Diggs' Drama

[Alphadawg7]

2 hours ago, mannc said:

Normally, I would agree with this, but in the fifth round of the 2023 draft, Beane was obviously in the market for a WR.  By that time, about 20 WRs were already off the board, and two of the ones left were Shorter, a lifetime practice squad level player, and Puka Nacua, a literal Hall of Fame talent at the same position…and Beane picked the scrub…it’s absolutely fair to rip him for that.

Then you need to rip the other 32 GMs, including Rams, for passing on him many times on his way to falling from what should have been an easy top 5 pick to 5th round.  
 

 

Edited 12 hours ago by Alphadawg7

[Pete]

11 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Diggs was still a Bill in that draft and no one had any idea Puka was gonna be what he is.  If they did he wouldn’t have lasted as long as he did making all 32 GMs, even the rams, look like fools for not taking him sooner

And what has Kyle Williams done?  

28.7 yards per reception 

[Augie]

7 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Then you need to rip the other 32 GMs, including Rams, for passing on him many times on his way to falling from what should have been an easy top 5 pick to 5th round.  
 

 

 

Using hindsight like that regarding draft choices is often one indication of a feeble mind, imo. You can almost always find a better choice for any draft slot with the benefit of hindsight. Tom Brady. Case closed. 

[FireChans]

28 minutes ago, Augie said:

 

Using hindsight like that regarding draft choices is often one indication of a feeble mind, imo. You can almost always find a better choice for any draft slot with the benefit of hindsight. Tom Brady. Case closed. 

Is the counterpoint that Keon Coleman wasn’t actually a bad pick, because he was projected to go around the early second round, and it’s only with the benefit of hindsight that we say we should have drafted McConkey?

 

Should the Browns or Jets or Cardinals GMs not feel bad because it’s only with the benefit of hindsight that they should’ve taken Josh or Lamar over Baker, Darnold and Rosen? 
 

Doesn’t feel right to me.

[NewEra]

1 hour ago, FireChans said:

Is the counterpoint that Keon Coleman wasn’t actually a bad pick, because he was projected to go around the early second round, and it’s only with the benefit of hindsight that we say we should have drafted McConkey?

 

Should the Browns or Jets or Cardinals GMs not feel bad because it’s only with the benefit of hindsight that they should’ve taken Josh or Lamar over Baker, Darnold and Rosen? 
 

Doesn’t feel right to me.

that’s the draft man.  Literally every GM ever has blundered several times.  Most blunder several times in each draft.  
 

Who’s the best GM?  Howie drafted Reagor or Jefferson (amongst others). We could go on and on debating both sides of the argument.  
 

Make a mistake, move on.  If a GM feels bad years later, they shouldn’t be a GM.  It’s the business.  The nfl draft isn’t all about talent and coaching them up.  it’s hard to know exactly the type of person that you’re drafting.  The person is who will fail or succeed.  Tough to dig that deep and get all true answers.  

 

 

[FireChans]

33 minutes ago, NewEra said:

that’s the draft man.  Literally every GM ever has blundered several times.  Most blunder several times in each draft.  
 

Who’s the best GM?  Howie drafted Reagor or Jefferson (amongst others). We could go on and on debating both sides of the argument.  
 

Make a mistake, move on.  If a GM feels bad years later, they shouldn’t be a GM.  It’s the business.  The nfl draft isn’t all about talent and coaching them up.  it’s hard to know exactly the type of person that you’re drafting.  The person is who will fail or succeed.  Tough to dig that deep and get all true answers.  

 

 

So we just throw out GMs draft records because it's all hindsight and everyone misses occasionally?  Is that right?

Edited 2 hours ago by FireChans

[TheFunPolice]

Maybe this is the week Diggs starts showing up Maye after he drops passes 

[Alphadawg7]

3 hours ago, Pete said:

28.7 yards per reception 

 

The amount of over the top nonsense you insist on posting to manipulate your bias is unreal.  He has FIVE career catches, and 1 was 72 yards skewing his YPC.  And for a team that has bigger WR needs than we do with an MVP candidate QB...he has FIVE catches.  

 

You make it so hard to have a real conversation with this kind of stuff

 

Edited 1 hour ago by Alphadawg7

[finn]

10 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Then you need to rip the other 32 GMs, including Rams, for passing on him many times on his way to falling from what should have been an easy top 5 pick to 5th round.  
 

 

True, but you could say the same for almost ever player and GM in draft history, since none of them traded their entire draft to pick Tom Brady and other the other HOF players. That doesn't mean GMs are beyond criticism. I think Beane's done a good job overall given the draft position he has to work with every year, but there's no question he and his staff are deficient in their WR evaluations, to the extent that they should probably bring in new scouts and stage an intervention for Beane. He's striking out looking every draft, waiting for the perfect pitch then whiffing when he does swing. 

[NewEra]

38 minutes ago, FireChans said:

So we just throw out GMs draft records because it's all hindsight and everyone misses occasionally?  Is that right?

looking back at the draft in hindsight and discussing missing on a 5th rd pick is just dumb.  Every GM in the league took an L on Nacua, even Snead took Stetson Bennett, nick hampton, Warren McClendon and Davis Allen before him.  
He was the 20th WR taken.  
 

We took Shorter ahead of Nacua. it was a bad choice.  I’m sure Beane has though, I wish I took Puka over Shorter… but I’ll never look at a rd 5-7 guy  and say “we could’ve had X player l, but we took Y player instead”.  The same could be said for every GM.  Said player didn’t have much value according to everyone.   
 

when you hit on a day 3 pick, it’s a win for a GM.  When you miss on one, join the majority 

 

11 minutes ago, finn said:

True, but you could say the same for almost ever player and GM in draft history, since none of them traded their entire draft to pick Tom Brady and other the other HOF players. That doesn't mean GMs are beyond criticism. I think Beane's done a good job overall given the draft position he has to work with every year, but there's no question he and his staff are deficient in their WR evaluations, to the extent that they should probably bring in new scouts and stage an intervention for Beane. He's striking out looking every draft, waiting for the perfect pitch then whiffing when he does swing. 

He’s striking out looking every draft?  🤣 

 

I agreed with everything you said up til then.  Thats just not correct.  

[Figster]

21 minutes ago, finn said:

True, but you could say the same for almost ever player and GM in draft history, since none of them traded their entire draft to pick Tom Brady and other the other HOF players. That doesn't mean GMs are beyond criticism. I think Beane's done a good job overall given the draft position he has to work with every year, but there's no question he and his staff are deficient in their WR evaluations, to the extent that they should probably bring in new scouts and stage an intervention for Beane. He's striking out looking every draft, waiting for the perfect pitch then whiffing when he does swing. 

Beane has also traded then Bills WR1 Sammy Watkins away.  Bills WR1 Stephon Diggs away without sufficient replacements.

 

The Bills young GM Brandon Beane has clearly failed in one of the most important positions in football IMO. WR

[Alphadawg7]

10 minutes ago, finn said:

True, but you could say the same for almost ever player and GM in draft history, since none of them traded their entire draft to pick Tom Brady and other the other HOF players. That doesn't mean GMs are beyond criticism. I think Beane's done a good job overall given the draft position he has to work with every year, but there's no question he and his staff are deficient in their WR evaluations, to the extent that they should probably bring in new scouts and stage an intervention for Beane. He's striking out looking every draft, waiting for the perfect pitch then whiffing when he does swing. 

 

Again, I will ask the original question.  What WR did they miss on since they trade Diggs?  Coleman and every outside WR1 drafted all have busted.  The other poster brought up a 5th round WR in a year where we were on the first year a huge extension for Diggs who was still in his twenties and a top 5 WR in the NFL.  

 

This notion they can't evaluate is pretty wild given they have not invested a lot of premium assets in the position becasue they had Diggs.  They found Shakir and Davis on day 3 who exceeded their draft slots by far.  

 

The only other relevant investment was Coleman, yet no other WR taken when we could have taken one has really done more than Coleman, they have all been busts.  The only example is Ladd whose natural position is the slot and that was the one position we already had.  We needed an outside WR and we needed size.  So using hindsight to flame them for not taking a guy that the people complaining also were NOT campaigning for on draft night is pretty silly.  Everyone wanted Legette, Franklin, Adonai, Worthy, etc.  All have been busts.  Even the guys people wanted later have done less than Keon.  

 

First 2 seasons with Beane was clearing out cap, clearing out bad contracts, bad players, bad fits.  Once they had the QB in place, they started looking to build around him and went and got Diggs who was a top 5 WR his tenure here.  They supported him with other quality WR's like Cole, Sanders, Brown, Gabe in those prime Diggs years and then drafted for the future with Shakir as Cole was getting older and on his way out (and hit on that).  Then they extended Diggs to finish his career here while he was still in his 20's.  That relationship ended earlier than intended and conincidentally in a season where they were not going to over pay to keep Davis either.  

 

That left them having to rebuild the whole room outside Shakir in one season, and a season they had a $31M dead money cap hit at the position too, really leaving them only the draft to address it.  Then on top of that, we aged out a lot of veteran leadership as well, so the whole draft became the first mini retool since Allen arrived as we had to address a lot of positions.  

 

And despite all that, the offense went out and put up the single greatest offensive season in Bills history and one that was historically good.  That same offense averaged 29 PPG over 3 games in the playoffs against 3 of the best defenses in the AFC last year and Josh got his first MVP. 

 

All that being said - as I previous mentioned - my mindset is everyone should be fired if we don't win a SB this year.  At some point you need to just make a change.  So I am not here to say they are perfect or need to say.  But this ranting without context that goes on daily here just gets so old.  Especially when all those people wanted other players who were also busts or they want to play the hindsight game and make a big deal about a 5th round WR when we had a top 5 WR who just signed a large extension to retire here.  

 

 

[Pete]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

The amount of over the top nonsense you insist on posting to manipulate your bias is unreal.  He has FIVE career catches, and 1 was 72 yards skewing his YPC.  And for a team that has bigger WR needs than we do with an MVP candidate QB...he has FIVE catches.  

 

You make it so hard to have a real conversation with this kind of stuff

 

5 catches in ROOKIE year.  He’s 5th WR on a pretty stacked WR room.  Diggs-Boutte-Hollins—Douglas-Chism.  A stacked TE room with Henry and Hooper.  Kyle Williams is making plays when his number is called.  They have been trying to get him more involved. He’s been making highlight catches, and impressing on kick returns. https://www.si.com/nfl/patriots/onsi/news/new-england-patriots-kyle-williams-turning-heads-new-kick-returner

 

I know how you need to get the last word in A.D. and love to say no, I’m right, you are wrong.  
 

Kyle Williams not good blah blah whatever.

Don’t you think Kyle Williams would improve the Bills?  4.4 speed is one major skillset the Bills is missing.  The Texans played press the whole game.  We could use him as a returner.  
 

Don’t you agree Kyle Williams would of been a much, much better draft pick then Landon Jackson?

 

and I’m jealous of the Pats WR room.  Forget Diggs, give Josh Boutte, Williams, Hollins, Douglas- Josh passing numbers would skyrocket 
 

I don’t think we need WR room loaded with a superstars.  Just WRs who can open (and catch).

 

Edited 2 minutes ago by Pete