Florio's punch has been (should be) pissed in...

[Mickey]

So, you liked Denny Green, but because he reportedly did not get hoodwinked by the GM of your favorite team, he is being a "dick"?  Some objectivity might be in order...

 

I have no love for Green, or the Cardnals, but I agree with you, he is doing a pretty good job of putting a team together in Arizona.  It remains to be seen what will happen, Boldin may hold out, and I think JJ will be adequate at best, in Arizona.  Personally, with the skill players Arizona has (assuming Warner does not return to his pre-2004 form), I don't think Travis is a good fit for their offense anyways.

 

I like TD, because he is proactive, but it is looking more and more that some of his detractors are not entirely off base in regards to this Travis Henry situation.  How can you have a two time 1000 yard rusher dangling out as trade bate, months before the draft, and come up with nothing?  I am pretty sure he will be traded, but it won't be until training camps are in full swing, when someone is injured, or some team figures out that the guys they have are not going to cut it.  Truthfully, it was obvious Travis was history last season, TD made a mistake of not unloading him then.  Argue all you want about how it would be foolish to put the running game on Willis McGahees' suspect knees, but just remember JP Losman.  Surely a running back vetran the equvilant of Kelly Holcomb could have been found.  The Peerless Price situation was much different than this.

320551[/snapback]

Arguably, Travis Henry IS the running back equivalent of Kelly Holcomb. Henry was not cosidered good enough by his own team to be the starter and they felt strongly enough about it to take a RB in the first round who had just suffered a terrible knee injury. If the Bills, who know Henry best, don't think he is an NFL starter, why would other teams want him as their starter?

[RVJ]

No one wants Henry....If he were a free agent they would be falling over each

other to see if they could sign him first. There egos can't get past the draft pick

thing.

[d_wag]

Also....it wouldnt suprise me to see us pick up Shelton anyway......the guy didn't show up for workouts.....he will probably get cut.

 

We can sign him then......

320547[/snapback]

 

what makes you so confident that IF shelton was cut buffalo would land him?

 

1) the bills brass apparantly doesn't like him and 2) if it got into a bidding war with another club, obviously the other club would win given the bills hardline stance with demulling this off-season

 

i'd personally like to see him on the team..........contrary to popular belief on this board and apparantly the bills brass, shelton is a solid LT and would be a defanite upgrade to the garbage we have their now.......but not getting him in the fold for mini-camps now makes him less appealing given the fact he has two less months to learn the offense and get up to speed.......

[d_wag]

If we can assume that Arizona met TD's condition of swapping 2nd rounders with the trade, why would TD hold out for Philly's 3rd round pick? 

 

perhaps he was trying to milk arizona for even more or was hoping that philly or TB would step up with an offer?

 

In what alternate universe is a late 3rd round pick better than moving up 11 spots to the top of the second round AND getting a starting caliber NFL offensive lineman? 

 

according to the bills, they weren't interested in shelton.....

 

Why would Donahoe not take the Arizona trade if they were apparently hot after Nugent?

 

again, according to the bills, they weren't interested in shelton.......

 

How would Arizona's offer still be on the table on draft day, if Arizona personnel guy admitted that he had not called Buffalo since Friday?

 

"We kept our communication open with Buffalo right up to the time of the pick," said Rod Graves, the team's vice president for football operations

 

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i'm not saying the story is true, but it certaily seems plausible........TD is famous for playing poker and i believe in this case he lost........he should have just took the zona deal and be done with the henry problem, addition by subtracation, but he tried to get cute and it bit him in the ass.........

[DanInSouthBuffalo]

 

Maybe Shelton isn't great, but I'm sure he's adequate.

320468[/snapback]

 

 

You don't pay $3 million a year for adequate.

 

Donohoe overplayed his hand, but everyone knows Arizona was trying to salary dump their garbage.

[dave mcbride]

So, you liked Denny Green, but because he reportedly did not get hoodwinked by the GM of your favorite team, he is being a "dick"?  Some objectivity might be in order...

 

I have no love for Green, or the Cardnals, but I agree with you, he is doing a pretty good job of putting a team together in Arizona.  It remains to be seen what will happen, Boldin may hold out, and I think JJ will be adequate at best, in Arizona.  Personally, with the skill players Arizona has (assuming Warner does not return to his pre-2004 form), I don't think Travis is a good fit for their offense anyways.

 

I like TD, because he is proactive, but it is looking more and more that some of his detractors are not entirely off base in regards to this Travis Henry situation.  How can you have a two time 1000 yard rusher dangling out as trade bate, months before the draft, and come up with nothing?  I am pretty sure he will be traded, but it won't be until training camps are in full swing, when someone is injured, or some team figures out that the guys they have are not going to cut it.  Truthfully, it was obvious Travis was history last season, TD made a mistake of not unloading him then.  Argue all you want about how it would be foolish to put the running game on Willis McGahees' suspect knees, but just remember JP Losman.  Surely a running back vetran the equvilant of Kelly Holcomb could have been found.  The Peerless Price situation was much different than this.

320551[/snapback]

 

this is an excellent post.

[Sound_n_Fury]

How can you have a two time 1000 yard rusher dangling out as trade bate, months before the draft, and come up with nothing?

320551[/snapback]

 

Same way you can have last year's NFC rushing champion go without takers....

[GG]

perhaps he was trying to milk arizona for even more or was hoping that philly or TB would step up with an offer?

---------------------------------------------------

 

i'm not saying the story is true, but it certaily seems plausible........TD is famous for playing poker and i believe in this case he lost........he should have just took the zona deal and be done with the henry problem, addition by subtracation, but he tried to get cute and it bit him in the ass.........

320600[/snapback]

 

I misread the communications line, as it came from TD and not from AZ.

 

But the main point is that it still looks like AZ is doing a lot more CYA than TD.

 

The key to the debacle is if Bills wanted Shelton. If AZ's only offer was Shelton, and if TD didn't want Shelton, and told AZ well in advance that he didn't want Shelton, then why are they crying that Buffalo didn't agree to a deal that included Shelton?

 

I would only agree with the critics if Bills wanted Shelton, but TD held out for a better deal and got stuck.

[mead107]

can we just stay with the facts .

[Rico]

My take (haven't had time to read all these threads ):

 

TD should've kept his mouth shut after the draft. There was absolutely no justifiable reason for him to make those statements, it was all about saving face. By coming out in public and saying that no one offerred him anything for TH, he only further devalued TH. And what's the point in putting Shelton down? Florio went a little overboard as usual in his bashing, but I agree with what he's saying. I'm a big TD fan, & I don't have a problem with holding onto TH, but he should've taken the high road and kept quiet.

[34-78-83]

My take (haven't had time to read all these threads ):

 

TD should've kept his mouth shut after the draft. There was absolutely no justifiable reason for him to make those statements, it was all about saving face. By coming out in public and saying that no one offerred him anything for TH, he only further devalued TH. And what's the point in putting Shelton down? Florio went a little overboard as usual in his bashing, but I agree with what he's saying. I'm a big TD fan, & I don't have a problem with holding onto TH, but he should've taken the high road and kept quiet.

320794[/snapback]

 

The high road would have been a difficult one to take, considering it was a media session and the reporters were asking question after question about the Henry trade situation... I'm on record as interpreting "no offers" as "no offers of substance", but that's just me

[bobblehead]

Obviously, still having TH on the team is not good, and was not the plan. Also, Donahoe does have a history of saying things he probably wished he could take back in the heat of the moment.

 

But.. I really have a problem with Florio's assessment. The poster who commented on the profane language of Florio's "sources", I believe, is on to something. I bet there is no "source". Donahoe is many things, but he's too smart to be the guy Florio paints him to be. And the poster who commented that Arizona is the one doing most of the backtracking is also on to something.

 

I really don't see why Arizona is so upset, they had an excellent draft, and they can cut Shelton with not much of a hangover, so what's their problem?

 

At the end of the day, though, There is still a whole off-season, pre-season, and regular season to trade Henry, and I guarantee that someone will need him by the time the season is over.

[DIEHARD BILLSFAN]

DONAHOE'S GOT NO LEVERAGE

 

 

 

With a glut of running backs available via the draft, trade, and/or free agency and a former No. 1 tailback who vows never to play in Buffalo again, Bills G.M. Tom Donahoe overlooked one key fact as he postured and preened for a first-day pick in exchange for Travis Henry.

 

 

 

Donahoe has no leverage.

 

 

 

But that didn't stop Donahoe from talking tough about the trade that never was, and likely never will be -- at least not on Tom's terms.

 

 

 

"We weren't presented with very much, to be honest with you," Donahoe said after the draft. "We have to hear something that makes sense, other than somebody offering a player we don't want or somebody offering a late-round pick, which we're not going to do."

 

 

 

Donahoe was at it again on Monday: "If not being offered anything is being greedy, then we were greedy," he said. "We were willing to discuss anything but somebody has to offer you something so that you can have a conversation."

 

 

Said one league insider in response, "Can't this smug !@#$ shut up?"

 

 

 

The source described Donahoe as an "egomaniac [who] will never learn his lesson about being disrespectful towards other people [and] decision-makers in the NFL."

 

 

 

Perhaps Donahoe is still stinging from past draft-day trades, which included giving up a 2003 first-rounder in 2002 for Drew Bledsoe, and then giving up a 2005 first-rounder in 2004 for the guy who will replace Bledsoe after three mediocre seasons.

 

 

 

But even in connection with the Bledsoe trade Donahoe talked tough, saying initially that he'd never give up a first-round pick for Bledsoe and then boasting that he would have given up two first-rounders for the former New England quarterback, whom Donahoe said he decided to acquire after seeing him throw against the wind in pregame warm ups (perhaps Donahoe should have withheld judgment until after watching tape of Bledsoe throwing against the wind -- and at the same time against coverage and a pass rush).

 

 

 

The deeper problem seems to be that other league insiders don't appreciate Donahoe's public statements regarding trades and trade offers. Yeah, it's a competitive business, but there's a certain code of conduct when it comes to talking publicly, expressly or implicitly, regarding other front offices.

 

 

 

At the core, its a matter of respect. Donahoe doesn't give it in situations like this, so as a result he rarely gets it from some of the most respected figures in the league.

 

 

 

NEWER STORY

'ZONA DUMPS ON DONAHOE

 

 

 

As a follow-up to our story from earlier on Tuesday regarding some harsh opinions as to Bills G.M. Tom Donahoe, we're now hearing that the Arizona Cardinals are unhappy with the manner in which Donahoe has handled the potential trade of tailback Travis Henry.

 

 

 

Per a league source, Donahoe "totally screwed up the deal." Apparently, Arizona was offering tackle L.J. Shelton and a flip-flop of second-round picks. During those discussions, Donahoe "was swearing up and down that he had offers from . . . Philadelphia and Tampa Bay . . . for straight third-round picks."

 

 

 

So "the Cardinals called [Donahoe's] bluff and both the Bucs and Eagles took [running backs] in the draft."

 

 

 

Per the source, Donahoe "lost all credibility with [the Cardinals] when he pulled that crap. He never once said he didn't like [shelton], he just said he had better offers."

 

 

 

Since the draft, Donahoe has suggested that the Bills never wanted Shelton.

 

 

 

As a result, the Cardinals were chuckling when Donahoe was left holding the bag, and the source says that we can now add one more organization "to the list of teams that know [Donahoe] is full of sh-t."

[ajzepp]

This isn't a personality contest. This is a business. If TD bluffs his hand from time to time, you have to expect that his bluff will get called sooner or later. I think people are making a big deal out of this for no reason. TD has Travis by the nuts. Worst case scenario, Travis sits out until week whatever, serves as a backup the rest of the season, and essentially buys us another year to find his replacement. I'm fine with that......keep on bluffin, TD!

[Albany,n.y.]

A GM can't let the players dictate when, to whom and what the team gets back. Darick Holmes got us a 4th when he was in the last year of his contract-but he was traded to a team that lost a RB during the season. With all the RBs available, trading Henry on the draft days would not yield the maximum return. If the GM of the team YOU HAVE SIGNED A CONTRACT WITH is taking a wait & see attitude to get the maximum value for you in a trade, if you do things like mouthing off about never playing for that team again-diminishing your trade value, you should not expect the team to give a rat's @ss about your wishes.

 

TD will get maximum value if he trades Henry. If he doesn't feel he's getting sufficient return, then at some point having a backup the caliber of Henry for 1 more year is better than a low pick who has less than a 25% chance of making the team. If Henry doesn't want to show up, he can flip burgers for minimum wage until he realizes just how good he has it.

 

The other team's GMs should concentrate on running their own teams instead of trying to run the Buffalo Bills. Almost every time the Cardinals get a decent player, the guy ends up a holdout, because the Bidwells are so friggin cheap. Let them run their own team & let TD run ours. I guarantee Travis Henry will never be a GM, and the Cardinals couldn't do any worse than they've done over the last few decades if he was running the show.

[Buftex]

Arguably, Travis Henry IS the running back equivalent of Kelly Holcomb.  Henry was not cosidered good enough by his own team to be the starter and they felt strongly enough about it to take a RB in the first round who had just suffered a terrible knee injury.  If the Bills, who know Henry best, don't think he is an NFL starter, why would other teams want him as their starter?

320578[/snapback]

 

 

Travis may be the RB equivalent of Holcomb, the difference being, Holcomb chose the Bills and knows his role, Henry was choses by the Bills, but won't accept his role. That is a huge difference...I am thinking someone more along the lines of Anthony Thomas. A guy who has had some success, but can play the back-up role or start, as asked, without ego...