jrober38 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said: So Taylor as a vet with 3 games this season is too small of a sample size to draw any conclusion but Allen a rookie with 5 games....there's enough there? As I said, Allen is the same guy dating back to his 2.5 years at Wyoming where he threw 650 passes. All the things he showed on tape there he shows on tape for us on a weekly basis, and it's not good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuddyDark Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 Just now, The Red King said: Nobody wants to answer the question... Why do you think Tyrod would have performed better with the 2018 Bills' offense then he did with the Browns? ...i can understand Tyrod supporters trying very hard to act like his Cleveland stint never happened. I think I've answered this several times. TT would be better than the Bills QBs. TT is not better than Mayfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddy KGB Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 32 minutes ago, CuddyDark said: It's not about McCoy vs TT it's about the yards TT would average as a runner along with McCoy. TT averaged around 35 rushing yards per game. I'm not doing the math but if we say he adds 200 rush yrd to this point, we'd be top 5 rushing. 6th in rushing. 29th in overall yards due your manses Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Royale with Cheese Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 Just now, jrober38 said: As I said, Allen is the same guy dating back to his 2.5 years at Wyoming where he threw 650 passes. All the things he showed on tape there he shows on tape for us on a weekly basis, and it's not good enough. Okay so you stand by your statement then right? Okay. There's just too small of a sample size for Taylor in Cleveland but enough on Allen in Buffalo to draw conclusions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transplantbillsfan Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 Who knows? But we'd have more wins. We still have 6 games to go so maybe this is an interesting question to end the season. But it's very, very obvious that Beane and McDermott completely screwed the pooch on the QB position, and I'm sure if they could see the future and knew the offseason and beginning of this year would unfold the way it did, they would have kept Taylor. We have the 2nd most turnovers in the NFL. What did Taylor do well? This is a simple equation. Our passing game might not have been great, but we wouldn't have turned the ball over nearly as much as we have. And I can't find a statistic for "points off turnovers," but I'm sure we're right up there for that, too. I haven't even looked at anyone's posts in here, but I imagine people are saying things like, "are you crazy?!?! No, Taylor sucked! We'd still suck!" Those people, if they're saying anything resembling that, are naive. We might not be a playoff team with Taylor, but right now we'd sit at probably at least 1 or 2 more wins than we have, which would put us squarely in the playoff picture. And before anyone cites the Vikings game or Jets game saying Taylor never would have matched the offensive output we got in both of those games, notice the fact that our defense nearly pitched shut outs in both of those games. We still would have won both of those games with those performances with Taylor. Playoffs with Taylor? Maybe. At least we never would have seen the 13 combined turnovers from DA and Nathan Peterman that happened in the 5 total games the 2 of them played in, all of which were losses. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 (edited) 9 minutes ago, jrober38 said: As I said, Allen is the same guy dating back to his 2.5 years at Wyoming where he threw 650 passes. All the things he showed on tape there he shows on tape for us on a weekly basis, and it's not good enough. Nobody expected it would be good enough at this point. They are gambling that they can mold him into something that WILL BE good enough. You seem to very very doubtful (at best) they can do it. I have my own reservations but I’ll remain hopeful, because that’s all I can do. But nobody knows for sure yet. So we wait and pray..... . Edited November 16, 2018 by Augie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 14 minutes ago, CuddyDark said: I thought it was dumb from the start. If you have a thing a player does well do that until you get a franchise player in that position. Yet to be seen if JA is a franchise QB so for me it's another reason I believe this leadership is inept. TT at worst could be the backup and mentor for JA. Although, if that player is a QB, it would be nice if one of the things he did well was actually be a QB. Just sayin' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said: Okay so you stand by your statement then right? Okay. There's just too small of a sample size for Taylor in Cleveland but enough on Allen in Buffalo to draw conclusions. You've completely missed the point. I'm looking at each guys FULL body of work. Allen looks no different now than he did at Wyoming. He's inaccurate, can't read a defense, leaves the pocket too early, walks into sacks when he doesn't feel where pressure is coming from, and just generally does very little to move an offense. This is the guy on tape for 2.5 years and 650 pass attempts at Wyoming. People are grossly underestimating how far he has to go just to be an average NFL QB. I'm not just evaluating Allen as a Bill; I'm evaluating him going back to his time at Wyoming and there's been no improvement of his play on a football field since 2016. Edited November 16, 2018 by jrober38 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Red King Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 3 minutes ago, CuddyDark said: I think I've answered this several times. TT would be better than the Bills QBs. TT is not better than Mayfield. Did...you actually *read* the question? Because none of the above addresses it. But, the fact that you realize you have to keep ducking the question because you know you can't answer it speaks volumes. The thread doesn't ask if Tyrod is better then the Bills QBs. It asks if he would make them a playoff team. So, one more time... Do you think the Bills are a playoff team if Tyrod puts up the numbers he did in Cleveland? And if not, what makes you think he would put up better numbers with the 2018 Bills offense then he did with Cleveland's? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuddyDark Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 1 minute ago, billsfan1959 said: Although, if that player is a QB, it would be nice if one of the things he did well was actually be a QB. Just sayin' Absolutely, but if that one thing helps break a 17 year PO drought I'm all for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Augie said: Nobody expected it would be good enough at this point. They are gambling that they can mold him into something that WILL BE good enough. You seem to very very doubtful (at best) they can do it. I have my own reservations but I’ll remain hopeful, because that’s all I can do. But nobody knows for sure yet. So we wait and pray..... Agreed. It was a huge gamble that probably won't work out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 7 minutes ago, jrober38 said: As I said, Allen is the same guy dating back to his 2.5 years at Wyoming where he threw 650 passes. All the things he showed on tape there he shows on tape for us on a weekly basis, and it's not good enough. Well, by your standard, you must be really disappointed in Rosen and Darnold. Given what they showed at their respective schools, they should be light years ahead of Allen, at this point, in the NFL. Hmmmm.... Maybe they are all just playing like rookies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuddyDark Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 Just now, The Red King said: Did...you actually *read* the question? Because none of the above addresses it. But, the fact that you realize you have to keep ducking the question because you know you can't answer it speaks volumes. The thread doesn't ask if Tyrod is better then the Bills QBs. It asks if he would make them a playoff team. So, one more time... Do you think the Bills are a playoff team if Tyrod puts up the numbers he did in Cleveland? And if not, what makes you think he would put up better numbers with the 2018 Bills offense then he did with Cleveland's? The thread is a comparison of TT and Bills QBs. It's not about the Browns. You duck TT vs Bills QBs because you don't like the answer. If TT was with the Bills, he'd be better than the Bills QBs meaning they'd win more games. The Bills not the Browns. Would the Bills be better with TT is the question. The answer is YES. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 Just now, CuddyDark said: Absolutely, but if that one thing helps break a 17 year PO drought I'm all for it. Some might argue that they broke the playoff drought in spite of Taylor being at the helm of the 31st ranked passing game - not because of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longtimebillsfan Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 11 minutes ago, The Red King said: You keep avoiding the question. Lemmie spell it out. Tyrod, putting up the numbers he did with Cleveland this season, would not have made us a playoff team. Period. So, what makes you think he would have done better with this season's Bills then he did with the Browns. Sorry, 2018 Tyrod is not 2017 Tyrod. TT on this year's Bills, with the loss of three linemen and severe lack of offensive weapons would not have done as well as he did last year...and last year's Tyrod laid an egg against the Saints, and could only put up 9 on CAR. Not to mention that pitiful display in the JAX against a defense that surrendered far more to PIT and NE. You're romantisizing, looking at less interceptions while assuming the remainder of the offensive production remains the same, and it just doesn't work that way. Go watch Tyrod's Cleveland starts this year, then look me straight in the eye and tell me he could lead this team to the playoffs. Different team, different coaches. I believe our OC would have created game plans to better utilize Taylors strengths. You are obviously one of the Tyrod detractors. I find it hilarious when people in the 2017 season would whine about Tyrod not throwing for 300 yards, even though we would win the game. HE got us to the playoffs, and he was a big part of that. Next you will say we backed in to the playoffs. there is no such thing. We won enough games to make the playoffs. You are beating a dead horse. Tyrod is no longer on our team and he most likely never will be again. Let it go......Please. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 1 minute ago, billsfan1959 said: Well, by your standard, you must be really disappointed in Rosen and Darnold. Given what they showed at their respective schools, they should be light years ahead of Allen, at this point, in the NFL. Hmmmm.... Maybe they are all just playing like rookies... Or maybe they'll all be busts. NFL history suggests that's the more likely scenario. Mayfield was the guy I wanted. Never felt much for Darnold and thought Rosen's character issues were overblown. I'd have taken him at #7 over Allen, who I thought looked more like a 3rd round pick with upside than a guy you use a top 10 pick on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 1 minute ago, jrober38 said: Agreed. It was a huge gamble that probably won't work out. This may be where I differ from many here, but if everything else stays on this trajectory in terms of franchise building, managing the cap, drafting, etc. I’d give them another shot at picking the QB. It’s a crap shoot for everybody! Please don’t start over if everything but QB is going in the right direction! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuddyDark Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 1 minute ago, billsfan1959 said: Some might argue that they broke the playoff drought in spite of Taylor being at the helm of the 31st ranked passing game - not because of it. We'll they don't have TT this year and the QB'ing is worse not better. I'd bet they don't make the PO or go .500 without TT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hurricane Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 Get out of the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CuddyDark Posted November 16, 2018 Share Posted November 16, 2018 1 minute ago, Augie said: This may be where I differ from many here, but if everything else stays on this trajectory in terms of franchise building, managing the cap, drafting, etc. I’d give them another shot at picking the QB. It’s a crap shoot for everybody! Please don’t start over if everything but QB is going in the right direction! If they fire Beane I'd agree with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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