Fitzpatrick isn't a "game manager"

[reddogblitz]

The Bills need better talent on both sides of the ball, because coaching alone won't win games.

So if we had just hung onto DJ as our coach and just got "better talent on both sides of the ball" we'd be as good as we are now? Coaching alone can't win, but it sure can help. Sometimes even more than better players.

 

Having a team that was 4-12 last year being 5-3 at the mid point, I'd say Coach Gailey is doing a lot right.

[dave mcbride]

I was thinking during the game sunday that with that blitz the jets were bringing, a well executed quick screen would work. Or, a draw.

The Bills were quoted afterward (including Jackson), and they said that the Jets' man defense essentially killed the possibility for screens. They wanted to run them, but the possibility for success wasn't there.

 

So if we had just hung onto DJ as our coach and just got "better talent on both sides of the ball" we'd be as good as we are now? Coaching alone can't win, but it sure can help. Sometimes even more than better players.

 

Having a team that was 4-12 last year being 5-3 at the mid point, I'd say Coach Gailey is doing a lot right.

I suspect that BillsVet wouldn't disagree with a word of what you've said. And that doesn't make his original point wrong.

Edited November 10, 2011 by dave mcbride

[3rdand12]

this past game was a great opportunity to teach our team. Nothing wrong with that. Chan is doing a lot right and he knows when he done some wrong too.

[Bob in STL]

A lot of fans are wondering what the Bills should do against Dallas. Well here's what I think they should do.

 

I think the Bills have gone away from what was making them so successful earlier in the season. That was having Fitzpatrick and the receivers as the focal point of their attack. The more Jackson was having success running the football, the more the Bills have been going into a shell and turning the once confident Fitzpatrick into a "game manager" type QB. This is the problem. He isn't a "game manager", he's a legitimate passing QB.

 

The Bills should feature Fitzpatrick throwing to Johnson, Nelson, Spiller (in the slot) and Jackson on screens. When Jackson isn't on a screen pass, he should be chipping on Ware to give Fitzpatrick plenty of time to throw it to the receivers. They should be going no huddle and give Fitzpatrick plenty of options to audible out of bad play calls.

 

The Bills should try to overwhelm the Cowboys with their offense, then when they're up by a few touchdowns, they can then let Jackson run with the football and start taking time off the clock.

 

We need to get Fitzpatrick back to what he was or this season is over. I know the football purists think I'm wrong, but if Jackson is the focal point we lose.

 

True. Now to do that we need to block better. Fitz had lots of time in the first few weeks. Not so anymore.

[Fan in San Diego]

I was thinking during the game sunday that with that blitz the jets were bringing, a well executed quick screen would work. Or, a draw.

 

Correct sir. Screens work best when the defense is blitzing.

[BillsVet]

So if we had just hung onto DJ as our coach and just got "better talent on both sides of the ball" we'd be as good as we are now? Coaching alone can't win, but it sure can help. Sometimes even more than better players.

 

Having a team that was 4-12 last year being 5-3 at the mid point, I'd say Coach Gailey is doing a lot right.

 

This is not an argument existing only in absolutes, e.g. a coaching OR a talent thing. It's a combination of both, and my point remains that the Bills coaching cannot make up for less than adequate talent. Gailey is better than anything the Bills have had in more than a decade, but a team needs good coaching and good talent to be a playoff team. Over a season of 16 games, coaching isn't going to win enough games to be a playoff team.

 

There's a lot of season left. Awards aren't given out for doing well for half a year.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

They essentially have 2 replacements on the O-line. Levitre is out of position and banged up, he is the 3rd string LT. They were compensating for that against a strong defense. Chan knows (better than you do) what to do with this offense.

Agreed, but…

 

Since Week 4, defenses have successfully countered what Buffalo was doing well. As an offense, Buffalo is averaging less than 19 offensive points per game since playing Cincinnati. That's an indicateion to me that they can't counter what defenses are doing.

 

Like every team, Buffalo needs to adapt to what other teams are throwing at them. It's not as simple as going back to what worked, it's developing a scheme to be one step ahead of opponents. Teams will always take away your strength, and good coaches can tell by now what Buffalo can and can't do. The Bills need better talent on both sides of the ball, because coaching alone won't win games.

They do need to upgrade that talent but there's one last thing that the Bills have to do in order to counter the adjustments that teams are making in defensing them.

 

Thanks, I was hoping for some backup on this!

 

I also really hope that Fitzpatrick finds his "wheels" again. He was good for at least two first downs a game using his legs.

 

The coaches need to re-watch the first few games of the season and GET BACK ON TRACK. This running Freddie and having Fitzpatrick "game manage" is a loser, it's choking our team, and it's not what got us the winning record we have now.

Your post is good and no less-interesting or correct in the face of good, valid criticism. Paraphrasing Dave M. above, the other viewpoints are not necessarily a refutation of what you said.

 

My thoughts on how the Bills alter their offense at this juncture boil down to this:

 

The Bills offense needs to make attempts to extend plays and give the receivers more time to get downfield, make some double moves, and make defenses pay for overplaying the first 2 seconds of each passing play.

 

The Bills have become almost obsessive about getting the ball out quickly and avoiding the sack… to their detriment.

 

In this last game, the Jets had good pressure on us but the Bills allowed zero sacks. Good? Maybe but this adherence to "getting the ball out quickly" is now hurting us because defenses know they only have to neutralize us for the front end of the play. On top of that, the Bills need to start taking more risks in the hopes of yielding better rewards. Unless you have the 5 best run after the catch receivers in league history, a short passing attack (which we've become) has an underwhelming risk/reward ratio.

 

There are two ways the Bills can exploit the tendency of defenses to overplay the front end of the play:

 

1) On occasion, keep more players in (TE and RB) for maxxer protection to allow for a few longer-developing plays to be called.

 

2) Encourage Fitz (via coaching and designed plays) to roll out, create time with his legs and force coverage breakdowns that way.

 

I'm not suggesting that Fitz can simply buy time and create openings by imitating Aaron Rodgers.

 

But Fitz has historically been a very good, mobile, aware, QB who used his legs to his advantage. As he's become more set in this new offense, he's gotten to where he doesn't take advantage of one of his best assets… the ability to use his legs to make a play.

 

The Bills (Gailey) needs to see that this fixation with quick passing plays is returning quickly diminishing returns and that they have to raise their game.

 

Extending plays is the way to do that, IMO.

 

 

 

edit: Everyone remember the play on Sunday that Fitz was forced to roll right, and finally threw to an open Scott Chandler for a nice gain?

 

That's what I have in mind.

 

Fitz can't allow the offensive strategists to make him fearful of occasionally holding onto the ball a bit longer and using his legs as a way to open up the defense.

[1billsfan]

Your post is good and no less-interesting or correct in the face of good, valid criticism. Paraphrasing Dave M. above, the other viewpoints are not necessarily a refutation of what you said.

 

My thoughts on how the Bills alter their offense at this juncture boil down to this:

 

The Bills offense needs to make attempts to extend plays and give the receivers more time to get downfield, make some double moves, and make defenses pay for overplaying the first 2 seconds of each passing play.

 

The Bills have become almost obsessive about getting the ball out quickly and avoiding the sack… to their detriment.

 

In this last game, the Jets had good pressure on us but the Bills allowed zero sacks. Good? Maybe but this adherence to "getting the ball out quickly" is now hurting us because defenses know they only have to neutralize us for the front end of the play. On top of that, the Bills need to start taking more risks in the hopes of yielding better rewards. Unless you have the 5 best run after the catch receivers in league history, a short passing attack (which we've become) has an underwhelming risk/reward ratio.

 

There are two ways the Bills can exploit the tendency of defenses to overplay the front end of the play:

 

1) On occasion, keep more players in (TE and RB) for maxxer protection to allow for a few longer-developing plays to be called.

 

2) Encourage Fitz (via coaching and designed plays) to roll out, create time with his legs and force coverage breakdowns that way.

 

I'm not suggesting that Fitz can simply buy time and create openings by imitating Aaron Rodgers.

 

But Fitz has historically been a very good, mobile, aware, QB who used his legs to his advantage. As he's become more set in this new offense, he's gotten to where he doesn't take advantage of one of his best assets… the ability to use his legs to make a play.

 

The Bills (Gailey) needs to see that this fixation with quick passing plays is returning quickly diminishing returns and that they have to raise their game.

 

Extending plays is the way to do that, IMO.

 

 

 

edit: Everyone remember the play on Sunday that Fitz was forced to roll right, and finally threw to an open Scott Chandler for a nice gain?

 

That's what I have in mind.

 

Fitz can't allow the offensive strategists to make him fearful of occasionally holding onto the ball a bit longer and using his legs as a way to open up the defense.

 

Excellent post. I expect the Bills to get back to their identity this week. Enough of the ground and pound stuff, they're going to try putting up a big number on the scoreboard.

 

I've got to believe that Gailey's going to use Jackson less as a runner and more as a Fitzpatrick's bodyguard this week.

Edited November 10, 2011 by 1billsfan

[NastyMan]

A lot of fans are wondering what the Bills should do against Dallas. Well here's what I think they should do.

 

I think the Bills have gone away from what was making them so successful earlier in the season. That was having Fitzpatrick and the receivers as the focal point of their attack. The more Jackson was having success running the football, the more the Bills have been going into a shell and turning the once confident Fitzpatrick into a "game manager" type QB. This is the problem. He isn't a "game manager", he's a legitimate passing QB.

 

The Bills should feature Fitzpatrick throwing to Johnson, Nelson, Spiller (in the slot) and Jackson on screens. When Jackson isn't on a screen pass, he should be chipping on Ware to give Fitzpatrick plenty of time to throw it to the receivers. They should be going no huddle and give Fitzpatrick plenty of options to audible out of bad play calls.

 

The Bills should try to overwhelm the Cowboys with their offense, then when they're up by a few touchdowns, they can then let Jackson run with the football and start taking time off the clock.

 

We need to get Fitzpatrick back to what he was or this season is over. I know the football purists think I'm wrong, but if Jackson is the focal point we lose.

 

I totally agree with you. Our O-line isn't built to run the ball all game long. Our O-line is built for pass blocking and screens. With a run in the mix unexpected. Let Fitz do his thing. Throw the ball everywhere. I will take a gunslinger who throws the ball 40 times a game with 3 TD's and 2 INT"s every week over what we had last week. Go Bills!!!

[3rdand12]

thoughtful postings gentlemen, and i thank youse for the enlightening read. I think we will see a differnt team this week on offense if we get mr.levitre back to his natural positionnext to eric . also if you do not have speed (spiller) guys or deep threats.. we might need to keep to coaching YAC with our receiving crew and how Ryan Ftz leads his players out of trouble spots with his toss.

[Fitzyflakes67]

We've definitely struggled more on offense the last few games but still, other then the Jets game we lost both by 3 points. Even without the powerhouse performance of weeks 1-3, we have played well enough to win. It's not like we've been constantly dominated, we played a few hard-fought, close-call games that happen all of the time in this league. Plus all of the games we lost are against solid first place teams. One different play and we pull out those wins and are 7-1. Then everyone is saying "yeah, we had some tough challenges but we won, and that's all that matters". Not every game we play is gonna be a tour-de-force offensively, things vary week to week for almost every team, that's how the NFL is. The amazing Pats offense has been held to 20 or less for three weeks straight. Before the Packers went on their nasty run to win it all they were 8-6 with losses to 6-10 teams like the Redskins and Lions. The Lions loss in particular was concerning as they lost 7-3, and suddenly the Packers were in "hot water". This year alone we have great teams having bad weeks like the Jags beating the Ravens, and Rams beating the Saints.

 

This is just how things go. We've cooled down a bit, but one solid game vs. Dallas and the tune will change again.

Edited November 11, 2011 by Fitzyflakes67

[7boogiewoogie]

. Best post in the thread.

 

 

 

That's a tough argument it's kinda like what came first the chicken or the egg

[Thurman#1]

A lot of fans are wondering what the Bills should do against Dallas. Well here's what I think they should do.

 

I think the Bills have gone away from what was making them so successful earlier in the season. That was having Fitzpatrick and the receivers as the focal point of their attack. The more Jackson was having success running the football, the more the Bills have been going into a shell and turning the once confident Fitzpatrick into a "game manager" type QB. This is the problem. He isn't a "game manager", he's a legitimate passing QB.

 

The Bills should feature Fitzpatrick throwing to Johnson, Nelson, Spiller (in the slot) and Jackson on screens. When Jackson isn't on a screen pass, he should be chipping on Ware to give Fitzpatrick plenty of time to throw it to the receivers. They should be going no huddle and give Fitzpatrick plenty of options to audible out of bad play calls.

 

The Bills should try to overwhelm the Cowboys with their offense, then when they're up by a few touchdowns, they can then let Jackson run with the football and start taking time off the clock.

 

We need to get Fitzpatrick back to what he was or this season is over. I know the football purists think I'm wrong, but if Jackson is the focal point we lose.

 

 

Lemme get this straight, the problem is that we're not using Fitz and the pass game as our focal point? We're using Freddy too much?

 

The 22 rushes and 31 pass attempts of the Jets game (including two rushes by Fitz) would seem to show that this is not the problem. Our first possession went:

 

1) Fitz pass to Nelson for 2

2) Freddy for 4

3) Fitz to Jackson for 4

4) Punt

 

Next drive:

 

1) Jackson for 14

2) Fitz incomplete

3) Jackson for 3

4) (after Pears penalty) Fitz to Nelson for 15

5) Jackson for 4

6) Jackson for 5

7) On third and one, Jackson for -1

8) Punt

 

Third drive:

 

1) Fitz to Chandler for 4

2) Fitz incomplete

3) Fitz incomplete

4) Punt

 

Sorry, I don't see it.

 

We ran more than we threw against the Skins, but I'd argue that no major problems were caused by this.

 

In the Giants game, Fitz had 30 attempts and we ran 23 times including Fitz's three. Our first possession against the Giants went:

 

1) Jackson for 2

2) Fitz to Johnson for 12

3) Fitz to Spiller for 4

4) Fitz scrambles up middle for 1

5) Fitz to Johnson for 1

6) Punt

 

The second possession consisted of one play, Freddy's 80 yard run. And we still passed a lot more than we ran.

 

I don't think that's the problem. I think the problem is a lack of execution, an ineffective offense.

Edited November 11, 2011 by Thurman#1

[3rdand12]

the issue is that we absolutely Have to be able to beat the Jets. And when we play them next time we had best win or go home. thats what 0-2 in a divisional rivalry means to me.

[Thurman#1]

We've definitely struggled more on offense the last few games but still, other then the Jets game we lost both by 3 points. Even without the powerhouse performance of weeks 1-3, we have played well enough to win. It's not like we've been constantly dominated, we played a few hard-fought, close-call games that happen all of the time in this league. Plus all of the games we lost are against solid first place teams. One different play and we pull out those wins and are 7-1. Then everyone is saying "yeah, we had some tough challenges but we won, and that's all that matters". Not every game we play is gonna be a tour-de-force offensively, things vary week to week for almost every team, that's how the NFL is. The amazing Pats offense has been held to 20 or less for three weeks straight. Before the Packers went on their nasty run to win it all they were 8-6 with losses to 6-10 teams like the Redskins and Lions. The Lions loss in particular was concerning as they lost 7-3, and suddenly the Packers were in "hot water". This year alone we have great teams having bad weeks like the Jags beating the Ravens, and Rams beating the Saints.

 

This is just how things go. We've cooled down a bit, but one solid game vs. Dallas and the tune will change again.

 

 

In our first three games, our offense (not the whole team, but the offense, I'm throwing out all of our pick-sixes this year) ... our offense averaged 35.3 PPG. In the five games since, our offense has averaged 19.0 PPG.

 

That isn't cooling down a bit. That's a huge drop in scoring. It's not a coincidence that we won the first three and lost three of the last five games.

[John from Riverside]

In our first three games, our offense (not the whole team, but the offense, I'm throwing out all of our pick-sixes this year) ... our offense averaged 35.3 PPG. In the five games since, our offense has averaged 19.0 PPG.

 

That isn't cooling down a bit. That's a huge drop in scoring. It's not a coincidence that we won the first three and lost three of the last five games.

 

Which really also coincides with taking some big injuries?

 

We lose our stretch the field x reciever and have to start bringing guys up from the practice squad.....lose both our left tackles and have to move our left guard to left tackle and insert a backup

 

This is the same thing that happened last year....when we started taking on injuries.....our point production went down.

[BillsVet]

Which really also coincides with taking some big injuries?

 

We lose our stretch the field x reciever and have to start bringing guys up from the practice squad.....lose both our left tackles and have to move our left guard to left tackle and insert a backup

 

This is the same thing that happened last year....when we started taking on injuries.....our point production went down.

 

Hold on a second here. The loss of 2nd year man Donald Jones with all of 30 career catches is contributing to the team's lack of scoring? I'm sorry, but the Giants have been without Hakeem Nicks and they continue to play well. Houston's been doing OK without the services of Andre Johnson, right? This problem is much deeper than not having someone who'd be perhaps a 4 WO or backup LT on other teams.

 

As for those LT's, Bell is hurt every year it seems and Hairston is a bad-bodied rookie. Levitre can play in a pinch but will never be a long term answer there, which forces the likes of former street FA Chad Rinehart into the starting lineup.

 

By this point in the season injuries are hurting every team in the NFL. Losing your former UDFA Z receiver and two replacement level OT's shouldn't drop a team down 2 TD's per game in scoring from Week 3 to Week 8.

[ny33]

So if we had just hung onto DJ as our coach and just got "better talent on both sides of the ball" we'd be as good as we are now? Coaching alone can't win, but it sure can help. Sometimes even more than better players.

 

Having a team that was 4-12 last year being 5-3 at the mid point, I'd say Coach Gailey is doing a lot right.

 

In 2007, we started 1-4 and ended 7-9. In 2008, we started 5-3 and ended 7-9. I think that we've made fundamental changes for the better- most evident in the players taken in the 2011 draft- and Gailey is a better head coach than Jauron. That being said, we really haven't accomplished anything until we get a winning season. I think we get 9-10 wins this season, but 7 or 8 are just as likely.

[1billsfan]

Lemme get this straight, the problem is that we're not using Fitz and the pass game as our focal point? We're using Freddy too much?

 

The 22 rushes and 31 pass attempts of the Jets game (including two rushes by Fitz) would seem to show that this is not the problem. Our first possession went:

 

1) Fitz pass to Nelson for 2

2) Freddy for 4

3) Fitz to Jackson for 4

4) Punt

 

Next drive:

 

1) Jackson for 14

2) Fitz incomplete

3) Jackson for 3

4) (after Pears penalty) Fitz to Nelson for 15

5) Jackson for 4

6) Jackson for 5

7) On third and one, Jackson for -1

8) Punt

 

Third drive:

 

1) Fitz to Chandler for 4

2) Fitz incomplete

3) Fitz incomplete

4) Punt

 

Sorry, I don't see it.

 

We ran more than we threw against the Skins, but I'd argue that no major problems were caused by this.

 

In the Giants game, Fitz had 30 attempts and we ran 23 times including Fitz's three. Our first possession against the Giants went:

 

1) Jackson for 2

2) Fitz to Johnson for 12

3) Fitz to Spiller for 4

4) Fitz scrambles up middle for 1

5) Fitz to Johnson for 1

6) Punt

 

The second possession consisted of one play, Freddy's 80 yard run. And we still passed a lot more than we ran.

 

I don't think that's the problem. I think the problem is a lack of execution, an ineffective offense.

 

 

Notice the short passes in the first drive? Notice the over compensation towards Freddie in the second drive? The first pass on the third drive was for four yards.

 

What does this remind you of????????????? ...I don't even have to say it, everyone here knows what I'm talking about.

 

 

The Bills have lost their identity in trying to get Fred the football (granted he was having success, but were not ground and pound) and having Fitzpatrick "game manage" by moving the chains with short passes and hoping for a game filled with third and shorts. Screw the third down. This team needs to start going for big chuncks. They need to have Dallas worry about covering the whole field. They need to have Fitzpatrick get away from the pocket and extend plays to give time to let the receivers separate. Use Jackson for outlet shuttle passes and screens. Fitzpatrick seriously needs to take off with the ball a few times a game. If they go back to who they are, the Bills win. If they don't and play it "safe", they lose.