Does drafting defense make sense?

[ieatcrayonz]

There have been a lot of arguments on here about whether we should draft DL or DB and what each does for the team. I have my opinions on the matter but was wondering about a different topic.

 

Is drafting defense so prominently a good idea?

 

Think about it. If you have the best defense in the history of football then your highly drafted players will only be on the field 3 plays at a time. The other team will be 3 and out a lot. While this sounds good, it leaves you with a bunch of lesser offensive players because they were drafted so low. You get what you pay for and the offense will go nowhere. Sooner or later your superstar-laden defense will tire and give up some points. It will result in slow boring games where we lose 3-0 or 7-3.

 

If we drafted offense, the players would stay on the field longer and score. The defense, although not as talented would be well rested. They might give up some points in the beginning but by the end they would be getting turnovers.

 

I was happy after the draft but now that I have had time to think about it I am getting worried.

[xsoldier54]

There have been a lot of arguments on here about whether we should draft DL or DB and what each does for the team. I have my opinions on the matter but was wondering about a different topic.

 

Is drafting defense so prominently a good idea?

 

Think about it. If you have the best defense in the history of football then your highly drafted players will only be on the field 3 plays at a time. The other team will be 3 and out a lot. While this sounds good, it leaves you with a bunch of lesser offensive players because they were drafted so low. You get what you pay for and the offense will go nowhere. Sooner or later your superstar-laden defense will tire and give up some points. It will result in slow boring games where we lose 3-0 or 7-3.

 

If we drafted offense, the players would stay on the field longer and score. The defense, although not as talented would be well rested. They might give up some points in the beginning but by the end they would be getting turnovers.

 

I was happy after the draft but now that I have had time to think about it I am getting worried.

 

That might be true if you continually did this. The fact is that our offense proved last year that it can score points. The defense was atrocious and needed some talent. I wouldn't think that this would be a trend, just a one time thing to infuse some talent into a horrific defense.

[hondo in seattle]

So it's bad to draft defenders who are so good they create three-and-outs?

 

If we draft the best Offense in the history of football, they'll hardly be on the field because it will be One-And-Done with a TD! So then all these high offensive draft picks will be wasted because they'll never be on the field. And the defense will tire out because they have to return to the field so quickly.

[tonyjustbcuz]

There have been a lot of arguments on here about whether we should draft DL or DB and what each does for the team. I have my opinions on the matter but was wondering about a different topic.

 

Is drafting defense so prominently a good idea?

 

Think about it. If you have the best defense in the history of football then your highly drafted players will only be on the field 3 plays at a time. The other team will be 3 and out a lot. While this sounds good, it leaves you with a bunch of lesser offensive players because they were drafted so low. You get what you pay for and the offense will go nowhere. Sooner or later your superstar-laden defense will tire and give up some points. It will result in slow boring games where we lose 3-0 or 7-3.

 

If we drafted offense, the players would stay on the field longer and score. The defense, although not as talented would be well rested. They might give up some points in the beginning but by the end they would be getting turnovers.

 

I was happy after the draft but now that I have had time to think about it I am getting worried.

 

 

 

I hear ya...but, I differ somewhat on my take. I really wanted Colin Kaepernick as our 2nd pick and as you know the Bills had a different plan than a QB in round #2 and Kapernick may have been gone by then anyways, but I wanted a QB.

 

Upon further review despite not one down of football being played as of yet, I think the Bills made mostly smart moves in the draft as far as their selections. After reading extensively their are good reasons why they selected Williams, Searcy etc.....Of course you gotta love the Dareus pick!

 

I think that the Bills are not looking with a shortsightedness, and are looking to build something substantial here like Detroit has been doing the past few years. I think it's great that the Bills probably significantly upgraded their defense and could have as many as 4 true starters if football is played this season.

 

They addressed the defensive line which was the biggest problem on their roster. The Bills just could not slow down the run, and that hinders the ability to stop the 3rd down conversions, and the ability for our offense to get the ball back and score. A good defense will help our offense tremendously!

 

A more productive defense means a defense that gets off the field sooner, which in turn leads to a fresher defense in the second half and late in games at crunch time. It also means that if they can shut down teams on the run, we can dictate to them to throw more and typically are cornerbacks have been a strong group over the years. Aaron Williams plays better against the run than pass and has the ability to get to the QB as well and cause havoc. You would like to draft all the top players available but you only get to draft one player per selection and have to make the prudent choice. I think overall the Bills did that..and even their pick of Johnny White is intriguing as he is a good runner, receiver,and at special teams.

 

I think it's easy to see that this is a multi-layered plan that is built on stages and will take 3 years essentially to fruitation. Last year was in-depth evaluation of the entire roster, and I believe the Bills know exactly their needs. This year was build up the defense, and add a couple players for depth on the O line and at RB.

 

Next year will be a fun process when we draft as it will be 80% Offense (although we will plug a few holes and depth on offense during freeagency this year dependent on the CBA etc..) I feel confident in saying that the Bills will want Andrew Luck next year and may do whatever it takes to get him, but at the very least you are looking at one of 3 QB's most likely...(it's early!) Luck, Barkley, or L. Jones.

 

I think the emphasis on TE is weak, and although it's not a primary concern of Gailey I think it will be addressed as well. I think the #2 concern though would be a Left Tackle to protect the future franchise QB. I think that is smart and may be worth moving back into the first round for. If you can get out of the 2012 with Luck and move back in and get Kalil or someone else of similar talent that alone would be a successful draft even if you gave up all your other picks! Sure another WR would help, a RT if it's still a problem, but I think next year we really close in on becoming a team that is in the process of learning to win and evolving into a future contender!

 

If all goes to plan in 2012 I think in 2013 which is really far on the horizon at the moment....I think that draft is the draft to take the best available player on the board and build depth for the playoff runs in our future.

 

All that being said, I think I have been one of the biggest pessimists about the Bills future. I have disagreed more times than I can count on our past draft blunders and was very upset when we past on players like Hali Nata, Bryan Orakapo, Clay Matthews, etc....

 

I stated the day before the draft this year that if the Bills drafted Marcell Dareus DT with their first pick that I would finally believe in what they are trying to assemble and the methods they are using to get there! Well, they surprised me for once and picked the player I thought will begin the magic we had in the early 90's!

 

My bold "out there" prediction is Buffalo will win the Superbowl in 2014 after drafting defense...offense...depth...and all of it finally meshing together into a top notch cohesive unit as they win the Superbowl!!!! Buffalo 31 Detroit 28 (Bills make a game winning 43 yd fiedgoal as time expires!!!) Can't Wait!!!! Go Bills

[Bangarang]

This topic and argument has me at a loss for words. I mean seriously?

[tennesseeboy]

I'm not sure that there is a general answer to the question of drafting defensive or offensive players. If we look at our team the area that needed the most help was defense, by looking at last year's play, by looking at our change from a 4-3 to a 3-4 or even by looking at our significant inability to stop the run, which caused the other's team's offense to be on the field most of the game.

 

Given that situation I don't think there was any real option but to go defense. I might have gone offense in the second or third round to get a good offensive tackle, but other than that I think improving the defense was the top priority.

[Rockinon]

This topic and argument has me at a loss for words. I mean seriously?

I was going to something similar. Man, I wish we could just get training camp started so we can put end to this madness.

[bladiebla]

Teams like the Rams and NO in their golden years show that an awesome Offense can indeed make up for a poor (lesser) defense. However statistics show that most Superbowls are won by teams that ranked really high on defense.

 

Another factor to include is that most if not all NFL coaches coach and manage to win by limiting the chances of a loss. A great example of the other way is that highschool coach that doesn't punt based on statistical information he has come to the conclusion that it's almost always better to go for it on 4th; his statistics are based around the scoring other teams do in certain field positions and were a punt will take you. For instance his math shows that most of the time a punt from your own 20 ends up around the 50th yard line and an opponent starting with the ball on the 50 end up scoring in 90% of the cases. His philosophy is that he's better off trying to get that conversion and a new chance to score and thus win then to give the opponent the chance to do that. And he has proven that his philosphy works. Belicheat* has shown hints of being the first coach to seriously try out this tactic in the NFL but has gotten burnt a couple of times and trashed in the media and by fans for doing so. (my numbers may be off, find the research online if you want the exact numbers)

Edited May 16, 2011 by bladiebla

[ieatcrayonz]

I'm not sure that there is a general answer to the question of drafting defensive or offensive players. If we look at our team the area that needed the most help was defense, by looking at last year's play, by looking at our change from a 4-3 to a 3-4 or even by looking at our significant inability to stop the run, which caused the other's team's offense to be on the field most of the game.

 

Given that situation I don't think there was any real option but to go defense. I might have gone offense in the second or third round to get a good offensive tackle, but other than that I think improving the defense was the top priority.

I know we needed help on defense but am worried we helped it too much. If they keep generating 3 and outs and the offense is limited in the talent department the defense will eventually get tired. They could be their own worst enemy.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

I know we needed help on defense but am worried we helped it too much. If they keep generating 3 and outs and the offense is limited in the talent department the defense will eventually get tired. They could be their own worst enemy.

It appears that you've given this idea a great deal of thought and I find your musings to be both poignant and astonishingly rich.

 

I would look at it this way and I hope you find this helpful.

 

A great defense is like a large octopus but with more than 8 arms. It can stifle its prey because its prey (the other team) simply cannot defend itself from such a multi-pronged attacker. Each arm on the octopus has tentacles which have a sticky, adherent quality, much like stickem. This is where the analogy gets a bit rough because stickem has been outlawed by the NFL…but just forget about that for a minute and pretend that the use of stickem is still permissible. So you have a great defense (an octopus with more than 8 arms that wears stickem) and an offense which is simply overwhelmed by the defense… to the point that the offense will panic and give the defense the opportunity to score points. In other words, the defense is so superior to the offense that it will actually be able to outscore the offense by scores of 8-3 (safety plus defensive TD) or 2-0 (safety). Because of this, even though our offense sucks, we might still be able to outscore the other team occasionally by virtue of scoring defensive points.

 

Of course we would still lose games also by scores of say 10-9 or 3-2 or even sometimes 6-4…but the point is a great defense allows us to suck less not to mention that octopi also have the ability to squirt ink to confuse their opponents.

 

 

 

 

[Green Lightning]

Crayonz......got me scratching my head. So if the D sucks and stays on the field for a dozen plays at a time that means all the good O guys we drafted won't see the field. A good D also creates points and gives the O great field position....why the Hell am I discussing this? Jeezy Creezy let's get the damn lockout over and talk real football.

[Alphadawg7]

So it's bad to draft defenders who are so good they create three-and-outs?

 

If we draft the best Offense in the history of football, they'll hardly be on the field because it will be One-And-Done with a TD! So then all these high offensive draft picks will be wasted because they'll never be on the field. And the defense will tire out because they have to return to the field so quickly.

 

Um, points are what win games. So if we were one and done with a TD every drive we wouldn't that be a good thing and we would go undefeated forever with a scoring average of 80+points a game?

Edited May 16, 2011 by Alphadawg7

[ieatcrayonz]

It appears that you've given this idea a great deal of thought and I find your musings to be both poignant and astonishingly rich.

 

I would look at it this way and I hope you find this helpful.

 

A great defense is like a large octopus but with more than 8 arms. It can stifle its prey because its prey (the other team) simply cannot defend itself from such a multi-pronged attacker. Each arm on the octopus has tentacles which have a sticky, adherent quality, much like stickem. This is where the analogy gets a bit rough because stickem has been outlawed by the NFL…but just forget about that for a minute and pretend that the use of stickem is still permissible. So you have a great defense (an octopus with more than 8 arms that wears stickem) and an offense which is simply overwhelmed by the defense… to the point that the offense will panic and give the defense the opportunity to score points. In other words, the defense is so superior to the offense that it will actually be able to outscore the offense by scores of 8-3 (safety plus defensive TD) or 2-0 (safety). Because of this, even though our offense sucks, we might still be able to outscore the other team occasionally by virtue of scoring defensive points.

 

Of course we would still lose games also by scores of say 10-9 or 3-2 or even sometimes 6-4…but the point is a great defense allows us to suck less not to mention that octopi also have the ability to squirt ink to confuse their opponents.

This makes sense and thanks for the well thought out response. Here is the thing though: If the defensive octopus has 12 arms, one for each player and one for phsychosymantec advantage, they might keep strangling the opponent and the arms would eventually get tired. This is fine if our prey can out swim their 8 armed defensive octopus but when we can't all we'll have is a tired defense with a chromosomal defect which can't be helping at that point. Our defensive octopus will me limp and the other team's offense will swim around freely.

 

Crayonz......got me scratching my head. So if the D sucks and stays on the field for a dozen plays at a time that means all the good O guys we drafted won't see the field. A good D also creates points and gives the O great field position....why the Hell am I discussing this? Jeezy Creezy let's get the damn lockout over and talk real football.

What I am saying is you need balance. If your defense is too good it will hurt the team and your defense won't be too good anymore because they were their own worst enemy.

[flmike]

I really think you are worrying too much. The FO of the Bills looked at the team and asked themselves "What can we do with 7+ rounds of draft picks that will make the a better team down the road." Drafts rarely do much to fix a team the very next year. Only the 1st and 2nd rounders even have a chance to see the field much outside of special teams, so your worry is not really well founded. We picked up some good offense last year and the year before with an RB, WR and middle linemen. Next year will likely be more offense. It will take time to fix this hot mess so just enjoy the improvement you will see next year. If things go really well, the Bills might contend for a wild card spot, but that would take some luck, I think. Relax and enjoy the baseball season.

Edited May 16, 2011 by flmike

[NFLBighits]

Common sense says if you cant stop anyone whats the point if drafting offense oppose to drafting defense ? You have to fix whats broke and right now it's definatley more on the defense side of the ball and will need one or two more drafts to fix it but i think we had an excellent draft and are first and third pick are my favorites! Until we start giving the offense more time to score and stop the opposing team from scoring then we are getting closer !

[San Jose Bills Fan]

This makes sense and thanks for the well thought out response. Here is the thing though: If the defensive octopus has 12 arms, one for each player and one for phsychosymantec advantage, they might keep strangling the opponent and the arms would eventually get tired. This is fine if our prey can out swim their 8 armed defensive octopus but when we can't all we'll have is a tired defense with a chromosomal defect which can't be helping at that point. Our defensive octopus will me limp and the other team's offense will swim around freely.

I understand what you are saying but I think maybe you skipped over my last sentence about the ink. While you might argue (and I hope you don't) that the discharge of ink could further affect chromosomal levels, I think that factor is outweighed by the confusion that the ink would cause the opponent. Ask yourself this:

 

Is a team really "swimming around freely" if it can't see where it's going?

 

I think when you factor in the ink atop the stickem and extra arms that you're probably looking at a team that finishes with a 7-9 record. Next year the Bills draft some barracudas or possibly moray eel-type players. You can't stock a reef tank in one year.

 

I know you and I have gotten into it from time to time in the past and I'm not trying to be a deutsche but I'm really just trying to find some common ground. We can agree to disagree though and I don't really want to get into a pissing match.

Edited May 16, 2011 by San Jose Bills Fan

[reddogblitz]

Our offense was good enough last year that if we had the #1 defense in the league instead of the # 24 defense (#32 against the run) we would have been a playoff team and perhaps even won a game or two. Defense needs more help. Smart moving by drafting for D.

[BuffaloBill]

I believe we should return to the Jauron years and draft db's and special teams players. The bills can then pick up a lineman or two not to mention a QB in the later rounds or as ufda's. If the Bills had only given Jauron more time his strategy would have resulted in back to back to back SB wins.

[Grimace]

I'm going to skip over the octopus analogy and try to extract a point from the thread.

 

Balance becomes an issue when you're stocking talent in a way that you can't fully utilize. If we had a great defense with a mediocre offense and drafted all defensive players, we'd be putting good players on the bench while we had poor talent starting on offense. This is not the case; the offense was mediocre while the defense was terrible.

 

 

A thought about talent priority:

 

It seems wise to fill a defense with all 'good' players, so that there is no weak point to be attacked. An offense can succeed with poor talent at a position that is not fully utilized because they can create a gameplan to take advantage of their better players. Defense has to use all 11 players to react and stop the opponent. Offense is reliant on scheme and a handful of elite talent. Based on that logic, it would have been more productive to take elite offensive talent at the #3 pick this year, then focus on the draft with the remaining selections, as well as hour hopefully lower 1st round pick next year.

[Maddog69]

Our offense was good enough last year that if we had the #1 defense in the league instead of the # 24 defense (#32 against the run) we would have been a playoff team and perhaps even won a game or two. Defense needs more help. Smart moving by drafting for D.

Our offense was ranked just as badly as our defense. Both sides need help.

Also, if we had the #1 offense we probably would have been a playoff team too.