Jump to content

Is there any circumstances you would move on from McDermott after 2022?


Under what circumstance whout you move on from McDermott after 2022  

357 members have voted

  1. 1. Under what circumstance whout you move on from McDermott after 2022

    • Nothing. He's my head coach and still want him here no matter what happens in 2022
      265
    • Anything short of a SB appearance and/or championship
      10
    • Losing season/miss playoffs and injuries are not a main factor in this
      57
    • Losing to KC in the playoffs for a 3rd straight year
      25


Recommended Posts

On 5/22/2022 at 5:09 AM, newcam2012 said:

Let's win one before we start talking dynasty and 4 or 5. Every coach is under pressure. I don't see MCD as getting unfair pressure. Good God did you see the last 13 seconds of the KC game? To be honest, the media and most fans have given him much less criticism than he deserves. Basically, he avoided addressing his blunders and was given a free pass. I would've had much more respect if he came out and said I blew it and apologized to the team and the fans. I can respect that and would undoubtedly stand behind him for another year. Put up or shut up if you will. He has arguably the best QB in the game. No more excuses! Nothing less than a Lombardi trophy should be the standard for the next few years with a healthy Allen. Will Coach McD be the next Mary Schott???

 

But I'm a fan and being rational isn't as fun sometimes when it's a slow news cycle like right now. I'll be happy with any Super Bowl, but I want 4-5, lol. I do think he gets more criticism than he deserves though. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Where does a thread like this come from? The 13 second haters? 

 

As a head coach, McD is considered one of the top men in the NFL. "If for some reason he became available to another NFL team there is no doubt in my view he would be snapped up in a heartbeat.

 

C'mon guys...this man made the playoffs in his first season in Buffalo with Tyrod Taylor at QB.

 

If McD has any shortcoming it's that he is far to loyal to his DC. Frazier calls the defensive plays and not the head coach! Yet from the Bills fan base McD gets blamed for anything on the defensive side. 

 

Then, at the same time I can see why he would keep Leslie Frazier for so many reasons. I was sorta hoping that Frazier would get hired away as a new head coach this off season.

However, he still might after the 2022 season.

 

 

 

On another note, look what happened to the Baltimore Ravens last season with all their bad luck. Even after a season similar to that one I'd still say NO!

 

 

  • Awesome! (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Nihilarian said:

Where does a thread like this come from? The 13 second haters? 

 

As a head coach, McD is considered one of the top men in the NFL. "If for some reason he became available to another NFL team there is no doubt in my view he would be snapped up in a heartbeat.

 

C'mon guys...this man made the playoffs in his first season in Buffalo with Tyrod Taylor at QB.

 

If McD has any shortcoming it's that he is far to loyal to his DC. Frazier calls the defensive plays and not the head coach! Yet from the Bills fan base McD gets blamed for anything on the defensive side. 

 

Then, at the same time I can see why he would keep Leslie Frazier for so many reasons. I was sorta hoping that Frazier would get hired away as a new head coach this off season.

However, he still might after the 2022 season.

 

 

 

On another note, look what happened to the Baltimore Ravens last season with all their bad luck. Even after a season similar to that one I'd still say NO!

 

 

I don't think anyone is saying that Coach McD isn't a very good coach. I think that's a given. The real question is can he bring home the Lombardi Trophy? At this point, winning the division isn't enough. Neither is winning one playoff game. The Bills need to make super bowl appearances and win at least one of them. Anything short of this would be an under achievement. The 13 second collasal blunder still looms large until the coach proves otherwise. 

Edited by newcam2012
  • Agree 2
  • Dislike 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Nihilarian said:

Where does a thread like this come from? The 13 second haters? 

 

As a head coach, McD is considered one of the top men in the NFL. "If for some reason he became available to another NFL team there is no doubt in my view he would be snapped up in a heartbeat.

 

C'mon guys...this man made the playoffs in his first season in Buffalo with Tyrod Taylor at QB.

 

If McD has any shortcoming it's that he is far to loyal to his DC. Frazier calls the defensive plays and not the head coach! Yet from the Bills fan base McD gets blamed for anything on the defensive side. 

 

Then, at the same time I can see why he would keep Leslie Frazier for so many reasons. I was sorta hoping that Frazier would get hired away as a new head coach this off season.

However, he still might after the 2022 season.

 

 

 

On another note, look what happened to the Baltimore Ravens last season with all their bad luck. Even after a season similar to that one I'd still say NO!

 

 

 

This thread comes from the following fact based information:

 

- in his first 5 years here McDermott is 3-4 in the playoffs including 0-4 on the road (for perspective Zac Taylor took the Bengals to the SB in his first postseason appearance including 2-0 on the road in the AFC playoffs)

- His overall record during the regular season against teams with a winning record/playoff teams is well below .500

- JA17 and Gabe Davis had historic performances in the playoffs and it was still squandered because of poor coaching and the 13 seconds debacle.

- Defensive scheme has proven over and over it's not effective against physical teams and/or teams with top QB's/offenses despite misleading overall rankings like last year. Last year we faced one of the worst schedules ever in terms of opposing QB's and still only managed 11 wins.

 

But again, the main talking point here is whether or not McDermott is just a good head coach vs. a championship HC and the latter is where many including myself have serious doubts based largely on the items listed above.

 

Also in regards to the Ravens last year, they were ravaged by injury and Harbaugh a proven SB winning HC so why would anybody question what happened there. Speaking of injuries, what is very telling about McD is that his teams have been relatively healthy most years but have still not been able to reach a championship/win one. So the evidence is there that this teams success is more about talent vs actual coaching.

 

I wish McD well and hope this season reaches lofty expectations, but deep down I'd be lying if I didn't have serious concerns about an 'owned and exposed' type of year especially given the schedule difficulty on paper and types of QBs/teams were playing this year. Division itself is also going to be brutal compared to last year.

  • Vomit 1
  • Eyeroll 1
  • Agree 1
  • Haha (+1) 1
  • Dislike 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 hours ago, mead107 said:

Why is this even being talked about?? 
 Just DUMB.  

 

THE BIG QUESTION IS - WHYTHE TOPIC starter  IS

A BILLS FAN? 


 

The topic starter is not a Bills fan - he is a Miami troll that comes here and somehow gets away with this garbage.

 

 

  • Like (+1) 1
  • Haha (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 5/21/2022 at 8:01 PM, Apocalypse Nuts said:

Maybe if I spent the entire season smoking crack followed by injections of heroin.  I think that’s the only way I could be so whacked out of my mind enough to even entertain the idea that firing McDermott would be anywhere near a good idea.

 

All you dipp schzitts that want to blame him for anything less than winning the Super Bowl are absolutely freaking delusional.

 

So this explains why some want to get rid of him for "13 seconds".   I am amazed they can type.

  • Haha (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

This thread comes from the following fact based information:

 

- in his first 5 years here McDermott is 3-4 in the playoffs including 0-4 on the road (for perspective Zac Taylor took the Bengals to the SB in his first postseason appearance including 2-0 on the road in the AFC playoffs)

- His overall record during the regular season against teams with a winning record/playoff teams is well below .500

- JA17 and Gabe Davis had historic performances in the playoffs and it was still squandered because of poor coaching and the 13 seconds debacle.

- Defensive scheme has proven over and over it's not effective against physical teams and/or teams with top QB's/offenses despite misleading overall rankings like last year. Last year we faced one of the worst schedules ever in terms of opposing QB's and still only managed 11 wins.

 

But again, the main talking point here is whether or not McDermott is just a good head coach vs. a championship HC and the latter is where many including myself have serious doubts based largely on the items listed above.

 

Also in regards to the Ravens last year, they were ravaged by injury and Harbaugh a proven SB winning HC so why would anybody question what happened there. Speaking of injuries, what is very telling about McD is that his teams have been relatively healthy most years but have still not been able to reach a championship/win one. So the evidence is there that this teams success is more about talent vs actual coaching.

 

I wish McD well and hope this season reaches lofty expectations, but deep down I'd be lying if I didn't have serious concerns about an 'owned and exposed' type of year especially given the schedule difficulty on paper and types of QBs/teams were playing this year. Division itself is also going to be brutal compared to last year.

 

There is zero chance the Bills are "owned and exposed" this season. 

 

 

  • Thank you (+1) 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

This thread comes from the following fact based information:

 

- in his first 5 years here McDermott is 3-4 in the playoffs including 0-4 on the road (for perspective Zac Taylor took the Bengals to the SB in his first postseason appearance including 2-0 on the road in the AFC playoffs)

- His overall record during the regular season against teams with a winning record/playoff teams is well below .500

- JA17 and Gabe Davis had historic performances in the playoffs and it was still squandered because of poor coaching and the 13 seconds debacle.

- Defensive scheme has proven over and over it's not effective against physical teams and/or teams with top QB's/offenses despite misleading overall rankings like last year. Last year we faced one of the worst schedules ever in terms of opposing QB's and still only managed 11 wins.

 

But again, the main talking point here is whether or not McDermott is just a good head coach vs. a championship HC and the latter is where many including myself have serious doubts based largely on the items listed above.

 

Also in regards to the Ravens last year, they were ravaged by injury and Harbaugh a proven SB winning HC so why would anybody question what happened there. Speaking of injuries, what is very telling about McD is that his teams have been relatively healthy most years but have still not been able to reach a championship/win one. So the evidence is there that this teams success is more about talent vs actual coaching.

 

I wish McD well and hope this season reaches lofty expectations, but deep down I'd be lying if I didn't have serious concerns about an 'owned and exposed' type of year especially given the schedule difficulty on paper and types of QBs/teams were playing this year. Division itself is also going to be brutal compared to last year.

Fantastic post! Well said and very good research. The couple of years should indicate hpw good coach McD is. I absolutely think it's a legitimate question and concern. Is good good enough? 

52 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

There is zero chance the Bills are "owned and exposed" this season. 

 

 

I think the road for success is much more difficult for tje Bills.

  • Eyeroll 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Fantastic post! Well said and very good research. The couple of years should indicate hpw good coach McD is. I absolutely think it's a legitimate question and concern. Is good good enough? 

I think the road for success is much more difficult for tje Bills.

 

Whether McDermott is a championship coach is a legitimate question until he proves it isn't. As it is for about 75% of coaches in the NFL. How many title winners are there coaching? Belichick, Carroll, McVay, Harbaugh, Tomlin, Reid, McCarthy, Pederson... think that is it? For everyone else it is a legit question until they manage it. And I get it the 13 seconds while we now know there was a major player execution error (because Levi has owned it) ultimately comes down to coaching. But I reject the assertion that the other two playoff losses were coaching. We were just outclassed across the board in the AFCCG in 2020 and the players blew it on both offense and defense in Houston in 2019 with stupid mistakes. The coaches were a minimal factor in that loss. 

 

On the road for success being much more difficult...  in terms of the AFC playoffs being a potential gauntlet, sure. That is true. But barring major injuries the Bills are certain to make the playoffs and have a genuine shot at the #1 seed as they did last year (when they slightly underperformed). To me "owned and exposed" would be either not making the playoffs or being 1 and done in them. Losing to Patrick Mahomes, Joe Burrow or Justin Herbert in the post season isn't being owned and exposed. That will happen sometimes and the Bills will beat them sometimes too. 

  • Like (+1) 1
  • Agree 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Whether McDermott is a championship coach is a legitimate question until he proves it isn't. As it is for about 75% of coaches in the NFL. How many title winners are there coaching? Belichick, Carroll, McVay, Harbaugh, Tomlin, Reid, McCarthy, Pederson... think that is it? For everyone else it is a legit question until they manage it. And I get it the 13 seconds while we now know there was a major player execution error (because Levi has owned it) ultimately comes down to coaching. But I reject the assertion that the other two playoff losses were coaching. We were just outclassed across the board in the AFCCG in 2020 and the players blew it on both offense and defense in Houston in 2019 with stupid mistakes. The coaches were a minimal factor in that loss. 

 

On the road for success being much more difficult...  in terms of the AFC playoffs being a potential gauntlet, sure. That is true. But barring major injuries the Bills are certain to make the playoffs and have a genuine shot at the #1 seed as they did last year (when they slightly underperformed). To me "owned and exposed" would be either not making the playoffs or being 1 and done in them. Losing to Patrick Mahomes, Joe Burrow or Justin Herbert in the post season isn't being owned and exposed. That will happen sometimes and the Bills will beat them sometimes too. 

Coaches were absolutely to blame for the Houston loss. Offensively the playcalling was absurd (46 passes, with the lion’s share of targets going to Duke Williams🤦‍♂️) and defensively they got beat on poor blitzes in game-deciding spots as McDermott and Frazier are wont to do.

  • Disagree 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some of you need to realize that Kansas City head coach Andy Reid has been an NFL HC since 1999! Through 1999-2012 with Philly. 2013 though 2022 with Kansas City.

 

Yea that's right, 23 years. 14 seasons with Philly, 9 with Kansas.  SB 2x with KC one win, one loss. One SB appearance and loss with the eagles and it took 6 seasons to get there.

Reid W/L record as an NFL HC 23 years. Philly .583-KC .710-Total .633

 

McD 5 seasons as NFL HC, W/L 49/32 .605

It's only going to get better as the Buffalo Bills NOW have one of the very best franchise QB's in the NFL! Great offense, good defense. 

 

One season with Tyrod Taylor at QB and the rest with developing a rookie in 2018. Simply look at the success of this team recently...my lord! In his 5 seasons as HC the Buffalo defense has been near top 5 three times.

 

McD and Beane inherited a freaking mess of a team that was in cap hell with not so much talent. Wrex Ryan had wrecked that #1 defense. 

 

 

Yea, I'm not happy about that 13 seconds either as Buffalo had a 92%+ chance of winning that game at the kick off. They screwed it up for sure. I'm not happy about that Jaguars game either with a 6-9 loss to the worst team in the NFL. The Colts game still irritates me, 264 yards, 4 TDs on the ground. Buffalo could have had home field and a home playoff game last season. 

 

Let's hope that things don't repeat and the coaching staff learned from the mistakes. 

 

Bills fans should be embracing a very bright future for this franchise... that is staying in Buffalo!

 

 

  • Like (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, GoBills808 said:

Coaches were absolutely to blame for the Houston loss. Offensively the playcalling was absurd (46 passes, with the lion’s share of targets going to Duke Williams🤦‍♂️) and defensively they got beat on poor blitzes in game-deciding spots as McDermott and Frazier are wont to do.

Happen to agree with you. The coaching in the 2nd half of the game was very poor. They played to lose and not win, terrible adjustments, and looked like a deer in headlights. Thus far, I think it's pretty clear that Coach McD and the rest of the coaching staff has fallen short in playoff time. I think many of us including myself got used to the Bills losing ways. Therefore, we have been satisfied with making the playoffs and winning one playoff game. The hey it's better than it was. We are making the playoffs. That just doesn't cut it when you have the best QB in the league on your team. The coaching staff absolutely ripped the fans and players hearts out in 13 seconds. Truthfully, the media and most fans treated the coaching staff with kid gloves. In reality, they should have been lambasted for a long duration. I get the wait till next year thoughts. Haven't we heard that over and over and over?  Maybe Jerry Sulivan should ask coach how can you do a better job coaching down the stretch in a crucial playoff game? What positive changes can be made? What did you learn from your collasal 13 second disaster? Nope nope nope...Instead, let's wait til next year...Ground hog day!

Edited by newcam2012
  • Disagree 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

 

This thread comes from the following fact based information:

 

- in his first 5 years here McDermott is 3-4 in the playoffs including 0-4 on the road (for perspective Zac Taylor took the Bengals to the SB in his first postseason appearance including 2-0 on the road in the AFC playoffs)

- His overall record during the regular season against teams with a winning record/playoff teams is well below .500

- JA17 and Gabe Davis had historic performances in the playoffs and it was still squandered because of poor coaching and the 13 seconds debacle.

- Defensive scheme has proven over and over it's not effective against physical teams and/or teams with top QB's/offenses despite misleading overall rankings like last year. Last year we faced one of the worst schedules ever in terms of opposing QB's and still only managed 11 wins.

 

But again, the main talking point here is whether or not McDermott is just a good head coach vs. a championship HC and the latter is where many including myself have serious doubts based largely on the items listed above.

 

Also in regards to the Ravens last year, they were ravaged by injury and Harbaugh a proven SB winning HC so why would anybody question what happened there. Speaking of injuries, what is very telling about McD is that his teams have been relatively healthy most years but have still not been able to reach a championship/win one. So the evidence is there that this teams success is more about talent vs actual coaching.

 

I wish McD well and hope this season reaches lofty expectations, but deep down I'd be lying if I didn't have serious concerns about an 'owned and exposed' type of year especially given the schedule difficulty on paper and types of QBs/teams were playing this year. Division itself is also going to be brutal compared to last year.

For perspective, Zac Taylor is 16-32-1 in the regular season. Please tell me his record against playoff teams in the regular season lmao.

 

Your takes stink. 

  • Agree 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

43 minutes ago, newcam2012 said:

Happen to agree with you. The coaching in the 2nd half of the game was very poor. They played to lose and not win, terrible adjustments, and looked like a deer in headlights. Thus far, I think it's pretty clear that Coach McD and the rest of the coaching staff has fallen short in playoff time. I think many of us including myself got used to the Bills losing ways. Therefore, we have been satisfied with making the playoffs and winning one playoff game. The hey it's better than it was. We are making the playoffs. That just doesn't cut it when you have the best QB in the league on your team. The coaching staff absolutely ripped the fans and players hearts out in 13 seconds. Truthfully, the media and most fans treated the coaching staff with kid gloves. In reality, they should have been lambasted for a long duration. I get the wait till next year thoughts. Haven't we heard that over and over and over?  Maybe Jerry Sulivan should ask coach how can you do a better job coaching down the stretch in a crucial playoff game? What positive changes can be made? What did you learn from your collasal 13 second disaster? Nope nope nope...Instead, let's wait til next year...Ground hog day!

You people are actually insane. How many times did Drew Brees and Peyton Manning go one and done? Were Dungy and Payton on the hot seat? How many years has Harbaugh done it? How many years has Pete Carroll? Or Andy Reid?

 

Bills fans are the new Pats fans. They won 6 Superbowls and went to 9 and Pats fans were still coming out of the woodwork saying Bill was too old, Brady was too old, and they need to move on just because they lost in the second round or the AFCCG. 
 

I never thought our fan base would be that ridiculous but here we are.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

34 minutes ago, FireChans said:

You people are actually insane. How many times did Drew Brees and Peyton Manning go one and done? Were Dungy and Payton on the hot seat? How many years has Harbaugh done it? How many years has Pete Carroll? Or Andy Reid?

 

Bills fans are the new Pats fans. They won 6 Superbowls and went to 9 and Pats fans were still coming out of the woodwork saying Bill was too old, Brady was too old, and they need to move on just because they lost in the second round or the AFCCG. 
 

I never thought our fan base would be that ridiculous but here we are.

To be fair it’s just a couple of loud cherpers that are saying this

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, FireChans said:

You people are actually insane. How many times did Drew Brees and Peyton Manning go one and done? Were Dungy and Payton on the hot seat? How many years has Harbaugh done it? How many years has Pete Carroll? Or Andy Reid?

 

Bills fans are the new Pats fans. They won 6 Superbowls and went to 9 and Pats fans were still coming out of the woodwork saying Bill was too old, Brady was too old, and they need to move on just because they lost in the second round or the AFCCG. 
 

I never thought our fan base would be that ridiculous but here we are.

With respect, your comparisons actually embolden my argument. All those coaches have at least one ring. The Bills under McD haven't even sniffed a super bowl appearance yet win one. Coach McD has been pretty poor in the playoffs. Jacksonville, Houston, Indy, and KC twice off the top of my head. His biggest playoff feat to date is losing the KC playoff game in 13 seconds. Like it or not, that's pretty much undeniable. 

 

I'm not saying he's on the hot seat. I'm saying he's  disappointed Bills fans in the playoffs. The 13 second wound is still fresh and truthfully the  healing begins with a Lombardi Trophy. Until that happens, the criticism of Coach McD is warranted. I don't know how that is seen as insane. Imho, he has a 2 to 3 year window to bring the Lombardi Trophy to Buffalo. 

Edited by newcam2012
  • Disagree 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, newcam2012 said:

With respect, your comparisons actually embolden my argument. All those coaches have at least one ring. The Bills under McD haven't even sniffed a super bowl appearance yet win one. Coach McD has been pretty poor in the playoffs. Jacksonville, Houston, Indy, and KC twice off the top of my head. His biggest playoff feat to date is losing the KC playoff game in 13 seconds. Like it or not, that's pretty much undeniable. 

 

I'm not saying he's on the hot seat. I'm saying he's  disappointed Bills fans in the playoffs. The 13 second wound is still fresh and truthfully the  healing begins with a Lombardi Trophy. Until that happens, the criticism of Coach McD is warranted. I don't know how that is seen as insane. Imho, he has a 2 to 3 year window to bring the Lombardi Trophy to Buffalo. 


 

My God - it just gets worse and worse.

 

You sit here and cry about McD not winning a Super Bowl in year 5 (or even sniffing one 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️ - yeah not one AFC championship game or anything), but then praise Dungy who won a SB in year 11.  Prior to the SB - he was 5-8 in the playoffs and overall 9-10 in the playoffs even with a 4-0 in the SB year.  
 

The discussion you try to make is just terrible.  McD has done more than Dungy ever did at this point.  Yep Payton won his SB in year 4, but his overall record was 9-8 in the playoffs with the 3-0 in his SB year.  The rest of the time he was 6-8 even with a HOF QB throwing for record setting numbers year over year.

 

I really do not get you argument - like Reid and Dungy and many others - McD should get time as long as he keeps winning and they keep taking shots at the title.  There are a very limited number of SB winning coaches in the NFL and many of them took years to get the first SB.  None of the guys you mentioned won the SB until they did, but they were capable- just as McD is capable.  
 

In the end - it is whatever because the Pegula’s are not letting this guy go, but man there are just some people that miss the overall forest for the 13 second tree.  They forget the play calling on the 30 seconds to get the Bills the lead - like that was only Josh, but Wallace admitting he missed a call was all on coaching.

 

Again I need more of these - 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️
 

 

 

 

 

  • Agree 1
  • Thank you (+1) 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Personally I think the point when this becomes a real question pending a collapse before then is after the 2026 season. At that stage Josh would have just played his age 30 season and his guaranteed money will have run out (with two years to go on his deal). That is the point when he comes up for a renegotiation. 

 

If at that point we haven't got over the hump you think about whether a change makes sense. But in doing that you have to think about what Josh wants too. Is he frustrated or is he still totally aligned with Beane and McDermott? You have to factor that in. 

  • Like (+1) 2
  • Agree 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, FireChans said:

You people are actually insane. How many times did Drew Brees and Peyton Manning go one and done? Were Dungy and Payton on the hot seat? How many years has Harbaugh done it? How many years has Pete Carroll? Or Andy Reid?

 

Bills fans are the new Pats fans. They won 6 Superbowls and went to 9 and Pats fans were still coming out of the woodwork saying Bill was too old, Brady was too old, and they need to move on just because they lost in the second round or the AFCCG. 
 

I never thought our fan base would be that ridiculous but here we are.

 

I wish. The Bills give me 6 Super Bowl championships hell just give me one and they can go 0-17 struggling for 5 straight seasons and you wouldn't hear a peep out of me complaining. I don't think McDermott is in danger of getting fired but the Von Miller move was a final piece type of move. Not a move to just getter better and improve the team but a move to put them over the top and win a Super Bowl. Media both local and national as well as the fans have the highest of expectations. They fail to at least make the Super Bowl and the calls for McDermott's head will grow very loud next offseason. That is one thing I am sure of. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...