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Over the past few days, Bills Twitter has been split over Tremaine Edmunds. The Case for Edmunds: WGR’s Nate Geary and Cover 1’s Erik Turner Both have defended Edmunds and believes that he isn’t the problem. They have also said THE excuse - he’s 22! Also feels he’s a scapegoat and suffering from having a poor DL. To be fair the stuff about the DL is a good argument but I’m not sure that’s the entire issue. The case against Edmunds: Majority of Bills Twitter They will point to weakness Edmunds has shown in run support, how easily he can get fooled and lost in space, and the lack of overall impact plays. Maybe this group doesn’t know the X and O’s but they see a player who appears to have struggled on the field quite a bit. My take I normally agree with Nate and Erik but as of February 2021, I’m skeptical that Edmunds will ever live up to his potential in the defense. I don’t think he got much better and while the issue of the DL and injuries are valid, I just don’t think he’s shown that he’s a special player. I’m really hoping we see a different player because after next year there are no more excuses. No more....”but he’s only 22.” Because after 4 years the excuses need to stop. Many here were not high on Josh last offseason and look what happened. So you never know....but we need to see more. PRO EDMUNDS Against Edmunds:

In the past few weeks I have seen the gamut of "these guys are busts" to "they have been out of position" to "they (mainly Oliver) are on the verge of breaking out". What are your assessment of these two, maybe, core players to build around?

That is all.

Now that we have a good sample size, what should the Bills do with TE this off-season?

This defense is truly transformed with Milano playing. I just rewatched the game. He made multiple plays and good open field tackles. Maybe it is this scheme. Maybe he is just that good. Beane can't let him walk out the door. In an ideal world the Bills and Milano would realize they are both good for each other and hammer out a reasonable deal. Maybe with COVID and a static or falling cap number, there won't be too much money to throw at Milano by other teams. If they can't find common ground then they should tag him. Previously I said let Milano walk and use the tag for Williams at RT. Now I say do whatever they can to keep him in Buffalo for another year. Edmunds was terrible again. He took bad angles again. When he sheds a block someone let me know because it will be his first. The runs up the gut were in part due to him guessing the wrong hole and just getting blown out of the play. There is no way he played anywhere close to a ProBowl level this year. Am I missing something? Are you guys seeing something I am not? He was moved to OLB for a handful of plays. I get it 9 points, why mess with what's working. But what happens when they play a competent offense that can run the ball?

I searched for this before posting, and was surprised not to find it her on the boards yet. Mods, if I missed something, please feel free to fold it into another thread. https://www.newyorkupstate.com/buffalo-bills/2020/12/bills-matt-milano-almost-back-impact-on-aj-kleins-role-tremaine-edmunds-a-true-mlb.html "Last week against the Los Angeles Chargers, Klein was the star, finishing with a game-high 14 tackles and 1.5 sacks. But Edmunds was arguably just as good. Pro Football Focus gave Klein a 91.0 grade in run defense and Edmunds just barely lower at a 90.7. In Edmunds last three games he’s received overall grades of 62.3, 63.6, and 74.2. The highest single-game grade he registered in his first 7 games was a 55.5. "Klein played with 5x first team All Pro middle linebacker Luke Kuechly in Carolina and watched him play the position as well as anybody has done it this century. He said Edmunds is a smart player whose preparation and leadership make him stand out. He said Edmunds is a true “Mike” linebacker. “ 'When you watch him on film not many guys that are his size can move and cover like he does,' Klein said. 'To be able to be that downhill, physical guy that he is, not only his skill set physically but his skillset mentally. How he approaches the game and how he understands the game, how he studies - he is a true ‘Mike’ linebacker and that’s where he belongs. You can see him, he’s sideline to sideline making plays all across the field. ... He really is something special to watch. It’s fun to be able to play with him.' ” ------------- This should end the discussion. But it won't. There are plenty of people who think they're way smarter and know more about the Bills defense than guys who play on it or coach for it. We'll doubtless hear from them. But let's hear none of the "Well, he had to say that," nonsense, because it's just not true. All he had to say was - and this is true of every player or coach - is the Crash Davis cliches. Yeah, you can't say bad things of a teammate. But it's totally fine to restrict yourself to the usual, "He gives 110% eight days a week and 25 hours a day," or "I want him beside me in an alley fight," or "He's a good good player. Works hard and it shows," or "I want him in my foxhole with me," or "I love going to war with that guy" or "True Buffalo Bills spirit. A tough guy who always brings it," the usual copy-and-paste sayings. Those are what you have to say. When you get very specific about things, you're going far beyond what you have to say and you're saying what you believe. Klein wasn't asked about whether Tremaine is a Mike. He simply said what he sees and knows.

Watch him. Disgusting. Week in and out, same BS from him.

Especially in the 1st example I see Edmunds doing this ALL the time

Went back to watch Edmunds and the defensive front 7 specifically. Edmunds was really bad. Edmunds shot gaps many times and completely over ran the backs where he was more than capable of making stops for a loss. He was pushed around easily by linemen and could get off the blocks. His play has been questionable but he was really bad on Sunday. Update: I made a quick video of the 9 most blatantly bad play from Edmunds on Sunday-

Milano has better instincts and is more of a impact player for this defense than Edmunds. If we have to resign any of the linebackers, I would argue he is a higher priority then Edmunds and if you couldn't keep both you would let Edmunds walk.

It's been 3 years since this report. I don't see any improvement in his play - - maybe dropping off. What do you think? [Edit: this report appears to be from https://www.profootballweekly.com/2018/04/17/nfl-draft-profile-no-11-virginia-tech-lb-tremaine-edmunds/a42uauc/. Please give your sources when quoting someone else's work. Thanks. -Mod] Gap integrity looks like that of a 19-year old. Will take the wrong gap and watch runners go where he should have been. Eyes get too big — gets greedy and will overplay the ball. Takes on blockers at poor angles and gets cleaned out of plays. Has to key better on OL movement and diagnose run plays just a hair faster. Doesn’t use his hands well enough at this point to stack and shed interior OL blocks. Can get blown up by crack-back blocks — must do better job of keeping head on a swivel. Instincts are still developing in coverage — prone to getting fooled by play action and misdirection and will have trouble locating the ball at times. Sometimes gets lost in space. Plays too shallow sometimes and doesn’t cut off enough of the field. Still developing physically, too. Carries his weight well but needs to add take-on strength. Isn’t a Brandon Spikes-type of linebacker and could add a little more nastiness as a hitter.

Oliver simply can't create any problems for our opponents. He's a great athlete but a bust as a pass rusher. And, we so need an elite pass rusher. Edmunds has regressed terribly. Watch how many plays he's just running around and accomplishing nothing. He isn't strong enough to make the big tackles and certainly isn't a stud MLB that a Championship team needs.

First off, awesome win by the Bills as they beat a good team and faced a lot of adversity. While there were a lot of positives, there were also a lot of negatives. One of them was Tremaine Edmunds, especially in the run game. Seemed to me like there were a lot of missed tackles, not getting off blocks, and missing the holes. For anyone who knows the game more the game than me, would that be a fair assessment today? Go Bills, huge win at the end of the day.

Per mcD

Our defense was clearly weakened by the losses of Edmunds and Milano. Those two are essential and we don't have backups that can do what they do. We had no answer to Fitz (Fitz!) and the Dolphins attack, although at least part of that was probably due to heat and exhaustion. Nevertheless, we need those two back badly. Not this week, though. I don't expect to see either of them on the field against the Rams. It's possible Edmunds dresses, but I don't expect to see him play unless needed. Why? - Non-conference game, doesn't mean much (despite old prior threads) - Still in first place even if we lose - Still undefeated in the division and conference even if we lose - Brutal stretch of 5 consecutive AFC games coming up after (Raiders, Titans, Chiefs, Jets, Patriots) - Need them as healthy as possible for those five games, the AFC is at stake Unless they're both near 100%, give them time to rest and heal up. We're gonna need them much more in a couple of weeks.

McD just announced on a WGR interview

Welp, this is good news! https://www.syracuse.com/buffalo-bills/2020/09/bills-tremaine-edmunds-matt-milano-day-to-day-after-suffering-injuries-vs-jets.html

ESPN continued their rankings through the week with Top ten Cb's today and top ten LB's yesterday. Our guys came in hot and i cant disagree with their respective slots too much. Some good reads on our guys here! White came in behind Gilmore and Ramsey...https://www.espn.com/nfl/insider/story/_/id/29467257/ranking-nfl-top-10-cornerbacks-2020-new-wave-shutdown-stalwarts 3. Tre'Davious White, Buffalo Bills Age: 25 | Highest ranking: 1 | Lowest ranking: 8 White is coming off a huge season in Buffalo and has the league's attention in a big way. "He tackles, can play zone or man, can cover best guy, helps in run support -- the complete package," said one NFL passing game coordinator. "Only knock on him was turnovers, but he answered that this year." White tied Gilmore and Vikings safety Anthony Harris for the league lead with six interceptions. White also tied Gilmore and Steelers corner Joe Haden for third place in disrupted dropbacks -- sacks, interceptions, batted or tipped passes -- with 18. And if it wasn't obvious White likes to shadow the best player, he finished second to Gilmore in targets as the nearest defender without giving up a touchdown (84). White has the perfect setup in Buffalo, which is one of the league's most disciplined defenses with playmaking safeties Micah Hyde and Jordan Poyer anchoring the middle. Playing in a bigger market such as New York City or Dallas would only amplify White's star wattage. "His technique is impressive," said an NFL defensive assistant coach. "He's arrived as a top-flight guy." Edmunds came in behind Bobby Wagner, Lavonte David, Eric Kendricks, Darius Leonard, Demario Davis, and Deion Jones... https://www.espn.com/nfl/insider/story/_/id/29460392/ranking-nfl-top-10-linebackers-2020-best-hybrid-playmakers-d 7. Tremaine Edmunds, Buffalo Bills Age: 22 | Highest ranking: 3 | Lowest ranking: Off the ballot Edmunds is still one of the NFL's best-kept secrets. He quietly flies around New Era Field, and many of those polled gladly stack him in their top six. "He's the epitome of freaky," one AFC scout said. "He's a cornerstone guy, about the right stuff, works hard and has serious range." Added a veteran NFL offensive coach: "He'll be No. 1 on this list soon. Tremendous athlete." Edmunds is still evolving in pass defense, but he uses his range and 6-foot-5, 236-pound frame to dominate the run. Edmunds led all linebackers with 20 "run stuffs," a stop for no gain or a loss, according to Next Gen Stats. "He's still raw, and sometimes he's in the wrong run fits, but once he sees the ball, he runs it down within five yards better than anybody," said a veteran NFL linebacker. "And he'll clean up the shortcomings. He's talented enough to do that." EDIT: Instead of starting a whole new thread i'm just gonna toss Hyde's summary in here. He came in at #10 among safeties and i cant gripe too much about anyone in front of him. Adams, Harry Smith, Fitz, James, Byard, Mathieu, Simmons, eddie jackson, budda baker..... https://www.espn.com/nfl/insider/story/_/id/29474895/ranking-nfl-top-10-safeties-2020-rise-jamal-adams 10. Micah Hyde, Buffalo Bills Age: 29 | Highest ranking: 2 | Lowest ranking: Off the ballot As usual, the last spot required a tiebreaker. This time, Hyde edged out Jimmie Ward and Landon Collins. Ward, who's basically a co-No. 10 based on the voting, is a smoother athlete, but Hyde is more complete and more durable. Evaluators lauded Hyde's versatility in coverage. "He can line up on a third receiver, a tight end or a James White-type out of the backfield," one NFL coordinator said. "There aren't a lot of guys who can do that. And he's an effective blitzer and tackler." Hyde's pass disruption was down in 2019 (two deflections, one interception), but his five-interception season in 2017 showed what happens when offenses test him too much. Plus, Buffalo plays a lot of quarters coverage that forces teams to throw underneath. The Bills rarely give up explosive plays, and Hyde is a huge reason why. "Not a major athlete but has great instincts and extremely smart," an NFL passing game coordinator said

Pretty cool video piece by a local TV station showing Edmunds' mom running drills with a whistle (she's a P.E. teacher) while dad also assists. They admitted their parents wouldn't let them slack off during the pandemic, and made sure they are training and learning via IPads, etc. Not sure if I've seen anything like this. I can see what McD and BB was talking about when it comes to their family unit. I think it speaks highly about the character of the parents, and the type of habits they are handing down to their kids. Championship mentality. Pretty cool. https://www.wdbj7.com/content/news/NFL-trio-The-Edmunds-Brothers-train-as-a-family-while-NFL-facilities-and-gyms-are-closed-570061381.html

Still One of the youngest players on the roster even with the new draft class gabe Davis is younger not sure who else

I have a Allen and Edmunds Jersey that we’re sent to me in the wrong size. They are both Large’s, but fit right and are closer to a Medium. If you are interested, PM me. In fairness and wanting to give them to a regular poster, I’ll pick someone from my PM’s by the end of the week.

Alternate got bumped up Fine I’ll watch

https://theathletic.com/1480466/2019/12/25/bills-all-22-review-the-very-loud-conundrum-that-is-the-josh-allen-evaluation/?source=shared-article Joe Buscaglia is done evaluating the film from the Bills All 22. Its largely what you would expect - the Bills fought tough but couldn’t come through. Josh Allen struggled and regressed versus the NE defense. While he made the 2 big throws, he also missed many other golden opportunities that could have helped the team. He missed several shots at finding an open WR and overthrew other passes. Ironically he says that the game in NE is perfect evidence for the conundrum of Josh Allen. If you want to find evidence of his inaccuracy, it’s there. If you want to find evidence of his big play ability, it’s there. Tremaine Edmunds played terrible early on and NE took him out of the game with a lead blocker. He couldn’t get off blocks WGR the game began and this is why NE has so much running successes. He did better toward the end but the front 4 did him no favors Surprisingly, he said that Jordan Phillips has a bad game and did not show up. This led Joe to question whether the Bills should break to bank to resign him. He also said that Dawson Knox is on the brink of breakout our given his ability to separate and win 50/50 balls.