Brand J

We’ve got no proof how another coach would’ve fared with the greatest QB of all time and those defensive rosters Belichick had to work with. To say that most would’ve “struggled to make the playoffs?” Based on what evidence? What other squads in the history of the NFL that had a 1st team All Pro QB who's also a first ballot HOFer, struggled to make the playoffs? I never said Belichick wasn’t a good coach, obviously he is, but he is also a sub 500 coach without Tom Brady. Two things can be true. Is that subpar record indicative of his coaching abilities? Or is it reflective of the lack of an all time great at QB? I think we all know that answer. Belichick has his flowers, I just don’t think he’s the greatest head coach of all time. That’s to say that no other coach in the history of the league would've been able to replicate the success he had with one Tom Brady.

Probably a better defensive coordinator than HC, but Brady is the engine that made the Pats go. I’m not saying Belichick was just along for the ride, clearly his defensive schemes posed a problem for just about every team, but without Brady and his ice water veins Belichick would be just another sub 500 head coach. What would Brady be without Belichick? Maybe he wouldn’t have won as many rings because his coach wouldn’t have schemed up the defense as well as Belichick, but I do know he’d still be a Super Bowl winner. We have that evidence. Would Belichick have won ONE Super Bowl without Tom Brady? His record without the QB suggests otherwise.

Too many times I’ve seen an OL get his hands on Tremaine and drive him back like he’s on skates. I’ve seen that maybe once or twice all year with Bernard. I think the difference between the two is Bernard tries to slip past the block, while Edmunds just seemed content to occupy a blocker. I’d take Bernard over Edmunds at equal salary.

On this point, another quibble I have with Beane is his lack of patience in the draft. He always seems to trade up but there’s almost always better players that go later in the position he traded up for. I could list a ton of players that would’ve helped us in the 4th round where those picks were burned. Let the draft come to you, Beane!

Catching up on this series since the Fins are likely done after Saturday. Episode 2, Phillips pops his Achilles. Before it happened, he was walking like he knew something was wrong, but instead of pulling himself out of the game he decided to go full out and then immediately hit the ground like he got shot. Injuries suck, man, wish we could turn them off like in Madden. Had no idea how extensive his injury history was in college, I wouldn’t have drafted him in the first round.

It’s all he knows. He can’t quit it. I can’t fault him for not giving up on the dream to be a HC again. Good luck, Leslie!

I thought Frazier was just stepping away for a year and would be welcomed back as the DC in 2024? I read that here somewhere…

And there can be disagreements without one calling another a “hater,” or told to “go root for another team.” It’s a message board, nothing has ever been agreed with 100%. Well, except that Star Lotuleile was an incredibly bad signing. Oops, that was hotly debated too!

You’ve got me beat, I definitely wasn’t around for those earlier years. I don’t even know who Garry Marangi is, haha. But I’ve never called anyone here a hater, that’s a term reserved for those who are sensitive to criticism about Allen. It’s been levied in my direction plenty of times. What shade have I ever thrown at Allen? Is criticizing mistakes he makes on the field always shade?

No arguments that Allen had to get rid of the ball, the pressure was in his face. The argument is the ball placement. I wouldn’t care if Allen threw it at Gabe’s feet. Wouldn’t care if he threw it out of the endzone. Wouldn't care if he threw it wide of both players and it went to no one in particular. We still get the 3 points in every single one of those situations. Do you see the DB looking at Allen when he decides to throw in that direction? You cannot state unequivocally that Gabe would’ve boxed him out and knocked the pass down. I can’t state unequivocally that it would’ve been an INT, but I’m far more likely to believe Gabe wouldn’t have made a play to knock it down and the DB would’ve picked it off, because the DB already had eyes on Allen and was tracking the ball. Gabe still would’ve had to have the time to locate it when he turned around. And would’ve had to have the split second reaction to knock it down or box the DB out. That’s asking a lot when you don’t need to. Advantage DB.

I don’t dwell on anything, sir. I try to discuss what happened on debated plays, but if it’s not “everyone else’s fault but Josh” it starts the back and forth between you and the “hatred” accusers. The big picture of what Allen has brought to the Bills? Listen, I was a fan during the drought years, I probably missed less than 5 games, so I know the luxury we have at the QB position. It’s the only reason the Bills are relevant. I’m not hypercritical of that talent, but I can objectively state when he makes a bad decision/play, without putting the blame on everyone else. Are others to blame on plays where he does something boneheaded? Sure, sometimes. But not all the time. It’s you and others like you who think he can do no wrong and if he does wrong, it’s because someone else is at fault, be it the coordinator or his teammates. That’s the really weird part of the Allen discussion. The “Allen worship” as you state.

It was a bad throw to that spot given that Davis had not won the route at the time the ball was thrown. If he didn’t break back across the defender the DB still would’ve been in a position to intercept it. At that point he ran Gabe’s route for him. But you know the irony of it all? These pics remind me of the OT miscommunication in which Gabe was also blamed. There, he immediately won the route and continued up the field to the left where the ball should’ve been thrown, but for some reason Josh threw to the right, which means Davis would’ve had to break back across the DB he just won the route against. The end zone view of that Eagles pass couldn’t illustrate it any better that the ball was put in the wrong location. That was on a route Gabe won. This one he didn’t win, certainly not in the direction the ball was going, so he broke back across to open field. If Josh throws that, it has to go even wider left. When he looked Gabe’s way his arm was immediately going in motion, no time to assess. He banked on Gabe sitting on the route, but Gabe broke back in. If it’s not a clean win for Davis, dirt the ball and get the 3 points. That’s not what happened though.

Would’ve loved for him to get to double digit sacks, but at least he got his bonus money.

See, I’m not sure this is possible on this message board or any other. If every single poster could objectively discuss Josh Allen mistakes, there wouldn’t be the “hater” comments and red disagree Xs that dot every comment in which Allen is assessed blame. Just reading some of the replies about the INTs in this game… one poster said about the first INT that Allen “was looking Gabe’s way the entire time,” I mean that’s just factually wrong but was mentioned as a way to protect Allen’s decision making. Certain players are not allowed to be critiqued without derision. It’s strange to me, but it is what it is.

Not to mention it was a blind throw to Gabe. Josh was looking right the entire time and at the last second decided to throw to his left without assessing anything that was going on in that direction. I didn’t listen to the post game presser, but someone here had said Allen admitted he guessed. Just chuck the ball and hope. I can’t put that sort of INT on Davis, as popular as it is to do so. The second INT should’ve went to Kincaid immediately in the flat, but Josh didn’t think he’d get the first so he tried to make something happen. That one didn’t bother me as much as the first INT or the missed overthrow to Diggs.

Much more athletic than Klein.

I couldn’t get it to work…

Over 4,000 yards and 23 passing TDs to only 5 INTs. Stroud is not a typical rookie… EDIT to add: and those were his numbers for 15 games.

I’ll be somewhat rooting for the Fins as I’m tired of KC, BUT I’d love the Bills to send Patty and Maauto home next week. They’ve knocked us out of the playoffs twice, it’s high time we return the favor.

Agreed. Those Belichick teams were known for NEVER beating themselves. They’d wait for you to make a mistake. The Bills have too many self inflicted errors to be mentioned in the same breath. Both franchises were/are resilient, yes, but we’ve gotta stop making it more difficult on ourselves. Just play clean football, even if it’s boring.

First time watching Penix. All I’ve seen are missed throws and bad reads, doesn’t look like a first round QB to me. Of course, it could just be an off game.

Perusing the Steelers MBs, it looks like about 70% of their fans wanted to play the Chiefs more than the Bills. Of those that wanted the Bills, the most prominent reason was more to avoid the game on Peacock than believing they matchup better. They also dislike KC more than BUF for some reason.

I didn’t realize he got in the game.

Oh yeah, it absolutely happens. Someone had posted some hot takes about Mahomes and Burrow that mirrored the criticism Allen gets in game and it was similar in tone. People post with emotions, their takes at the time aren’t reflective of the player as a whole, but rather how that player is performing. I don’t know if CJ Stroud is getting hammered by his fans, but if he’s not right now, you can trust that it’s coming 😂 Every QB will have fans calling them out at some point, even Brady went through it. And the reason is because every QB will have up and down games. They’re human, not robots.

These are real time reactions from fans who are witnessing various levels of implosion. I don’t think a single one of these fans would tell you “Josh sucks” overall, it’s how he’s playing at the time the comment is made. Granted I’ve never said he sucks, or called him a mental midget (even if his play warranted the comment), but I’ve absolutely said “Allen is killing us right now.” Doesn’t mean I hate the QB or don’t believe he’s one of the best in the league, just means I’m commenting on his play at that moment. As others have said, he’s allowed to be criticized. He doesn’t need other fans riding in on a cape to defend him. His (good) play on the field will silence the chatter. Oh shut up.