buffalopdc Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 No reward him for being a big part of the offense we are trying to create. He was productive last year under Gailey so why not extend him. Reports are they re also working on contracts with Johnson and Fitz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 (edited) Bill, you're another one I respect greatly here. But I don't get this post. Roscoe is not a "gadget player." He is our starting slot receiver, he brings much-needed speed to the offense, and he happens to be one of the greatest punt returners in NFL history. As long as the extension doesn't prohibit them from addressing other needs, I can't see why anyone would complain about this. I would rather them extend Stevie and Freddy first, but as long as the Bills get contracts for the right players, I really cannot complain. Roscoe is definitely ballsy with the routes he runs across the middle, but he is injury prone because of it. He is a great punt returner, and wasn't appreciated under DJ. I'm glad to see him develop more under Chan. He had one year with the highest return avg. But even in that year, he returned a lot fewer punts than other return leaders (Devin Hester was, by far, the best punt returner that year). The next year, he only returned 21 punts all year and went from 2 fair catches to 10. The year after that (2009), he only returned 24 punts, his avg had dropped to an incredible 5.5 yds and he fair caught 13 and fumbled 4. Clearly, Parrish's days as "the best punt returner in NFL history" are way behind him. He's lost interest ("disappeared")in that part of his game. Edited September 1, 2011 by Mr. WEO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 I hated the Evans trade, and I think it's sort of unconscionable that they couldn't come up with a way for him to be part of the game plan, but that being said... is it so far-fetched that Gailey would have said as much to the FO, and that Nix and Overdorf conferred on it and Overdorf took it from there? I still don't like the value they got for him, or the notion that Overdorf would be pulling the strings... but it's true, they do seem to be spending *some* money, if not enough. An extension for Roscoe is either proof that they do spend on things they want, or of the extremely upsetting idea that they'd overpay some guys to show the public that they are willing to spend money. An extension for Roscoe should cue Fred Jackson to go postal on OBD, though. I know you should pay for anticipated future production as opposed to past work, but what reason has Roscoe ever given to show he's not the least bit replaceable? He can be an asset in this offense, that fourth round draft pick in the 2012 season might turn out to be equal to or better than his work. Fred, OTOH, has done some special things for this offense - special things that we're still waiting for CJ Spiller to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbosrrgood Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 He had one year with the highest return avg. But even in that year, he returned a lot fewer punts than other return leaders (Devin Hester was, by far, the best punt returner that year). The next year, he only returned 21 punts all year and went from 2 fair catches to 10. The year after that (2009), he only returned 24 punts, his avg had dropped to an incredible 5.5 yds and he fair caught 13 and fumbled 4. Clearly, Parrish's days as "the best punt returner in NFL history" are way behind him. He's lost interest ("disappeared")in that part of his game. This ^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 You are more than welcome to your opinion, but just because yours is different doesn't mean mine is "wrong". Roscoe will go over the middle I never disputed that, however it usually ends up with him leaving the game....The guy HAS iffy hands, if you don't agree with that I understand. He has made some pretty nice catches, I will admit. He also has dropped many catches that other receivers would normally make. This isn't a talent thing, he is short, has short arms, and small hands...he can only do so much. Almost all of Parrish's injuries happened in practice, and/or weren't the result of normal contact getting hit hard. His two major injuries were to his wrist. He was also out from a thumb injury for several games. It's arguable that because his wrists are small he is more apt to get them hurt but that is a stretch. His first one came from diving for a pass in practice and landing wrong on it. His current injury was a hamstring in practice. I went back and looked at all his injuries from Rotoworld news and only found one game he missed because of a normal contact injury when he hurt his knee in a game 15. He also missed half a game from a hamstring. He was nicked up a lot and missed practice a lot but didn't miss games. He's absolutely fearless, and has great hands, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbosrrgood Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 An extension for Roscoe should cue Fred Jackson to go postal on OBD, though. I know you should pay for anticipated future production as opposed to past work, but what reason has Roscoe ever given to show he's not the least bit replaceable? He can be an asset in this offense, that fourth round draft pick in the 2012 season might turn out to be equal to or better than his work. Fred, OTOH, has done some special things for this offense - special things that we're still waiting for CJ Spiller to do. Well said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 I hated the Evans trade, and I think it's sort of unconscionable that they couldn't come up with a way for him to be part of the game plan, but that being said... is it so far-fetched that Gailey would have said as much to the FO, and that Nix and Overdorf conferred on it and Overdorf took it from there? I still don't like the value they got for him, or the notion that Overdorf would be pulling the strings... but it's true, they do seem to be spending *some* money, if not enough. An extension for Roscoe is either proof that they do spend on things they want, or of the extremely upsetting idea that they'd overpay some guys to show the public that they are willing to spend money. An extension for Roscoe should cue Fred Jackson to go postal on OBD, though. I know you should pay for anticipated future production as opposed to past work, but what reason has Roscoe ever given to show he's not the least bit replaceable? He can be an asset in this offense, that fourth round draft pick in the 2012 season might turn out to be equal to or better than his work. Fred, OTOH, has done some special things for this offense - special things that we're still waiting for CJ Spiller to do. And the legend of "Fred Jackson" continues to grow... Dont get me wrong, I love Freddie, but looking at his production I fail to see these "special things" that have people believing he deserves to be first in line for a new contract (with 2 years remaining on his deal). 2010 927yds, 5 TDs, 2 RecTDs, 5 Fumbles 2009 1062 yds, 2 TDs, 2 RecTDs, 2 Fumbles Thats about it... If Roscoe is easily replaceable, Fred is even more so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in Chicago Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 And the legend of "Fred Jackson" continues to grow... Dont get me wrong, I love Freddie, but looking at his production I fail to see these "special things" that have people believing he deserves to be first in line for a new contract (with 2 years remaining on his deal). 2010 927yds, 5 TDs, 2 RecTDs, 5 Fumbles 2009 1062 yds, 2 TDs, 2 RecTDs, 2 Fumbles Thats about it... If Roscoe is easily replaceable, Fred is even more so. I beg to differ. Roscoe is an underachiever - always an excuse about why he has not lived up to his potential. FJ on the other hand has performed consistently no matter the situation and also blocks well - a strong requirement to support our weak OL and to account for blitzes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 And the legend of "Fred Jackson" continues to grow... Dont get me wrong, I love Freddie, but looking at his production I fail to see these "special things" that have people believing he deserves to be first in line for a new contract (with 2 years remaining on his deal). 2010 927yds, 5 TDs, 2 RecTDs, 5 Fumbles 2009 1062 yds, 2 TDs, 2 RecTDs, 2 Fumbles Thats about it... If Roscoe is easily replaceable, Fred is even more so. You're forgetting that he's never been the #1 back over the course of an entire season, and that the run blocking has been dismal during his tenure. He has been a versatile all-purpose back who does whatever you ask him to, and as a between-the-tackles option there is no one better here. If it were so easy to replace him, the so-called most talented RB in last year's draft would have done so when given the chance. I'm a believer in Fred. He is not Chris Johnson, but he doesn't bring his baggage or attitude, and he is the kind of team player the Bills are usually rewarding. Roscoe has been more of a malcontent (mostly due to the way Jauron used him - I can't blame him) and has rarely played a full season. He's a nice player to have as your #5WR with some designed plays out of the slot. He is fearless. But he is definitely not irreplaceable. I beg to differ. Roscoe is an underachiever - always an excuse about why he has not lived up to his potential. FJ on the other hand has performed consistently no matter the situation and also blocks well - a strong requirement to support our weak OL and to account for blitzes. You just don't understand that Roscoe is Wes Welker without the smarts, durability, and production. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattsox Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 thats kind of surprising. might not be a bad move but i think i'd rather wait to see if he can stay healthy before extending him Agreed. The guy is small and can't take a hit without being injured. Thanks Donahoe, Ugh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbosrrgood Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 (edited) And the legend of "Fred Jackson" continues to grow... Dont get me wrong, I love Freddie, but looking at his production I fail to see these "special things" that have people believing he deserves to be first in line for a new contract (with 2 years remaining on his deal). 2010 927yds, 5 TDs, 2 RecTDs, 5 Fumbles 2009 1062 yds, 2 TDs, 2 RecTDs, 2 Fumbles Thats about it... If Roscoe is easily replaceable, Fred is even more so. I think most people would agree that Fred Jackson has been better than all of our 1st round draft pick RB's going back quite some time. I would argue that Thurman Thomas and Travis Henry (he's a dirt bag, but was good with the Bills) were the only backs in recent history that we have had that are better than Jackson. So it doesn't seem he's so easily replaceable to me... We've had such guys as Antwan Smith, Willis Mcgahee, Marshawn Lynch, and now Spiller (I still think he can prove himself, but he is Jacksons backup right now)...All 1st round picks...all except spiller moving on with out proving themselves to be starters. The numbers you have shown for Fred are pretty impressive considering his limited playing time and awful o-line. Edited September 1, 2011 by Turbosrrgood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EasternOHBillsFan Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 And the legend of "Fred Jackson" continues to grow... Dont get me wrong, I love Freddie, but looking at his production I fail to see these "special things" that have people believing he deserves to be first in line for a new contract (with 2 years remaining on his deal). 2010 927yds, 5 TDs, 2 RecTDs, 5 Fumbles 2009 1062 yds, 2 TDs, 2 RecTDs, 2 Fumbles Thats about it... If Roscoe is easily replaceable, Fred is even more so. He got 927 yards at 4.2 yards a CLIP on a 4-12 team, and it is NOT his fault he is underutilized! Talk about taking a lame angle and trying to bend it to your argument. Here ya go: 1062 yards, 236 attempts, 4.5 ypc 11 STARTS, 46 receptions, 376 yards 927 yards, 222 attempts, 4.2 ypc 13 STARTS, 31 receptions, 215 yards Thurman Thomas's second year: 1989 Buffalo Bills, 9-7 1244 yards, 298 attempts, 4.2 ypc STARTS: 16, 60 receptions, 670 yards So NOW it is Fred Jackson's fault the offense is putrid? NOPE, not buying it. He's underappreciated on a bad team, and now he has to be disrespected by some here when all he does is PRODUCE when the opportunity is presented itself? SHAME Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armchair GM Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/bills-nfl/article541137.ece If moving Evans was only a cost-cutting move, why wouldn't they move Parrish instead at $3.3M a year? Because, in limitted action last year, Scoe proved that he's more of a well rounder WR. He's faster than Evans = deep threat, and he can catch the ball in space and make plays...this equates to a better WR, IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fitz's Beard Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 He had one year with the highest return avg. But even in that year, he returned a lot fewer punts than other return leaders (Devin Hester was, by far, the best punt returner that year). The next year, he only returned 21 punts all year and went from 2 fair catches to 10. The year after that (2009), he only returned 24 punts, his avg had dropped to an incredible 5.5 yds and he fair caught 13 and fumbled 4. Clearly, Parrish's days as "the best punt returner in NFL history" are way behind him. He's lost interest ("disappeared")in that part of his game. Hester is by far the greatest punt returner I have ever seen. But I still believe that Roscoe is up there in regards to current returners. He is explosive in the open field and can make people miss. He wasn't given many opportunities after that fumble against Cleveland a few years back, which was an awful play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 The question you should be asking is why in the hell we would resign Parrish who is ALWAYS hurt, and not resign Fitzpatrick? Now I am COMPLETELY convinced they have no future plans that are in any way logical. The reason why Fitz isn't being extended yet is the Bills want to see if last year was a fluke or not, and because re-signing him, a QB, is an order of magnitude higher in money than Roscoe would be. Speaking of which, I'm all for a reasonable deal for Roscoe. But anything more than what he was making ($3.3M/year) is overpaying, unless there are provisions for missing games due to injury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 So "the offense being horrible, and the coaches under-utilizing him" is an ok excuse for Fred, but does not apply to Roscoe throughout the Jauron years? Ok guys... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoretalk Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Guess this proves two things to the collective group of naysayers ... #1 - Roscoe is not going to be one of the surprise cuts of 2011 and #2 - As already stated in this thread ... the Lee Evans trade (yes, we should have received more back from the Ravens then a lousy 4th rounder) was not about saving Ralph some cash. Although we may never know whether it was Lee asking for a trade, Gailey's not being happy with his lack of interest in over the middle plays, the over abundance of talent (hopefully) at wideout or something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wnyBacker Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 parrish is a great player and a dangerous weapon, but how many more of those types of player do WE need? why not let him walk and then use the saved money to invest into the offensive line. there are plenty of people on our team that can play the slot, starting with spiller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 Fred Jackson is really going to be pissed now. And the legend of "Fred Jackson" continues to grow... Dont get me wrong, I love Freddie, but looking at his production I fail to see these "special things" that have people believing he deserves to be first in line for a new contract (with 2 years remaining on his deal). 2010 927yds, 5 TDs, 2 RecTDs, 5 Fumbles 2009 1062 yds, 2 TDs, 2 RecTDs, 2 Fumbles Thats about it... If Roscoe is easily replaceable, Fred is even more so. In the last 3 years we have watched Fred Jackson outproduce 2 1st rd round RBs. How is he easily replaceable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in Chicago Posted September 1, 2011 Share Posted September 1, 2011 So "the offense being horrible, and the coaches under-utilizing him" is an ok excuse for Fred, but does not apply to Roscoe throughout the Jauron years? Ok guys... Quite the opposite Dr., FJ produces despite all these factors hampering him. Roscoe has not. Only place I think FJ lacks is EZ production. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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