OldTimer1960

All I have done for S is to read scouting reports. With few exceptions, the reports I’ve read describe a lot of what they used to call Strong Safeties. - I think they call them “box” safeties now. Most are described as good in run support leaving something to be desired in coverage. I don’t think that is what the Bills are ideally looking for in a passing league. Now, maybe the reports I’ve read are wrong or maybe just that there are different opinions on the prospects.

It wasn’t that he tested poorly in the 40 or vertical, he just looked really shaky running drills- gauntlet and running patterns. I understand he said he was sick then, so maybe that’s all it was, but his thin frame also gives me pause. I think he’s a good step down from Mitchell and Thomas.

I don’t think it is loaded a S. Who do you like there that you don’t have to take in the 1st or 2nd? Looks like a bunch of box safeties mostly after the first few. Boy, I haven’t studied any film on the S group, but what I’ve read doesn’t align with “loaded class of S”.

Agree on the speed point and would be happy to have Bishop, but unless they take him at 60, they won’t get him. I think there will be better players at other positions at 60 and by the late 4th I don’t think there will be any S worth picking in this class. Maybe you could get Kam Kinchens there after his disastrous combine testing, but is he fast and explosive enough to use any pick on?

This doesn’t seem to be a very good S class once past the first couple. They may not get a good S prospect at all this year. Picking as late as they are in each round and looking at >60 players being picked between their 2nd and the next pick they are better off in my view just concentrating on finding the best prospects they can regardless of positional needs.

That’s right. I support what they are doing, but it is likely to cause short-term pain on D.

Really like Pearsall, but I think he is too similar to Samuel and Shakir. He kind of has to operate in the intermediate and short middle of the field and there will already be a lot of traffic there with Kincaind, Samuel, Shakir, Diggs.Quote I disagree - I think Coleman might very well be available at or close to 60, less likely, but still possible with Franklin in my opinion. I know that he says he was sick at the Combine and the game tape is not as bad as his Combine performance, but that was a pretty questionable performance there and his weight/strength is concerning. I think Legette will be gone by mid 2nd.

I don't like the Darius Robinson idea, but I challenge the idea that not drafting WR in round 1 is "failure". To me, if Brian Thomas Jr or Mitchell is available, I am completely on-board taking whichever one is there. If they are both gone (and Harrison Jr, Odunze and Nabers of course are gone), then I would consider other positions or trading back if a suitable offer is available. I have the highest respect for the guys who can evaluate the game film of these guys and I know some good evaluators like Xavier Legette, but I think you can get him or Troy Franklin 10 picks or more later. My hesitation with Legette is that he still needs route running refinement and he is an older prospect for a 1st round pick - I'm not saying I wouldn't be happy with him, but there is maybe more risk there than with other players. Franklin doesn't ring the bell for me, either, but I'd happily take him in a trade down. Xavier Worthy is just too small for my tastes at pick 28. To be clear, if the team decides to take Legette, Worthy or Franklin at 28, I will understand and support the pick, I just have some reservations with them. I don't see any other WR that I would strongly consider at 28 - I LOVE McConkey, but I don't think I'd take him there and I think Pearsall is really only a slot guy and too similar to Shakir and Samuel.

I don’t like this idea at all. Darius Robinson can be a good story with great effort, but he is not a good starting DE unless you are really looking for just a big run stopper and if that’s the case just re-sign Shaq Lawson. I’m not a pro scout, but Darius Robinson feels more like a tweener than some great weapon to move around the DL.

Kris Jenkins in round 2 could be someone to watch.

First round is too rich for me for a 165lb receiver with real elite speed and quickness, but just OK hands. I think his floor is pretty solid as a dangerous playmaker, but one with size (and maybe durability) issues. He *could* do much better than that, but I would be concerned about durability and NFL DBs beating him up physically. I won't question a team if they take Worthy in the first, but I am hoping it isn't the Bills.

The Bills appear to have done what they could to shore up the secondary before the draft. They now at least have veterans who have played S in the NFL in FA signees Taylor Rapp and Mike Edwards. At CB they still have Rasul Douglas and Christian Benford to start with Kaiir Elam the top remaining backup - and he is questionable after 2 seasons in which the coaches did not trust him to play much. Given that Douglas is close to 30 and is expensive and neither Rapp nor Edwards have been consistent starters so it is conceivable that they take a CB or S early - even round 1 if they really like the prospect. Now, I'm not advocating using their 1st on a DB this year, but I could really imagine Beane and McDermott loving Cooper Dejean - though he has yet to workout while recovering from a broken fibula. We have reports that the Bills met with the following DBs at the Combine (list may be incomplete): - Cooper Dejean - He is the opposite of DE Chop Robinson, Dejean has outstanding production and really fits the McDermott profile. Don't know if he can play CB to 1st round level in the NFL, but he could be a dynamite S. - Kamari Lassiter (CB) - He is very quick, but he skipped the 40 at the Combine and ran 4.61 at his pro day. I think the 4.61 eliminates him from consideration before the 3rd at the earliest. Bills' new DB coach coached him previously. - Javon Bullard (S) - Could see the Bills being interested, but nowhere near the 1st round. Bills' new DB coach also had Bullard at Georgia. - Kamren Kinchens (S) - his athletic numbers at the combine were borderline undraftable, but the Bills have strong connection to Kinchens (new DB coach had him at Miami) - Calen Bullock (S) Let's discuss!

I am not yet knowledgeable about what proper hand usage looks like in pass rushers, but I was really pleasantly surprised at Chop Robinson. I watched his games against Michigan, Iowa, and Ohio State. I thought he was quite disruptive, stouter vs. the run than I expected and generated a good amount of pressure on the pass rush. I'm not pounding the table for him, but I was really surprised at what I saw after reading the concerns about his pass rush production.

I understand your point and agree mostly, but I think the play to to trade up into maybe the 3rd using the glut of later picks where the value of those picks moves the needle in the trade. The earlier of the two 4ths would maybe move them two spots up in round 1 - perhaps worth it if they could get someone like Thomas or Mitchell, but I think they might need to go further up for those guys.

I think that if a trade down is considered, it will be because they have multiple guys that they like, but not love, at key positions available to them. I’ve come around on Mitchell enough to nab him if he is available, but after him I don’t know that there will be a player that I really have enough conviction on to say no to a fair trade down proposal. At WR, Legette is a possibility, but we clearly seem higher on him than most. I don’t personally think that Franklin is so good that I couldn’t pass on him, Worthy is too small for my tastes and I don’t think Coleman is worth that pick. Could 1 or more of these guys be great? Sure, but any of them could be just OK or worse. Newton and Murphy are good enough to take there, but they do duplicate Oliver’s skill set a bit too much. Could you play Oliver and one of them on passing downs? Yep, but that front likely struggles against the run. Latu has injury concerns and Chop Robinson has production concerns. The question is, who would be interested in trading into that spot, how far would you have to go down and what would you get in return? I do think if they moved back 10 or 15 spots, they could still have at least 1 of Legette, Worthy, Franklin and McConkey left. I know that not all are the X guy that they ideally seem to need, but those are all still good WR prospects that could help the team.

The speed is a concern, but I am as concerned about his quickness/lateral movement skills too. He is very smooth with some agility for his size, but with that he has rarely gotten open in a good college conference.

I am really not crazy about Worthy in the first. He IS super fast, but he is terribly thin and he has OK hands. I get the idea that he is a deep threat for a big armed QB, but I fear he won’t stay healthy and that NFL DBs may man-handle him. I know he is quick and will avoid jams and hits sometimes, but he won’t avoid all of them. I don’t think that any other WR that might be available there is free of concern either, so I would understand the pick. I would not criticize a high upside OT. By pick 60, the options at DT, DE and S will be pretty limited. While they need each of those positions, it’s better not to reach for the position and take a better prospect at a position of lesser perceived need. I think there will be a step-back on defense no matter what they do in the draft, so get the best prospects you can regardless of need this year.

I’m not quite a hard pass, I would think about it late 2nd. He could turn out to be great, but I am worried he won’t be able to get open and he won’t dominate as much at contested catches in the league. There are many receivers I would take a chance on before him - even guys who aren’t fits as the X.

I don’t disagree with that. I wasn’t passing judgment on him as a prospect, just that he likely knew that he put his best time up. I’ve read that the Combine surface was exceptionally hard and fast this year and that many who ran at the Combine and their Pro Days are posting slower times at their Pro Day. That being said, I think the Bills could be within a small trade up distance at pick 60 to get Coleman, if they like him. I don’t think he will go in round 1 or the top 1/2 of the 2nd.

He probably knows he ran as fast as he could at the Combine. The Combine provides an even field to compare relative speeds of the players there. A different 40 time on a different track isn’t very comparable. Even if he ran 4.5 on a different surface, it doesn’t change the fact that he was considerably slower (at the 40 yd dash) than his competitors.

This is a key point. Being an outlier reduces competition for the type of players you need.

You might get to 10, but I don’t want to give up next year’s picks. From now until Allen is done, cap is going to be tight for this team. It’s a good problem to have a top QB, but it constrains your FA spending and causes you not to keep players you want to keep. They will need those picks.

It would take every pick the Bills own this year to get to the middle of round 1 and that won’t be high enough to get him.

I think you could be right - though unsure there will be a really good prospect at DE available at 28. I was pleasantly surprised at how much havoc Chop Robinson created in a couple of games I watched, while he had a few good pressures, he couldn’t get home. So, maybe on him. If they were higher in round 2 maybe Braswell. I guess some like Kneeland - I have to find and watch some of his games.

My guess: DE Braswell, WR Burton, their two CBs, and they have another DL who could be a day 3 pick. Always smart to go to the schools that get the top high school recruits like Bama, Georgia, Michigan, Ohio State… Miami should be looking at the Texas DTs after losing Wilkins. They likely have seen plenty and while Beane has final say (with McDermott), he relies on the scouting department as well.