section122 Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Okay, let's be objective. The following is a list of stunts. You might find them funny, someone else might find them offensive, someone like me might find them immature. Nevertheless, they are stunts: Tweet to God The ensuing post-game podium 'performance' The giant booty/thong birthday cake Doing press conferences in front of the Bills step and repeat wearing a wife beater. Minuteman Celebration in Foxboro (cost team 15 yards) Jets/Shooting self in leg celebration (cost team 15 yards) Why So Serious (cost team 15 yards) Happy New Year (cost team 15 yards, cost him a half of football) Blowing off Rochester event "I've never worked out in the off season" North Korea should bomb Foxboro Showing up to a photo shoot wearing a shirt that says "!@#$" I will give you the three "stunts" that cost 15 yards as they were detrimental to the team. Why so serious wasn't flagged and led to happy New Years. He didn't think it would be a penalty as it wasn't before. The others? Wearing a wife beater? Who cared about that? Oh no it showed up on c'mon man! A birthday cake that was *gasp* shaped like a butt! Seriously? This shirt? You are no longer objective on this and haven't been for quite some time. Any and every time he breathes wrong you step on your soap box. As for the first two... The kid just had his heart broken. He knows he screwed up. He knew he let his team down. In the heat of the moment he said something he regretted. Who hasn't done that? Post game performance? Here you've just had your heart ripped out on national tv - lets put a mic in front of your face. All of your list boils down to 3 offenses that he vowed (and followed through on) to not have happen again. You're crusading and this one just isn't a good one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 I will give you the three "stunts" that cost 15 yards as they were detrimental to the team. Why so serious wasn't flagged and led to happy New Years. He didn't think it would be a penalty as it wasn't before. The others? Wearing a wife beater? Who cared about that? Oh no it showed up on c'mon man! A birthday cake that was *gasp* shaped like a butt! Seriously? This shirt? You are no longer objective on this and haven't been for quite some time. Any and every time he breathes wrong you step on your soap box. As for the first two... The kid just had his heart broken. He knows he screwed up. He knew he let his team down. In the heat of the moment he said something he regretted. Who hasn't done that? Post game performance? Here you've just had your heart ripped out on national tv - lets put a mic in front of your face. All of your list boils down to 3 offenses that he vowed (and followed through on) to not have happen again. You're crusading and this one just isn't a good one. That's an objective list of things he's done that are childish. End of story. I'd prefer our "stars," our "team leaders" to act like men. I cast no judgement on the humor/entertainment value of any of the aforementioned (I actually thought the minuteman solute was laugh out loud funny). I'm not alone in this opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Whether you're speaking to me or not, understand that (a) I don't think it's a "big deal" and (b) I didn't even know about it until this thread started. But discussion is healthy, and there have been some good points made on both sides as to whether or not Stevie should be wearing something like that given his status as a public figure. I believe those who simply throw out the statement "who cares; what's the big deal" are just a bit naive. Anyone with a job has obligations to his employer, which include not embarrassing said employer. I'm pretty sure Roger Goodell wouldn't be sitting back having a good ol' chuckle at USS FUHKMORE if he even knows about this (which he may not). The discussion, at least to me, is not about old farts who don't "get" young, hip, humor. It's about public figures and their responsibility not to embarrass their employers. Understanding this comes with maturity. Stevie's thought process aside, the fact someone affiliated with the Bills posted this on FB is ridiculous, and as I indicated in an earlier post, the employee responsible should be relieved of his/her duties. I understand your points, I just disagree that him wearing that shirt embarrasses his employer or the NFL in any way as it has nothing to do with the NFL/Bills, nor their views or stances on anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
microscopes Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 (edited) because it is clearly spelled out in the LEAGUE POLICY FOR PLAYERS under Personal Conduct: All persons associated with the NFL are required to avoid conduct detrimental to the integrity of and public confidence in the National Football League. This requirement applies to players, coaches, other team employees, owners, game officials and all others privileged to work in the National Football League. For many years, it has been well understood that rules promoting lawful, ethical, and responsible conduct serve the interests of the League, its players, and fans. Illegal or irresponsible conduct does more than simply tarnish the offender. It puts innocent people at risk, sullies the reputation of others involved in the game, and undermines public respect and support for the NFL. It is important to note that the unsportsmanlike conduct rules apply to all personnel in the team area, including players, coaches, team employees, and officials. Lack of respect or other unsportsmanlike conduct will not be tolerated during games or at other times, including postgame interviews. This includes abusive, threatening, insulting, or profane language or gestures, and physical acts by coaches, players, and other club personnel directed at opponents, officials, game personnel, or fans. Coaches and players should keep in mind that every NFL game is broadcast on radio and television, and that there are open microphones near the playing field as well as closeup camera shots that permit easy lip-reading by viewers. The League and its participants are severely criticized whenever obscene or profane language or obscene gestures are carried or shown on the air. Serious incidents of this kind will warrant disciplinary action by the League. http://www.nflevolut...for-Players.pdf Ok lets go through what you copy and pasted. All persons associated with the NFL are required to avoid conduct detrimental to the integrity of and public confidence in the National Football League. - As far as I can tell, him wearing that shirt does not tarnish the public confidence of the NFL. Illegal or irresponsible conduct does more than simply tarnish the offender. It puts innocent people at risk, sullies the reputation of others involved in the game, and undermines public respect and support for the NFL. - I don't believe even haters of Stevie Johnson would argue that him wearing that shirt is 'illegal' or 'irresponsible'. It certainly doesn't put any innocent person at risk or sully the reputation of others. Lack of respect or other unsportsmanlike conduct will not be tolerated during games or at other times, including postgame intervie - Wearing that shirt did not display any unsportsmanlike conduct or lack of respect. This includes abusive, threatening, insulting, or profane language or gestures, and physical acts by coaches, players, and other club personnel directed at opponents, officials, game personnel - Wearing that shirt is neither threatening or insulting or using profane language or gestures. To behonest, i'm not sure where you were going with that snippit of the League's Policy. It doesn't apply to this situation. See my other post about an employee's responsibility not to embarrass his employer. Hip hop artists are "supposed" to be edgy and cool because that's their market and they really work for themselves. NFL players? There's a reputation and an image. It's just short-sighted by Stevie, that's all. You do realize it was the Employer that posted the picture ... right? That's an objective list of things he's done that are childish. End of story. I'd prefer our "stars," our "team leaders" to act like men. I cast no judgement on the humor/entertainment value of any of the aforementioned (I actually thought the minuteman solute was laugh out loud funny). I'm not alone in this opinion. And THAT is the real issue. For whatever reason, you see football players as role models or leaders. They're not. They never were. Jim Kelly was snorting lines on bar room tables. Edited July 24, 2013 by AvengedSevenfold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffaloed in Pa Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Who cares? As long as he can catch a football,make plays. I don`t. Oh yeah Naaman is faster than Stevie now. Has better hands.Just saying. Didn`t say better than Stevie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Ok lets go through what you copy and pasted. All persons associated with the NFL are required to avoid conduct detrimental to the integrity of and public confidence in the National Football League. - As far as I can tell, him wearing that shirt does not tarnish the public confidence of the NFL. Illegal or irresponsible conduct does more than simply tarnish the offender. It puts innocent people at risk, sullies the reputation of others involved in the game, and undermines public respect and support for the NFL. - I don't believe even haters of Stevie Johnson would argue that him wearing that shirt is 'illegal' or 'irresponsible'. It certainly doesn't put any innocent person at risk or sully the reputation of others. Lack of respect or other unsportsmanlike conduct will not be tolerated during games or at other times, including postgame intervie - Wearing that shirt did not display any unsportsmanlike conduct or lack of respect. This includes abusive, threatening, insulting, or profane language or gestures, and physical acts by coaches, players, and other club personnel directed at opponents, officials, game personnel - Wearing that shirt is neither threatening or insulting or using profane language or gestures. To behonest, i'm not sure where you were going with that snippit of the League's Policy. It doesn't apply to this situation. You do realize it was the Employer that posted the picture ... right? And THAT is the real issue. For whatever reason, you see football players as role models or leaders. They're not. They never were. Jim Kelly was snorting lines on bar room tables. I never said it was about role models, Chuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Over a 1000 yards 3 seasons in a row is swag to me. But what do I know. I'm going to side with HOF Michael Irvin on this one, who after "the drop" vs. Stealers commented, "It's not how many passes you catch or how many yards you get, it's do you make the big catch when the game is on the line?" Michael did, Andre did, Drew Pearson did, Santonio Holmes did, James Lofton did, Don Beebe did, SJ didn't. Until he does, all the silly shirts and EZ dances and funny outfits and tweets still won't make me think he's cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBob Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 Agreed... But he's not that young. He's 27, 5 years out of school, married, child.... It's not some big deal (and I like how some pretend a 5-6 page thread on TSW is making a HUGE deal of something) its a simple shake your head and keep on going moment. People in the spotlight do something dumb, they get called foolish and its over. Clearly it doesn't bother Stevie or he wouldn't do it. Exactly. Yeah, I'm a middle-aged white guy, but that doesn't mean I don't get it. I thought a shirt like that was funny, when I was 12! You know, back when I was lighting farts and reciting poems by Hoo Phlung Pu. I watch South Park and Family Guy and laugh my azzzz off at some absolutely off the chart crude humor. But being 27, having a family and wearing a shirt like this for a public photo shoot says, I'm still "representing" mentally at 13. So no doubt, it ain't like he killed someone, hit and ran somebody, got in a fight at a titttty bar, etc. And no doubt he's working harder, he's fun to watch on the field, at least when he isn't trying to emulate Chad Ocho whatever his name is now. But that picture is just flat out stupid and in bad taste when you're representing your employer and the NFL. I guess his wife and kids are proud though. And calling it "hood" humor doesn't make it any less in bad taste under the circumstances. And for all you apologizers who are posting, "oh it's such a non-issue, and stop being so uptight blah blah," I'm not uptight, not losing any sleep, and am not moralizing one bit. He can wear all the stupid shirts he wants and as long as he catches TD's it's all good. But that doesn't change the fact that it's awfully hard to take him seriously as a man if he can't tell when doing something reflects poorly on him, his family and his employer, and makes him generally look like an idiot. I guess I just find that disappointing. If the guy took himself at all seriously, I think he have a career that could get Hall of Fame consideration. He clearly has other priorities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBob Posted July 24, 2013 Share Posted July 24, 2013 I understand your points, I just disagree that him wearing that shirt embarrasses his employer or the NFL in any way as it has nothing to do with the NFL/Bills, nor their views or stances on anything. How do you know it doesn't offend or embarrass the Bills or the NFL? I suspect they didn't notice it until afterward. Yah, that's what the NFL wants parents of kids to see. Hey look, here are the guys you look up to and idolize. very nice! Say what you want, but it's just plain lame and immature. I cuss like a sailor, but not around kids. I love South Park and Family Guy, but I don't watch it with my sisters kids. It's just in bad taste. If he were a man, he would know that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
microscopes Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 How do you know it doesn't offend or embarrass the Bills or the NFL? I suspect they didn't notice it until afterward. Yah, that's what the NFL wants parents of kids to see. Hey look, here are the guys you look up to and idolize. very nice! Say what you want, but it's just plain lame and immature. I cuss like a sailor, but not around kids. I love South Park and Family Guy, but I don't watch it with my sisters kids. It's just in bad taste. If he were a man, he would know that. If the NFL was worried about children, they wouldn't allow advertisements where the woman are half naked and fighting in mud and water. They wouldn't allow halftime acts where entertainers make very sexual gestures. They would ask that the cheerleaders wear more modest clothing. Kids are far more apt to notice THOSE things than "FUHKMORE" on a shirt. Secondly, the Bills allowed it to be taken and posted. So I doubt it embarrasses them. I further doubt it embarrasses the NFL. Exactly. Yeah, I'm a middle-aged white guy, but that doesn't mean I don't get it. I thought a shirt like that was funny, when I was 12! You know, back when I was lighting farts and reciting poems by Hoo Phlung Pu. I watch South Park and Family Guy and laugh my azzzz off at some absolutely off the chart crude humor. But being 27, having a family and wearing a shirt like this for a public photo shoot says, I'm still "representing" mentally at 13. So no doubt, it ain't like he killed someone, hit and ran somebody, got in a fight at a titttty bar, etc. And no doubt he's working harder, he's fun to watch on the field, at least when he isn't trying to emulate Chad Ocho whatever his name is now. But that picture is just flat out stupid and in bad taste when you're representing your employer and the NFL. I guess his wife and kids are proud though. And calling it "hood" humor doesn't make it any less in bad taste under the circumstances. And for all you apologizers who are posting, "oh it's such a non-issue, and stop being so uptight blah blah," I'm not uptight, not losing any sleep, and am not moralizing one bit. He can wear all the stupid shirts he wants and as long as he catches TD's it's all good. But that doesn't change the fact that it's awfully hard to take him seriously as a man if he can't tell when doing something reflects poorly on him, his family and his employer, and makes him generally look like an idiot. I guess I just find that disappointing. If the guy took himself at all seriously, I think he have a career that could get Hall of Fame consideration. He clearly has other priorities. Sort of a silly thing to say considering that a large amount of HOFers were (are) drug addicts, wife beaters, murderers... To say you can't take him seriously as a man because of a shirt he wears says more about you than it does about him. It shows you can't look past appearances to judge a persons character and rely on only what you see. That's unfortunate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Okay, let's be objective. The following is a list of stunts. You might find them funny, someone else might find them offensive, someone like me might find them immature. Nevertheless, they are stunts: Tweet to God The ensuing post-game podium 'performance' The giant booty/thong birthday cake Doing press conferences in front of the Bills step and repeat wearing a wife beater. Minuteman Celebration in Foxboro (cost team 15 yards) Jets/Shooting self in leg celebration (cost team 15 yards) Why So Serious (cost team 15 yards) Happy New Year (cost team 15 yards, cost him a half of football) Blowing off Rochester event "I've never worked out in the off season" North Korea should bomb Foxboro Showing up to a photo shoot wearing a shirt that says "!@#$" QUESTION ?? who on the current roster would be considered 2nd in the "stunt" department ?? I can't think of one, so apparently over 50 other guys are getting the message that acting the fool is not cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Ok lets go through what you copy and pasted. All persons associated with the NFL are required to avoid conduct detrimental to the integrity of and public confidence in the National Football League. - As far as I can tell, him wearing that shirt does not tarnish the public confidence of the NFL. Illegal or irresponsible conduct does more than simply tarnish the offender. It puts innocent people at risk, sullies the reputation of others involved in the game, and undermines public respect and support for the NFL. - I don't believe even haters of Stevie Johnson would argue that him wearing that shirt is 'illegal' or 'irresponsible'. It certainly doesn't put any innocent person at risk or sully the reputation of others. Lack of respect or other unsportsmanlike conduct will not be tolerated during games or at other times, including postgame intervie - Wearing that shirt did not display any unsportsmanlike conduct or lack of respect. This includes abusive, threatening, insulting, or profane language or gestures, and physical acts by coaches, players, and other club personnel directed at opponents, officials, game personnel - Wearing that shirt is neither threatening or insulting or using profane language or gestures. To behonest, i'm not sure where you were going with that snippit of the League's Policy. It doesn't apply to this situation. You do realize it was the Employer that posted the picture ... right? And THAT is the real issue. For whatever reason, you see football players as role models or leaders. They're not. They never were. Jim Kelly was snorting lines on bar room tables. where am I going ? #1- you say these players shouldn't act or be held to a standard any different than you or I. the NFL SAYS: STANDARD OF CONDUCT While criminal activity is clearly outside the scope of permissible conduct, and persons who engage in criminal activity will be subject to discipline, the standard of conduct for persons employed in the NFL is considerably higher. It is not enough simply to avoid being found guilty of a crime. Instead, as an employee of the NFL or a member club, you are held to a higher standard and expected to conduct yourself in a way that is responsible, promotes the values upon which the League is based, and is lawful. Persons who fail to live up to this standard of conduct are guilty of conduct detrimental and subject to discipline, even where the conduct itself does not result in conviction of a crime. #2- the name FUHKMORE easily qualifies as profanity. #3- 90% of Stevie Johnson is great. this discussion is about the other 10%. while Stevie and his buddies are probably having a good laugh over all this. it would not be surprising if one Buffalo Bill Social Media person is out of a job for not noticing Stevie's humor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
You herd it hear last Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Me me me me me me me me me me me me me me...ad nauseum I can do it too! You try!...it's fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Okay, let's be objective. The following is a list of stunts. You might find them funny, someone else might find them offensive, someone like me might find them immature. Nevertheless, they are stunts: Tweet to God The ensuing post-game podium 'performance' The giant booty/thong birthday cake Doing press conferences in front of the Bills step and repeat wearing a wife beater. Minuteman Celebration in Foxboro (cost team 15 yards) Jets/Shooting self in leg celebration (cost team 15 yards) Why So Serious (cost team 15 yards) Happy New Year (cost team 15 yards, cost him a half of football) Blowing off Rochester event "I've never worked out in the off season" North Korea should bomb Foxboro Showing up to a photo shoot wearing a shirt that says "!@#$" A good half of those are pretty much issues of a person's day-to-day activity being made public (mostly via Twitter). You wouldn't know about them but for the fact that people make a big deal of them. I am mostly concerned about the on-field ones, and honestly, the Happy New Year one didn't bother me much at all because it was not taunting anybody. Do I think he's a mature guy? Not really. He is also playing a kids' game for millions of dollars. I know we really enjoy this mythical Vince Lombardi/Tom Brady narrative of the guy who works tirelessly and mercilessly to be better than the rest... but Mr. Brady himself has plenty of "stunts" in his past. He just doesn't really dignify the bloviating masses with a response over them. Stevie likes to play to a crowd in a way that others don't and it sometimes backfires. Thankfully he seems to be putting the on-field ones behind him. The off-field stuff... Jesus, who even knows when that photo was taken? Is it tasteful? Not really, but he's not my dad or my kid. He's just an entertainer who hits the mark sometimes, and at other times does not. I'll agree that until the Bills do better and win more football games, he'll draw more scrutiny with this kind of stuff, but it really seems to me like our frustrations about whatever he's doing are really magnified by the fact that he is not a part of a winner. These "antics" or "stunts" on a winning team would be characterized as "keeping the guys loose" and the work of a "fun-loving guy" who is "like a kid out there" doing what he loves. I've no axe to grind with Stevie. If other receivers on the roster start surpassing him and making him look foolish, we'll talk. It could happen - but I'd rather see him be a part of the turnaround. I think he has the skills to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Okay, part of me could have respected the shirt if the word f*#@ was spelled right. -But no, It belongs to Stevie so it must be written in ancient retard. Listen up apologists, 90% of the posters on this board support Steve Johnson... We're fans, for crying out loud. Is it asking too much for him to behave like a grownup every now and again? Jim Kelly liked his blow. -It's bad, and I'm sure he's not proud of it. However, In the 80's and 90's coke gave you access to the best parties, the most influential people and the hottest women. What has Stevie's silly behavior done for him, besides make it possible for fans to question his maturity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Okay, part of me could have respected the shirt if the word f*#@ was spelled right. -But no, It belongs to Stevie so it must be written in ancient retard. Listen up apologists, 90% of the posters on this board support Steve Johnson... We're fans, for crying out loud. Is it asking too much for him to behave like a grownup every now and again? Jim Kelly liked his blow. -It's bad, and I'm sure he's not proud of it. However, In the 80's and 90's coke gave you access to the best parties, the most influential people and the hottest women. What has Stevie's silly behavior done for him, besides make it possible for fans to question his maturity. Well isn't that the crazy part? Stevie is from what we know a monogamous family man. He may like big butt (cakes), but he is not out causing trouble or potentially doing harm to his body. He's wearing a silly t-shirt. Bruce Smith was driving drunk, he did blow and he skipped training camp half the time. I have raised this before but I get slapped down by those who know better. If our favorite dudes from the Super Bowl years had been held to 21st century Internet scrutiny, we would have hated just about everyone besides Don Beebe, Metzelaars and Reich, and some people would have hated those guys for being too straight and narrow. I think as good a question is: aside from the on-field stuff that he has dialed back, what harm has Stevie's silly behavior caused? Unless you are really big on brand maintenance and PR (which I thought everybody hated Russ Brandon for), he's actually pretty good for the team because he lets people know the Bills are around. Hopefully he will continue to be his fun-loving self while the Bills make a playoff run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExWNYer Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Okay, part of me could have respected the shirt if the word f*#@ was spelled right. -But no, It belongs to Stevie so it must be written in ancient retard. Listen up apologists, 90% of the posters on this board support Steve Johnson... We're fans, for crying out loud. Is it asking too much for him to behave like a grownup every now and again? Jim Kelly liked his blow. -It's bad, and I'm sure he's not proud of it. However, In the 80's and 90's coke gave you access to the best parties, the most influential people and the hottest women. What has Stevie's silly behavior done for him, besides make it possible for fans to question his maturity. Says the guy using the socially unacceptable "retard" and sporting a 'Sucky Charms' avatar. Brilliant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Says the guy using the socially unacceptable "retard" and sporting a 'Sucky Charms' avatar. Brilliant. I love that Avatar. -Took me a while to get it together but perhaps you're right. Fitz is gone, and I'll probably move on from it. As for the "retard" thing, they exist whether you find it socially acceptable or not.. (See TV show "Bait Car") -FWIW, I'd never use the word to describe, or make fun, of someone who was actually mentally retarded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Okay, part of me could have respected the shirt if the word f*#@ was spelled right. -But no, It belongs to Stevie so it must be written in ancient retard. Listen up apologists, 90% of the posters on this board support Steve Johnson... We're fans, for crying out loud. Is it asking too much for him to behave like a grownup every now and again? Jim Kelly liked his blow. -It's bad, and I'm sure he's not proud of it. However, In the 80's and 90's coke gave you access to the best parties, the most influential people and the hottest women. What has Stevie's silly behavior done for him, besides make it possible for fans to question his maturity. Did anyone else read this as coke was okay bc it got Jim into parties and Stevie's shirt isn't bc it does nothing for him? Please tell me I'm reading this wrong! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted July 25, 2013 Share Posted July 25, 2013 Did I really just read a David Letterman top 10 Stevie disappointments list ? Sounds like some of you are way "overboard" this USS Fuhkmore We gotta get the big cat a date......are you really listing Stevie's booty birthday cake as something that matters in this world ? I don't like the word haters......but there's some haters in here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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