dave mcbride Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 He is not only our best punt returner - he is one of the best punt returners in the HISTORY of the game. You obviously do not appreciate special teams or the importance of field positionIt also would be nice if the Bills knew how to use him as a WR. His catch percentage is comparable to the other receivers on the team and he can turn a game around on one play. Personally, I would love to see TO, Evans, and Roscoe on the field at the same time. I am not going to convince you or the other Roscoe haters on this board of his importance to the team or what his value could be. I do know that if we trade him (especially to a team that knows how to use him), we will regret the day we did it. If you and others are so confident that Roscoe is not that important, let's trade him to the Patriots and find out what Billy B would do with him. How confident are you about that scenario? Without good special teams play, the Bills were a 5-11 team last year. In 07, they were dreadful on both offense and defense, yet still managed to end up 7-9. That's pretty incredible. Teams near the bottom of both offense and defense usually end up 3-13. Special teams was an important part of why they squeaked out a number of games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twist_to_open Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 It seems to me that Bobby April has alot of pull in the decisions made at OBD and if they feel they can do without him then trade him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
95altima12 Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 I do not have insider, but Clayton says the Bills are still shopping Roscoe Parrish and will likely end up receiving a 5th round draft choice for him. Parrish is the best punt returner in the AFC. I know there is a glut at wr, but I don't think trading him makes sense for a 5th round draft choice. I would prob cry if they did this. I don't care if all RP did was return punts this year he is worth more then a 5th rounder. I don't know about you guys but I feel better about us putting 7 up when he is returning a punt more then when we get in the 20 in the past few seasons. HA! Trade him yes! for a 5th? I want a third for him! or a decent OL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magox Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 There is plenty of money available to trade and restructure a new contract for Brian Waters. Ship a 4th or 5th rounder with Roscoe and get it done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fewell733 Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 the only problem with Roscoe is his salary. that and that he's too small to play receiver in the NFL. It's not that he doesn't know where to go or doesn't grasp the offense, it's that quarterbacks literally cannot see him through the offensive and defensive linemen. His value is pretty much on plays designed to go right to him in the flat, reverses, end-arounds, and as a punt returner. The only reason we want to trade him though is that he's paid too much just for those services. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartacus Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 the only problem with Roscoe is his salary. that and that he's too small to play receiver in the NFL. It's not that he doesn't know where to go or doesn't grasp the offense, it's that quarterbacks literally cannot see him through the offensive and defensive linemen. His value is pretty much on plays designed to go right to him in the flat, reverses, end-arounds, and as a punt returner. The only reason we want to trade him though is that he's paid too much just for those services. then maybe we should run a few of those plays for him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 link Yeah, because teams place such a premium on right tackles ... God, I hope he's wrong. Use that pick on a guy who might be able to handle the left side after some work, okay, but not on someone who projects as an RT. Maybe the thinking is to teach Edwards to throw left handed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robkmil Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Winner! Johnson looks like a nice #4-5 receiver, and for the life of me I don't understand why we didn't see more of Jenkins at WR when Reed was out last year. Hardy is a lost cause to me at this point and I would love if the front office had the nads to pick up a 5th for him as well...if anyone would take him. I am happy with Evans, Reed, Owens with spells by Johnson, an upgrade at TE, and McKelvin attempting to not do something stupid in the return game. When you are paying Roscoe for what amounts to similar production that McKelvin seems to be able to give you.....I have no problem with a trade. wow, your giving up pretty early on Hardy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robkmil Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 He is not only our best punt returner - he is one of the best punt returners in the HISTORY of the game. You obviously do not appreciate special teams or the importance of field positionIt also would be nice if the Bills knew how to use him as a WR. His catch percentage is comparable to the other receivers on the team and he can turn a game around on one play. Personally, I would love to see TO, Evans, and Roscoe on the field at the same time. I am not going to convince you or the other Roscoe haters on this board of his importance to the team or what his value could be. I do know that if we trade him (especially to a team that knows how to use him), we will regret the day we did it. If you and others are so confident that Roscoe is not that important, let's trade him to the Patriots and find out what Billy B would do with him. How confident are you about that scenario? We also drafted the best punt returner in college football last year. He could probably make the switch, Mcgee would be a better than average punt returner and fred Jackson did great when he filled in for Roscoe last year. The other thing all of these guys also contribute to another part of the team an dparish doesn't. Parrish is now the 5th WR on the team. Welker was good before going to NE, parrish also only scored 1 td lst year. if we can get a goor pick then we obviously do it because we hav eplayers that can fill his role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 wow, your giving up pretty early on Hardy Based on a sampling of his posts, I'd say he is just stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steely Dan Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Winner! Johnson looks like a nice #4-5 receiver, and for the life of me I don't understand why we didn't see more of Jenkins at WR when Reed was out last year. Hardy is a lost cause to me at this point and I would love if the front office had the nads to pick up a 5th for him as well...if anyone would take him. I am happy with Evans, Reed, Owens with spells by Johnson, an upgrade at TE, and McKelvin attempting to not do something stupid in the return game. When you are paying Roscoe for what amounts to similar production that McKelvin seems to be able to give you.....I have no problem with a trade. Put down the crack pipe and take a nap and come back with a clear head. It's a numbers game. One of the receivers will be cut during TC. Why not get something for RP? A fifth is ridiculous for him. A fourth at the minimum is what I think would be the beginning of fair. A third rounder is what I really think he's worth. If the Bills can trade him as part of a trade for Scheffler then cool. I don't think Scheffler for RP is going to happen. Scheffler is worth more than RP. If they can get Scheffler for RP and a 5th round pick then go for it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwight Drane Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 wow, your giving up pretty early on Hardy If the Bills are in "admit we made a mistake" mode and are clearing out all of their underperformers.....they need to admit Hardy was not worth the pick, even with a healthy knee. Hardy is much like Roscoe in that he doesn't know where to be on the field and is pretty much going to run a few patterns for you. Has Roscoe improved much at that in the time he has been here? And Roscoe has much more quickness with the ability to get open. Hardy's only asset seems to be his height. Now that we have a guy like Owens, and seem to be looking at a legit TE, Hardy seems a non-factor. In reality there is no way the front office admits a mistake so soon after making it, and now they have the built-in excuse that Hardy bust his knee up if/when he doesn't pan out. I'm just trying to be hopeful that they've seen the light and that it makes sense to take your medicine in recouping low draft picks for underperformers than to overpay them for poor production the rest of their careers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwight Drane Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Based on a sampling of his posts, I'd say he is just stupid. Et tu Deane? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dutmost Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 It's getting to the point where I simply don't care what Bills Management does anymore..I got excited with the TO signing, now this crap before the draft has simply quelled my expectations again. What did the Bills think they were getting when they drafted Parrish in the 2nd round a few years ago in the first place...Trading him for a 4th rounder is ridiculous. The guy is a game changer, good at what he does and the Bills simply need to figure out a way to get him more touches...You bring in TO to help the offense and then get rid of Peters..makes no sense... Pro Bowl caliber Left Tackles are the hardest positions to fill in the NFL besides QB..Now Langston Walker is going to protect the kid this year. Expect Owens to complain about getting the damn ball and don't expect Evans to have time to get down field before the party in the backfield. Personally, I can't blame Peters for shutting it down....character, loyalty and integrity are traits that must be reciprocated in business. The Bills found and developed an undrafted tight end from Arkansas who turned into an above average Left Tackle who they wanted to continue to treat like an undrafted free agent, practice squad talent.. Wilson, should've made it right last spring..Guess what..If your draft picks happen turn out to be players you thought they were or might become you're are going to have to pay the piper eventually Ralph...I know, I know if I don't like it stay home and find another team to support.. bull sh--.....I have simply come to the realization as a fan that I will never see Buffalo Bills play in another Super Bowl in my lifetime..either because of the futile lack of effort to put a quality product on the field by this current administration or because the team simply decided to move from their roots in Western New York. It was painful last year watching former bills like Wire and Leonhard who are the ultimate high motors guys with avg athleticism, big hearts, high football IQs and great teammates start for playoff teams. You have to have synergy in the locker room and on the field....until that changes with this organization don't expect much... You can have all the talent in the world but if your ego is bigger than the team you won't sniff success.. These Bills lack leadership and role models and I don't see anybody on that team that brings a lunchpale to work.. The 90's Bills were full of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 If the Bills are in "admit we made a mistake" mode and are clearing out all of their underperformers.....they need to admit Hardy was not worth the pick, even with a healthy knee. Hardy is much like Roscoe in that he doesn't know where to be on the field and is pretty much going to run a few patterns for you. Has Roscoe improved much at that in the time he has been here? And Roscoe has much more quickness with the ability to get open. Hardy's only asset seems to be his height. Now that we have a guy like Owens, and seem to be looking at a legit TE, Hardy seems a non-factor. In reality there is no way the front office admits a mistake so soon after making it, and now they have the built-in excuse that Hardy bust his knee up if/when he doesn't pan out. I'm just trying to be hopeful that they've seen the light and that it makes sense to take your medicine in recouping low draft picks for underperformers than to overpay them for poor production the rest of their careers. We are saying this after less then one season when we knew he was raw when we drafted him? W.O.W. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidas Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Based on a sampling of his posts, I'd say he is just stupid. No argument there. I was going to dissect his post but I decided to just close my eyes and hope it wasn't there when I came back. Much less frustrating that way, little aftermath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwight Drane Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 We are saying this after less then one season when we knew he was raw when we drafted him? W.O.W. I don't remember him coming in here as "raw". I remember him getting drafted and he was expected to start opposite Evans at some point during the season. The excuses started to come as it became obvious he wasn't going to be anywhere near an impact player. When the front office comes out and tells us they didn't know he only ran set plays in college and never ran adjustment routes.....that is pretty sad when taking a guy 2nd at a position of need. Given Hardy's potential to learn on the fly....I am not expecting much improvement. At best you end up with a role player that has a few tailored plays written for him. After watching Russell Copeland and James Hardy for the same amount of time in the NFL.....I think my money is safe when I say Copeland is a better player and will end up with better stats. Instead of many here that want to throw out Moulds' name for slow development.....go pull up some tapes of Bucky Brooks and then try to use that arguement with a straight face. Pyschology is a b!tch. People need to learn how to separate what they want from what the reality of the situation is. The reality is I find it hard to believe you could get a 4th round pick for Hardy from even the neediest of teams. I am salivating to see just how good an off-balanced, poor strength, mediocre hands, foggy headed, molases route running WR develops over time after coming off major knee surgery. The tenor of this post isn't aimed at you John....but to the 120 teenie-boppers that need to watch a little football and live a little life before they start flinging their dung laden opinions around as absolute facts with added insults. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartacus Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 I don't remember him coming in here as "raw". I remember him getting drafted and he was expected to start opposite Evans at some point during the season. The excuses started to come as it became obvious he wasn't going to be anywhere near an impact player. When the front office comes out and tells us they didn't know he only ran set plays in college and never ran adjustment routes.....that is pretty sad when taking a guy 2nd at a position of need. Given Hardy's potential to learn on the fly....I am not expecting much improvement. At best you end up with a role player that has a few tailored plays written for him. After watching Russell Copeland and James Hardy for the same amount of time in the NFL.....I think my money is safe when I say Copeland is a better player and will end up with better stats. Instead of many here that want to throw out Moulds' name for slow development.....go pull up some tapes of Bucky Brooks and then try to use that arguement with a straight face. Pyschology is a b!tch. People need to learn how to separate what they want from what the reality of the situation is. The reality is I find it hard to believe you could get a 4th round pick for Hardy from even the neediest of teams. I am salivating to see just how good an off-balanced, poor strength, mediocre hands, foggy headed, molases route running WR develops over time after coming off major knee surgery. The tenor of this post isn't aimed at you John....but to the 120 teenie-boppers that need to watch a little football and live a little life before they start flinging their dung laden opinions around as absolute facts with added insults. wait a minute Hardy is tall that by itself should get him to a Pro Bowl or two all that other stuff like running routes and catching the ball is way overrated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BEAST MODE BABY! Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 Hardy's only asset seems to be his height. What's your asset? Because, I can't seem to find any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dwight Drane Posted April 18, 2009 Share Posted April 18, 2009 What's your asset? Because, I can't seem to find any. You forgot to add to your signature line: James "I didn't see her holding the baby when I hit her!" Hardy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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