John from Riverside Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 We dont want "fat run stopping guys" in our supposid Tampa 2 defense.... But the idea of trading for McFarland was real and had Tampa not been asking for so much we probably would have grabbed him..... SOOOOOO......ligher quicker DT's but interest in McFarland? Inconsistant..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 We dont want "fat run stopping guys" in our supposid Tampa 2 defense.... But the idea of trading for McFarland was real and had Tampa not been asking for so much we probably would have grabbed him..... SOOOOOO......ligher quicker DT's but interest in McFarland? Inconsistant..... 808968[/snapback] TB's defensive coordinator, Marty Kiffin, is a gem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAMIEBUF12 Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 and on top of that tony dungy who is supposed to be the "guru" of tampa cover two is the coach who just traded for booger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluv Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 We dont want "fat run stopping guys" in our supposid Tampa 2 defense.... But the idea of trading for McFarland was real and had Tampa not been asking for so much we probably would have grabbed him..... SOOOOOO......ligher quicker DT's but interest in McFarland? Inconsistant..... 808968[/snapback] Well actually he is only 300 lbs and is more of a pass rusher in the Warren Sapp mold whom he replaced but he would be the biggest DT on the Colts roster. For the money, 2nd rnd draft pick and his production the past 3 seasons I wouldn't add him to the Bills roster. But tell you the truth I wish to the minimum had kept Adams or added a Grady Jackson in the offseason. for since we rotate DT' anyway, why not keep a fat body in their on running downs or goaline; they can't be worse than Anderson! Ideally I wish we still had Phat Pat but that is another topic... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 We dont want "fat run stopping guys" in our supposid Tampa 2 defense.... But the idea of trading for McFarland was real and had Tampa not been asking for so much we probably would have grabbed him..... SOOOOOO......ligher quicker DT's but interest in McFarland? Inconsistant..... 808968[/snapback] Never mind the little fact that booger played for the buccs, you know, the buccs from tampa who revolutionized the Tampa-2 defense, that we currently employ? Booger is listed at 300 btw. He's probably a bit bigger, but hes still a prototypical good cover-2/tampa-2 DT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reed83HOF Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 Well actually he is only 300 lbs and is more of a pass rusher in the Warren Sapp mold whom he replaced but he would be the biggest DT on the Colts roster. For the money, 2nd rnd draft pick and his production the past 3 seasons I wouldn't add him to the Bills roster. But tell you the truth I wish to the minimum had kept Adams or added a Grady Jackson in the offseason. for since we rotate DT' anyway, why not keep a fat body in their on running downs or goaline; they can't be worse than Anderson! Ideally I wish we still had Phat Pat but that is another topic... 808982[/snapback] Only 300 pounds..LOL I'm sure the DT's and OL will be addressed in the offseason...well...they better be... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozymandius Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 We dont want "fat run stopping guys" in our supposid Tampa 2 defense.... But the idea of trading for McFarland was real and had Tampa not been asking for so much we probably would have grabbed him..... SOOOOOO......ligher quicker DT's but interest in McFarland? Inconsistant..... 808968[/snapback] Not inconsistent. Booger fits the mold we're looking for. Not sad we didn't get him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 But tell you the truth I wish to the minimum had kept Adams 808982[/snapback] The media here in Cincy have finally stopped their love fest about Sam being a run stopper. His quick move off the snap dried up in their 2 defeats... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayFinkle Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 We dont want "fat run stopping guys" in our supposid Tampa 2 defense.... But the idea of trading for McFarland was real and had Tampa not been asking for so much we probably would have grabbed him..... SOOOOOO......ligher quicker DT's but interest in McFarland? Inconsistant..... 808968[/snapback] When Dick was HC of Chicago, and their D was one of the best in the league, he had Keith Traylor and Ted Washington as his tackles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pBills Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 I'm just curious about it because Tampa didn't receive to much in return for the trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stussy109 Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 Well actually he is only 300 lbs and is more of a pass rusher in the Warren Sapp mold whom he replaced but he would be the biggest DT on the Colts roster. For the money, 2nd rnd draft pick and his production the past 3 seasons I wouldn't add him to the Bills roster. But tell you the truth I wish to the minimum had kept Adams or added a Grady Jackson in the offseason. for since we rotate DT' anyway, why not keep a fat body in their on running downs or goaline; they can't be worse than Anderson! Ideally I wish we still had Phat Pat but that is another topic... 808982[/snapback] What production have we gotten out of 2nd rd picks anyways? We usually trade them off. We currently have Kelsay, Parrish, Reed and traded off Henry. SO compare McFarland to those guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 I'm just curious about it because Tampa didn't receive to much in return for the trade. 809015[/snapback] Other than off-loading a $$$$$ contract for a 30+ year-old DT who will only get worse with age? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluv Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 The media here in Cincy have finally stopped their love fest about Sam being a run stopper. His quick move off the snap dried up in their 2 defeats... 808994[/snapback] Yeah but if he was in a rotation such as the obe we used versus him being in 95% of the snaps he'd to the very minimal be serviceable, especially when motivated to play hard to get more snaps. He would be btter than Anderson anyday! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluv Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 What production have we gotten out of 2nd rd picks anyways? We usually trade them off. We currently have Kelsay, Parrish, Reed and traded off Henry. SO compare McFarland to those guys. 809028[/snapback] But his salary was alittle too high for his production and if he doesn't restructure then you will have an overpaid player. Or if he is cut then you're out of a player and a pick. I'll pass on him for he is not the true run plugger that we need and besides we are rebuilding this year and not in contention; let's just wait until the draft or free agency to get possibly a better and/or cheaper option at DT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 I'm just curious about it because Tampa didn't receive to much in return for the trade. 809015[/snapback] No? The Colts only got a 2nd and a 5th for trading away Marshall Faulk in his prime. I think that because the Bills give so many away and select duds as of late, many Bills Fans don't understand how vital draft picks are in terms of building a good football team. Now, couple in the fact that Ralph has less money to sign UFAs than a huge majority of the NFL owners, and the draft is even more important. Levy has already shown a tendency to hand over picks to other football teams, and even refuse much needed extra picks when offered them via trade. This time he did the right thing imo. I would rather have the 2nd round pick (which will probably be an early one). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CircleTheWagons Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 I think that because the Bills give so many away and select duds as of late, many Bills Fans don't understand how vital draft picks are in terms of building a good football team. ... Levy has already shown a tendency to hand over picks to other football teams, and even refuse much needed extra picks when offered them via trade. 809201[/snapback] Please. Both these lines are so over the top they had me reaching for my ignore button. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikie2times Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 We dont want "fat run stopping guys" in our supposid Tampa 2 defense.... But the idea of trading for McFarland was real and had Tampa not been asking for so much we probably would have grabbed him..... SOOOOOO......ligher quicker DT's but interest in McFarland? Inconsistant..... 808968[/snapback] They read KzooMike's posts Kidding aside it probably has more to do with McFarland coming from the Cover 2. I don't expect us to change the approach much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 Hmmmm...I've got to admit if I were to line up against a guy they called booger, I'd be a little nervous and distracted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 Please. Both these lines are so over the top they had me reaching for my ignore button. 809217[/snapback] OK, I take it back. Everything has been looking great in terms of our recent drafts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CircleTheWagons Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 OK, I take it back. Everything has been looking great in terms of our recent drafts. 809232[/snapback] Glad I convinced you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 Please. Both these lines are so over the top they had me reaching for my ignore button. 809217[/snapback] priceless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 priceless 809300[/snapback] What is it that makes you just blindly support every move that marv makes? Is it that you and him kind of look the same, and have the same build? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 What is it that makes you just blindly support every move that marv makes? Is it that you and him kind of look the same, and have the same build? 809308[/snapback] Elder bashing! Elder bashing!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 What is it that makes you just blindly support every move that marv makes? Is it that you and him kind of look the same, and have the same build? 809308[/snapback] I dont blindly support every move marv makes. I too questioned the draft. If you were at the bar with me, these were my exact words when the trade up was announced. "I hope we draft mangold or justice, but i think its gonna be McCargo." I was also as shocked as everyone at the whitner pick. That being said, he picked some good players. I am willing to give marv more than 1 draft/offseason before i call for his head. I fully expect him to concentrate our draft elsewhere next year like LB, OL, and DE. I also expect him to take another day 1 corner, because nate's gonna walk. If we dont draft toward those need positions, then i will really begin to question him. I know TD did a horrendous job of building our lines. But it is completely unfair to lump Marv's 1 offseason with TD's 5. They are 2 different eras. And if i look like marv when i am 80, that will kick ass. Marv is a straight pimp. You know he goes out at night and macks the hoes on chippewa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bungee Jumper Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 What is it that makes you just blindly support every move that marv makes? Is it that you and him kind of look the same, and have the same build? 809308[/snapback] What, he should blindly support you instead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 I dont blindly support every move marv makes. I too questioned the draft. If you were at the bar with me, these were my exact words when the trade up was announced. "I hope we draft mangold or justice, but i think its gonna be McCargo." I was also as shocked as everyone at the whitner pick. That being said, he picked some good players. I am willing to give marv more than 1 draft/offseason before i call for his head. I fully expect him to concentrate our draft elsewhere next year like LB, OL, and DE. I also expect him to take another day 1 corner, because nate's gonna walk. If we dont draft toward those need positions, then i will really begin to question him. I know TD did a horrendous job of building our lines. But it is completely unfair to lump Marv's 1 offseason with TD's 5. They are 2 different eras. And if i look like marv when i am 80, that will kick ass. Marv is a straight pimp. You know he goes out at night and macks the hoes on chippewa. 809316[/snapback] All right then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 What, he should blindly support you instead? 809317[/snapback] Nah. I seem to cause him a great deal of nervous frustration. Hey, I don't really blame him at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted October 18, 2006 Share Posted October 18, 2006 Marv is a straight pimp. You know he goes out at night and macks the hoes on chippewa.809316[/snapback] Straight pimp? Macks the hoes? Christ, I'm so !@#$ing old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerJ Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 McFarland isn't very big as DTs run. He's very short, so that makes he girth greater than some others in that weight range. I think he's 6 foot or a bit less. He is very quick though, which is why he's considered a good Tampa 2 DT. I would like to have seen him in Buffalo. I don't know what the obstacle was for Marv to pull the trigger. Whether it was the price of a trade of "Booger's" salary or what. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daquixers_is_back Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 And if i look like marv when i am 80, that will kick ass. Marv is a straight pimp. You know he goes out at night and macks the hoes on chippewa. 809316[/snapback] Thats too much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 Nah. I seem to cause him a great deal of nervous frustration. 809331[/snapback] Why do you run and hide whenever someone makes a valid point that isnt "draft OL with every pick for the next 10 years" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 Why do you run and hide whenever someone makes a valid point that isnt "draft OL with every pick for the next 10 years" 809928[/snapback] Ah Ramius........Since 1996, the first picks that the Bills have drafted (notice I said first picks, not exclusively 1st round picks, OK?) have consisted of 3 wideouts, 3 defensive backs, and 2 runnung backs. That is no less than 8 "skill players" in 11 drafts, and some of them were noted for being rather small. See for yourself. I make the case that this resulted in losses for our Bills. Put it this way.....do you think that things would have been better or worse had we gone in a more traditional, proven direction? Year after year, we have the same problems. Blocking IS one of them. Stopping the run is another. These are the key elements to winning games. You know this. You have stated as such. I think that the fundamental difference between our opinions is that you have WAY more faith in Levy than I do. As another poster stated so well.....when the Bills (while Levy was still here) started drafting DBs year after year, this directly coincided with when the team began losing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 Ah Ramius........Since 1996, the first picks that the Bills have drafted (notice I said first picks, not exclusively 1st round picks, OK?) have consisted of 3 wideouts, 3 defensive backs, and 2 runnung backs. That is no less than 8 "skill players" in 11 drafts, and some of them were noted for being rather small. See for yourself. I make the case that this resulted in losses for our Bills. Put it this way.....do you think that things would have been better or worse had we gone in a more traditional, proven direction? Year after year, we have the same problems. Blocking IS one of them. Stopping the run is another. These are the key elements to winning games. You know this. You have stated as such. I think that the fundamental difference between our opinions is that you have WAY more faith in Levy than I do. As another poster stated so well.....when the Bills (while Levy was still here) started drafting DBs year after year, this directly coincided with when the team began losing. 810004[/snapback] good points. a lot of the skill picks were made at the expense of a decent line. And i think we would be better had more resources been spent on the lines. (my dad used to harp on this year in and year out in the mid-late 90's and early 2000's) butler, and whatever input levy had, didnt do terribly well stocking the team in the late 90's. the difference we have in views of marv, is that you feel he will stick to how he ran things when butler was a GM. How much of those drafts were marv's ideas, i dont know. I think he is building a team, and started with the defense. i feel that he'll address our other needs this coming offseason, including OL, LB, and DE. MArv has always said that to win you have to run and stop the run. I am hoping and believing he sticks to his guns, and makes a good effort to shoring up our OL this offseason. He'll have a season under his belt as GM, and will have seen the team play and will make the adjustments necessary. on our existing line, i see the biggest needs in the offseason at LT and RG. Sure upgrades would help at the other positions, and it may take a few years to build a dominant line, but this team can go so much father even with an above average line. And i think that by addressing LT and RG in the offseason we can be an above average line next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted October 19, 2006 Share Posted October 19, 2006 (my dad used to harp on this year in and year out in the mid-late 90's and early 2000's) 810085[/snapback] This goes a long way in terms of explaining how my posts get on your nerves so much. My regards to your Dad, a smart Bills fan! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shamrock Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 Elder bashing! Elder bashing!!! 809315[/snapback] Elder Bashing? I haven't seem him listed in any draft guides. What's his 40? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadBuffaloDisease Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 Ah Ramius........Since 1996, the first picks that the Bills have drafted (notice I said first picks, not exclusively 1st round picks, OK?) have consisted of 3 wideouts, 3 defensive backs, and 2 runnung backs. That is no less than 8 "skill players" in 11 drafts, and some of them were noted for being rather small. See for yourself. I make the case that this resulted in losses for our Bills. Put it this way.....do you think that things would have been better or worse had we gone in a more traditional, proven direction? The Bills took Mike Williams in 2002. And judging by the success rate of 1st round OL that past 10 years, outside of guys taken in the top-3 that the Bills never had a shot at, it's more of a crap shoot than anything else. I mean look at Robert Gallery. He was everyone's #1 stud. He sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daquixers_is_back Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 The Bills took Mike Williams in 2002. And judging by the success rate of 1st round OL that past 10 years, outside of guys taken in the top-3 that the Bills never had a shot at, it's more of a crap shoot than anything else. I mean look at Robert Gallery. He was everyone's #1 stud. He sucks. 810625[/snapback] Good point. Good post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fla Bills Fan Posted October 20, 2006 Share Posted October 20, 2006 Booger is a decent player when healthy. He isn't healthy all that often. He is set to earn way to much $ on a contract he signed while Rich McKay was GM of the Bucs. The Colts over paid for him (in my opinion) with a #2 draft pick & the contract he carries (maybe they can get him to renegotiate). I also think the Colts window is closing as someone else posted and that is why they overpaid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pirate Angel Posted October 21, 2006 Share Posted October 21, 2006 Tampa 2, 4-3, 3-4 who cares a good defensive tackle is a good defensive tackle some stop the run better and some pash rush better, We need to cut all this scheme bull sh-- and go get some offensive and defensive linemen that can and have proven that they can play football at a high level, Bargain Basement players are great when theres a stud next to them to draw attention, but Bargain basement players lined up with bargain basement players is a blueprint for a team that will get knocked off the ball, Why cnt make a legitimate offer to a good free agent linemen or a reasonable offer for trade, Maybe our rookies will develop into solid players, who knows Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JStranger76 Posted October 21, 2006 Share Posted October 21, 2006 Good post pmr78 I agree. I think schemes are overrated myself. Players win games more than shemes and coaching more often than not. Once in a while the better team will lose due to coaching( Bills vs. Giants SuperBowl ) but most of the time it comes down to having the proper talent willing to play as a team. Sorry to beat the dead horse further but our lines, both of em', are short on talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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