Donald Duck Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 (edited) Word is that score was made up- just saying News to me A cerebral quarterback who took a no name offensive line and always had them in the correct protections so they were able to give some semblance of decent pass blocking? A cerebral quarterback who took a bunch of rookie wide receivers and managed to get them all on the same page? A cerebral quarterback who was able to make his reads quickly and get rid of the ball on time to avoid unnecessary sacks? Yeah. I thought so. Nothing against Vince Young. Certainly teams will be interested when the Titans actually release him. But Fitz did a very good job last year for us and will do so again this year. Vince Young would win twice as many games under Gailey in my opinion Fitz has also thrown as many INT's as games played in the NFL( haven't made a comparison, but Fitz has to be near the top of the league in fumbles for a QB) Edited February 21, 2011 by Fig Newton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 News to me Vince Young would win twice as many games under Gailey in my opinion Fitz has also thrown as many INT's as games played in the NFL It was reported as made up before the draft. NFL confirmed the report that it was made up. Media had already run with it. Clearly the damage is/was done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald Duck Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 (edited) It was reported as made up before the draft. NFL confirmed the report that it was made up. Media had already run with it. Clearly the damage is/was done. confirmed or disputed? Scoring 6 was confirmed by several NFL scouts http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/draft/2006-03-01-young-wonderlic_x.htm Combine officials used the combine score as the official score.(16) Have a link or anything verifying it? I'm not doubting your word, but would like to have proof in case i repeat what your telling me Just because Young officially scored 16 at the combine doesn't mean he didn't score a 6 before hand. You can take the test as many times as you want, Jason Campbell took it 3 times Edited February 21, 2011 by Fig Newton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockinon Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 As someone who had done a lo of reading on the Wonderlic, my opinion, and that of people in football, is that the Wonderlic scores for RBs is probably has the least relevancy to any position. RB is about talent and vision and reaction. A lot of very good RBs have poor Wonderlics. I'm not saying Spiller is smart, I'm saying its not very relevant. Sure, he needs to learn some things and get better and realize he's not going to outrun everyone, but that's part of the jump to the NFL. Chris Johnson has a 10 on his first try but miraculously had a 25 on his second (like JP Losman, you can coach them to memorize and them retake the test but the initial score is always more in line with reality). His pre-draft scouting reports questioned his work in the classroom so the 10 seems to back that up. Does Chris Johnson suck? Nope. By the way, 20 is considered average intelligence. Adrian Peterson got a 16, well below average as well. Does he suck? Don't cherry pick stupid stats and reports to attempt to make a point unless you can adequately explain them and futher back them up. Nothing worse than saying "CJ got a 10, no wonder he sucks" and then not follow it with any proof that the 10 has specific meaning for RBs. It's even particularly laughable when simple comparisons using Wonderlic scores shows that it's not all that relevant considering his peers. FAIL Who peed in your coffee this morning? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Spiller has one year of very limited play under his belt. While I agree that what we saw of him was far from awesome, I think it's a little premature to be determining whether or not he warranted a 1st round pick. Give the kid some time. He's barely gotten his feet wet in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 As someone who had done a lo of reading on the Wonderlic, my opinion, and that of people in football, is that the Wonderlic scores for RBs is probably has the least relevancy to any position. RB is about talent and vision and reaction. A lot of very good RBs have poor Wonderlics. I'm not saying Spiller is smart, I'm saying its not very relevant. Sure, he needs to learn some things and get better and realize he's not going to outrun everyone, but that's part of the jump to the NFL. Chris Johnson has a 10 on his first try but miraculously had a 25 on his second (like JP Losman, you can coach them to memorize and them retake the test but the initial score is always more in line with reality). His pre-draft scouting reports questioned his work in the classroom so the 10 seems to back that up. Does Chris Johnson suck? Nope. By the way, 20 is considered average intelligence. Adrian Peterson got a 16, well below average as well. Does he suck? Don't cherry pick stupid stats and reports to attempt to make a point unless you can adequately explain them and futher back them up. Nothing worse than saying "CJ got a 10, no wonder he sucks" and then not follow it with any proof that the 10 has specific meaning for RBs. It's even particularly laughable when simple comparisons using Wonderlic scores shows that it's not all that relevant considering his peers. FAIL I'll add in that if you can "coach" someone up to get a better score on a test, then the test itself has very little validity in whatever it is trying to measure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald Duck Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I'll add in that if you can "coach" someone up to get a better score on a test, then the test itself has very little validity in whatever it is trying to measure. Different questions each time so I'm not sure how you could coach someone up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Different questions each time so I'm not sure how you could coach someone up Practice. It's the question structure, rather than the actual problem, that throws many people taking the test. Start to understand the logic/process behind how questions are asked/answered and its easy to see how scores can be improved on retest (no different that GMAT, LSAT, etc.). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 (edited) confirmed or disputed? Scoring 6 was confirmed by several NFL scouts http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/draft/2006-03-01-young-wonderlic_x.htm Combine officials used the combine score as the official score.(16) Have a link or anything verifying it? I'm not doubting your word, but would like to have proof in case i repeat what your telling me Just because Young officially scored 16 at the combine doesn't mean he didn't score a 6 before hand. You can take the test as many times as you want, Jason Campbell took it 3 times This article actually lends credence to your version. I've heard a few different versions. I guess we may not know for sure. If you google it there are a few different links. Even his wiki has some articles quoted. The other article I read just said it was false (is never happened), not that it was improper testing. I guess if the testing was poor one could argue the test never actually happened. http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3687374.html Edited February 21, 2011 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald Duck Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 (edited) This article actually lends credence to your version. I've heard a few different versions. I guess we may not know for sure. If you google it there are a few different links. Even his wiki has some articles quoted. The other article I read just said it was false (is never happened), not that it was improper testing. I guess if the testing was poor one could argue the test never actually happened. http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/3687374.html Thanks, and I have to agree with you, we really don't know for sure. Saying it was confirmed by several NFL scouts without proof or names doesn't really confirm anything. Practice. It's the question structure, rather than the actual problem, that throws many people taking the test. Start to understand the logic/process behind how questions are asked/answered and its easy to see how scores can be improved on retest (no different that GMAT, LSAT, etc.). I could see where practice solving mathematical problems/ equations would help increase scores Edited February 21, 2011 by Fig Newton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartacus Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Spiller has one year of very limited play under his belt. While I agree that what we saw of him was far from awesome, I think it's a little premature to be determining whether or not he warranted a 1st round pick. Give the kid some time. He's barely gotten his feet wet in the NFL. Since the average life of an NFL player is less than 4 years, 25% of his career is over with a big fat goose-egg to show for it. In Buddy we trust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K Gun Special Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Since the average life of an NFL player is less than 4 years, 25% of his career is over with a big fat goose-egg to show for it. In Buddy we trust I know, Sam Bradford had a QB rating of 76 and threw 15 interceptions. Wasted pick and his career is 1/4 over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I'm not praising him, just saying a low wonderlic score doesn't mean as much as people make it out to be. It means you're not too terribly bright I would guess? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I am keeping a tally of all the posters who say that CJ Spiller is not a good running back..... Not a I told you so guy.....but that is just so ridiculous. Maybe he got off to a slow start.....but anyone who thinks CJ Spiller is not going to be a player in this league man I dont even know what to tell you. TOO MUCH TALENT not to turn it around......and if the Bills evaluators were wrong on CJ then so was EVERBODY else.....he was picked right where he should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beebe's Kid Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 A cerebral quarterback who took a no name offensive line and always had them in the correct protections so they were able to give some semblance of decent pass blocking? A cerebral quarterback who took a bunch of rookie wide receivers and managed to get them all on the same page? A cerebral quarterback who was able to make his reads quickly and get rid of the ball on time to avoid unnecessary sacks? Yeah. I thought so. Nothing against Vince Young. Certainly teams will be interested when the Titans actually release him. But Fitz did a very good job last year for us and will do so again this year. Great Post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Since the average life of an NFL player is less than 4 years, 25% of his career is over with a big fat goose-egg to show for it. In Buddy we trust Less than 4 years? Where the hell did that number come from? You sure you're not talking about closers in baseball?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 A cerebral quarterback who took a no name offensive line and always had them in the correct protections so they were able to give some semblance of decent pass blocking? A cerebral quarterback who took a bunch of rookie wide receivers and managed to get them all on the same page? A cerebral quarterback who was able to make his reads quickly and get rid of the ball on time to avoid unnecessary sacks? Yeah. I thought so. Nothing against Vince Young. Certainly teams will be interested when the Titans actually release him. But Fitz did a very good job last year for us and will do so again this year. Before the Pittsburgh game Chan was asked if he was worried about Pitts blitz scheme. He answered "im not worried about Fitz stting up the protection so much as i am about matchups. Fitz will have us in the right spots, we just gotta win the battles" I think people seriously underestimate that importance. If your QB can handle all that like you know Manning and Brady do, suddenly your offense can do alot more and the coaches can focus on other things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 Even a total dumbass with 4.3 speed could have tore it up behind the Clemson line. All he had to do was run through those HUGE holes and outrun everyone to the EZ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartacus Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 I am keeping a tally of all the posters who say that CJ Spiller is not a good running back..... Not a I told you so guy.....but that is just so ridiculous. Maybe he got off to a slow start.....but anyone who thinks CJ Spiller is not going to be a player in this league man I dont even know what to tell you. TOO MUCH TALENT not to turn it around......and if the Bills evaluators were wrong on CJ then so was EVERBODY else.....he was picked right where he should be. no way to know where any other NFL front office had him rated, since the Bills did not give anyone a chance to challenge their assessment. -same with Maybin, would have the same for POZ- if Lynch was gone and Marv had pulled the trigger on POZ in the 1st round. same with Lynch, McCargo, etc exactly what talent did Spiller exhibit in real NFL games that so convinces you he is a stud RB to justify the 8th pick in the draft? sure did not produce like that 3rd round phenom Arian Foster, or the basically undrafted LaGarret Blount Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted February 21, 2011 Share Posted February 21, 2011 no way to know where any other NFL front office had him rated, since the Bills did not give anyone a chance to challenge their assessment. -same with Maybin, would have the same for POZ- if Lynch was gone and Marv had pulled the trigger on POZ in the 1st round. same with Lynch, McCargo, etc exactly what talent did Spiller exhibit in real NFL games that so convinces you he is a stud RB to justify the 8th pick in the draft? sure did not produce like that 3rd round phenom Arian Foster, or the basically undrafted LaGarret Blount Arian Foster was undrafted in 2009 and LaGarret Blount was undrafted too Not sure where you are getting 3rd round on foster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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