OSU fans could not wait to see Terrell Pryor leave - his mechanics sucked. From the minute Braxton stepped on the field everyone said he was better. Now Pryor is starting in the NFL after getting some real QB coaching which he never had at OSU. I am just saying that college and NFL are just so entirely different. Can't really judge either Winston on college or EJ on NFL at this point of either's careers. There have been many outstanding COLLEGE QB's who have been busts @ the pro level. There are also some guys who were seemingly average in college that have turned out to be solid if not great NFL QB's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Yes, agreed he looked very good last night. I saw Matt Barkley do the same thing in the same type of environment(OSU) in the same type of game (night game on the road, top 10 matchup) as a true freshman. Nothing against Jameis. I don't take anything away from his performance. Just think it is bit extreme (and soon) to act like the different between he and EJ is like going from Curtis Painter to Andrew Luck. Well...I have no idea what the future holds for Jameis Winston...But I will say this much...I guarantee he is a completely different animal than Matt Barkley...That much I know... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountryCletus Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 I remember seeing Barry Sanders playing second fiddle to Thurman Thomas... That worked out ok for us, even though Barry was clearly the better back... You don't have to have the best players, just really good ones. On top of all that, who's to say his game will transition to the nfl (I know you said it's the same skill set EJ has), and the kid has to have it between the ears... EJ has poise, and has the determination and drive to want to be better... Constantly studying... I DON'T watch much CFB, and these are all devils advocate type scenarios.... But there are lots of things to look at... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Well done I think some of you are missing the point... I am really not questioning who is more talented, mainly because I have watched Jamies for 4 of his 6 games and agree is supremely talented. However, to compare him at this point and say is a HUGE upgrade becasue EJ's team lost to NC State and FL last year ... well, for one FSU hasn't played those teams yet this year. To me, it just seems early on Winston to declare him as the better FSU QB. Which I don't care ultimately, because I only care about what kind of QB EJ is for the Bills. I recall reading unattributed quotes from FSU assistant coaches to the effect that they have far more confidence in Winston than they ever did in EJ. To me, that is telling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dayman Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 (edited) I'm a Gator fan, have countless FSU fans as friends, and watch SEC/ACC football closely. Jameis is in fact miles better than EJ. It is just a fact guys. Don't worry about it though, because Jameis is also probably the best QB to play in the state of Florida in a LOOONG time. Jameis is better, but that is because Jameis is great. Also, sadly (I know this is not popular to say) EJ has always kind of sucked and still does. Just more facts. FSU fans would be the first to tell you this too, btw. Great guy, average QB (at best). Edited October 20, 2013 by SameOldBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
santoro770 Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 While I agree with you that Winston hasn't played enough games to conclude anything definitively, just the fact that FSU fans are saying those things at all does not look good for EJ. You couldn't be more wrong about this. Do you really think that EJ, anyone in the Bills organization or anyone in the NFL for that matter really cares at all what the media or FSU fans are saying about EJ now that he's in the NFL?? I can respect that you are probably a big college football fan, but sadly, who cares??? I as a Bills fan could care less if FSU fans miss EJ or if they say in the media or on twitter that he is the worst QB in college football history. I think most would disagree with you whole heartedly and say, who really cares what he did, said, played like or was perceived in college. He's not in college anymore, move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bizell Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 (edited) okay, so I had the chance to watch EJ his whole time @ FSU and Jameis all of his career so far @ FSU Manuel was a good college QB, and he was 4-0 in bowl games, but I never really felt comfortable with him @ the qb save for two games- the bowl game against Notre Dame and the Clemson game last year. I always feel safe in thinking that Jameis is going to make the right read and find the open man. For instance, everyone was always hard on Nick O'leary (a 5 star TE prospect from a few years back) because he only had 37 receptions and 3 touchdowns his first two years. This year? O'leary has 16/293/5. Jameis is the natural. He's got it all. edit: in summary, saying winston is better than EJ isn't a slight to EJ- Winston is really, really really !@#$ing good Edited October 20, 2013 by bizell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 okay, so I had the chance to watch EJ his whole time @ FSU and Jameis all of his career so far @ FSU Manuel was a good college QB, and he was 4-0 in bowl games, but I never really felt comfortable with him @ the qb save for two games- the bowl game against Notre Dame and the Clemson game last year. I always feel safe in thinking that Jameis is going to make the right read and find the open man. For instance, everyone was always hard on Nick O'leary (a 5 star TE prospect from a few years back) because he only had 37 receptions and 3 touchdowns his first two years. This year? O'leary has 16/293/5. Jameis is the natural. He's got it all. edit: in summary, saying winston is better than EJ isn't a slight to EJ- Winston is really, really really !@#$ing good THANK YOU. Nice to have an informed opinion since you have watched them both. Yes, looks like Winston is off the chain. Will wait a minute to put him in the HOF though unlike Twitter which anoints the next best thing every other week. I'm a Gator fan, have countless FSU fans as friends, and watch SEC/ACC football closely. Jameis is in fact miles better than EJ. It is just a fact guys. Don't worry about it though, because Jameis is also probably the best QB to play in the state of Florida in a LOOONG time. Jameis is better, but that is because Jameis is great. Also, sadly (I know this is not popular to say) EJ has always kind of sucked and still does. Just more facts. FSU fans would be the first to tell you this too, btw. Great guy, average QB (at best). I assume you are a Bills fan and you must have been uber disappointed on draft day then! If that is the case, he has really overachieved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerball Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 I can't figure out if this is an EJ post or a Winston thread. If it's a Winston thread then it belongs on the NCAA forum. If it's an EJ thread then it belongs here. What's a mod to do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted October 20, 2013 Author Share Posted October 20, 2013 I can't figure out if this is an EJ post or a Winston thread. If it's a Winston thread then it belongs on the NCAA forum. If it's an EJ thread then it belongs here. What's a mod to do? It's an EJ thread I was defending him for being compared to Winston/treated like chopped liver last night in Twitter-verse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 Even if EJ isn't elite, just remember that 4 out of the last 6 Superbowls were won by non-ellite type of QBs. Flacco (1), E. Manning(2) and Rothlesburger (1). The Ravens, Giants and Steelers win by having their QBs play great at the right time, having expertly assembled teams and great coaching. This is the model the Bills are probably going for because the only other option is to lose all your games so that you can draft a guy like Winston. I really see EJ Manuel as being the perfect kind of QB to mold for a long haul Superbowl contending team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 You guys are homers, not objective or you would see that Winston is clearly superior to EJ period. Had EJ been drafted by say the Jets you as a bills fan would be laughing and bashing them for wasting a first round pick on the guy. Bottom line the same inept front office lucked into the Legend of Kiko but screwed the pooch on the first round QB. So we will be sitting here 3 years from now with ANOTHER bust at QB, another Captain checkdown it seems. Wow. Pot, kettle on the "objective" thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heitz Posted October 20, 2013 Share Posted October 20, 2013 I can't figure out if this is an EJ post or a Winston thread. If it's a Winston thread then it belongs on the NCAA forum. If it's an EJ thread then it belongs here. What's a mod to do? Can you just ban everyone involved? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Also, sadly (I know this is not popular to say) EJ has always kind of sucked and still does. Just more facts. FSU fans would be the first to tell you this too, btw. Great guy, average QB (at best). Facts...you keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. EJ threw x passes and y interceptions, projecting Winton's season to date he will throw x passes and y interceptions - replace x and y with the relevant, correct numbers and that would be a fact. Saying someone "kind of sucks and still does" will never be a fact. It's your opinion, which may or may not have enough basis to be worth the electrons that transmit it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts