Was Trent Edwards broken?

[DFT]

13 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

If it was the hit, then why did he play his best game as a professional the following game against the Chargers?

 

For me, his decline was simple: defensive coordinators took away the quick interior routes that he lived off of and he couldn't challenge teams down the field.

Same reason Junior Seau or players we now know otherwise, never show signs.  Anything relative to concussion-driven encephalopathy is degenerative in nature.    The player can be fine from one minute to the next, but the early onset symptoms are very serious. It starts off with extreme paranoia, confusion and a propensity for PTSD like symptoms.   That’s just the beginning, too.   Once it becomes a fixture, as it has in his life, it becomes much much worse. Some players are too embarrassed to seek treatment, like JR was. He would seek offsite treatment, away from his peers, to reflect an image of strength. I remember Marcellus Wiley being very broken up, because he never knew what was happening. We see players all of the time, At the combine and pro days, young guys, that are displaying the early onset symptoms of CTE.  It’s ridiculously tragic.

Edited March 21, 2018 by DFT

[4merper4mer]

1 hour ago, DFT said:

 

Hey, so I re-watched them.   I’m still seeing a 7 yard average in College with no weapons.  I’m still seeing down-field passing in his first pro games until the hit.   Any other games I should watch?  I really want to try to see this thing more clearly from your professional perspective, which is clearly based off of facts and not juvenile emotional outbursts.   

And he almost won is that Monday nighter against Dallas where Romo threw 219 interceptions.  

[DFT]

2 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

And he almost won is that Monday nighter against Dallas where Romo threw 219 interceptions.  

English...   Do You Speak It? - Jules

Edited March 21, 2018 by DFT

[thebandit27]

2 minutes ago, DFT said:

Same reason Junior Seau or players we now know otherwise, never show signs.  Anything relative to concussion-driven encephalopathy is degenerative in nature.    The player can be fine from one minute to the next, but the early onset symptoms are very serious. It starts off with extreme paranoia, confusion and a propensity for PTSD like symptoms.   That’s just the beginning, too.   Once it becomes a fixture, as it has in his life, it becomes much much worse. Some players are too embarrassed to seek treatment, like JR was. He would seek offsite treatment, away from his peers, to reflect an image of strength. I remember Marsellus Wiley being very broken up, because he never knew what was happening. We see players all of the time, At the combine and pro days, young guys, that are displaying the early onset symptoms of CTE.  It’s ridiculously tragic.

 

I don't disagree with any of your comments about Seau or the unfortunate situation of guys "hiding" concussions.

 

I also don't think that Trent Edwards' concussion was some kind of unicorn concussion that caused a guy's career to fold up like a lawn chair--plenty of other guys have taken much worse hits and not seen that kind of decline.

[DFT]

5 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

 

I don't disagree with any of your comments about Seau or the unfortunate situation of guys "hiding" concussions.

 

I also don't think that Trent Edwards' concussion was some kind of unicorn concussion that caused a guy's career to fold up like a lawn chair--plenty of other guys have taken much worse hits and not seen that kind of decline.

Fair enough.  But no two hits to the head are the same.   You can have your bell rang pretty good and not have an ounce of TAU, found post-mortem.  But seeing him today, knowing him and having known him in school, the deterioration is very real.  They just didn’t know then, what we all know now.   

 

Also, remember that no condition that is degenerative, has any guarantee when symptoms show.  Degeneration of the brain can be as rampant as daily, weekly or beyond, before the symptoms take hold fully.

Edited March 21, 2018 by DFT

[4merper4mer]

33 minutes ago, DFT said:

English...   Do You Speak It? - Jules

I'll help you figure it out.  It is called a typo.  Change the I to a U and is becomes us.  It's magical but most people figured out the secret.  

[DFT]

2 minutes ago, 4merper4mer said:

I'll help you figure it out.  It is called a typo.  Change the I to a U and is becomes us.  It's magical but most people figured out the secret.  

Define “most people”, since you speak in failed certainty.   

[thenorthremembers]

He was never good.  Take a look at the statistics below.  Any change after the Arizona game, either good or bad was negligible.  

 

Prior to Arizona Game
Yrds/Gm	TD/GM	INT/GM	Comp %	Y/A	TD/INT Diff
182.8	.78	.71	58.7	6.6	+.07
After Arizona Game
183.4	.82	1	61.8	6.5	-.17

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, thebandit27 said:

If it was the hit, then why did he play his best game as a professional the following game against the Chargers?

 

For me, his decline was simple: defensive coordinators took away the quick interior routes that he lived off of and he couldn't challenge teams down the field.

See above. It is well established that severe concussions have effects that set in over time, especially when other subsequent hits are added in. The san diego game argument has been on this board for a decade now, and it's a weak argument. If that had happened to me, i would not be able to do my job.

[BringBackOrton]

15 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

He is probably my least favorite Bills player that I can remember. He was scared to play football. I’m not sure that he would have ever been more than okay but that would have been better than a lot of guys that we had. 

[dave mcbride]

13 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said:

He was never good.  Take a look at the statistics below.  Any change after the Arizona game, either good or bad was negligible.  

 

 

Prior to Arizona Game
Yrds/Gm	TD/GM	INT/GM	Comp %	Y/A	TD/INT Diff
182.8	.78	.71	58.7	6.6	+.07
After Arizona Game
183.4	.82	1	61.8	6.5	-.17

 

 False, simply put, at least for that season, which was first one in which he was named the starter. In the first four games of that season, he threw it 120 times for 949 yards. That's 7.9 ypa, which is well above league average. It is amazing to me that given what we know now, people discount the effects of that hit, which is one of the worst I've ever seen delivered to a qb.

[Matt_In_NH]

To me that is one of the biggest Bills myths out there.   He was captain checkdown from day one but he was able to have more success earlier on because there was not a lot of tape on him and once teams figured out how to defend by letting him have the checkdowns as easy completions with defenders not far away, he was not able to counterpunch.

 

He missed one game and when he came back he played good agains the Chargers.

[Steptide]

 

[DFT]

Just now, dave mcbride said:

 False, simply put, at least for that season, which was first one in which he was named the starter. In the first four games of that season, he threw it 120 times for 949 yards. That's 7.9 ypa, which is well above league average. It is amazing to me that given what we know now, people discount the effects of that hit, which is one of the worst I've ever seen delivered to a qb.

 

Just now, dave mcbride said:

 False, simply put, at least for that season, which was first one in which he was named the starter. In the first four games of that season, he threw it 120 times for 949 yards. That's 7.9 ypa, which is well above league average. It is amazing to me that given what we know now, people discount the effects of that hit, which is one of the worst I've ever seen delivered to a qb.

Don’t you dare throw facts into this emotionally fueled argument!  This is BUFFALO!  A drinking town with a football problem!  

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, thebandit27 said:

 

I don't disagree with any of your comments about Seau or the unfortunate situation of guys "hiding" concussions.

 

I also don't think that Trent Edwards' concussion was some kind of unicorn concussion that caused a guy's career to fold up like a lawn chair--plenty of other guys have taken much worse hits and not seen that kind of decline.

I can't think of a worse hit to a qb (important qualifier) in my decades of watching football. 

[dollars 2 donuts]

@The Red King

 

RK, it is a good point.

 

One other thing, really tangential to this, is there are many Stanford alum who blame the Bills for generally wrecking Edwards and that we wasted the potential he had.

[Matt_In_NH]

29 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

 False, simply put, at least for that season, which was first one in which he was named the starter. In the first four games of that season, he threw it 120 times for 949 yards. That's 7.9 ypa, which is well above league average. It is amazing to me that given what we know now, people discount the effects of that hit, which is one of the worst I've ever seen delivered to a qb.

 

You have never seen a QB have decent number for 4 games and then fall off?  4 games is about how much time it takes for defenses to figure out how to defend a QB.  

[BringBackOrton]

1 hour ago, DFT said:

Same reason Junior Seau or players we now know otherwise, never show signs.  Anything relative to concussion-driven encephalopathy is degenerative in nature.    The player can be fine from one minute to the next, but the early onset symptoms are very serious. It starts off with extreme paranoia, confusion and a propensity for PTSD like symptoms.   That’s just the beginning, too.   Once it becomes a fixture, as it has in his life, it becomes much much worse. Some players are too embarrassed to seek treatment, like JR was. He would seek offsite treatment, away from his peers, to reflect an image of strength. I remember Marcellus Wiley being very broken up, because he never knew what was happening. We see players all of the time, At the combine and pro days, young guys, that are displaying the early onset symptoms of CTE.  It’s ridiculously tragic.

yikes.

[DFT]

6 minutes ago, dollars 2 donuts said:

@The Red King

 

RK, it is a good point.

 

One other thing, really tangential to this, is there are many Stanford alum who blame the Bills for generally wrecking Edwards and that we wasted the potential he had.

The fans.  I wish our fan base could hear how terrified young QB prospects are to come here.   We have a propensity to be just brutal. 

[thebandit27]

27 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

I can't think of a worse hit to a qb (important qualifier) in my decades of watching football. 

 

The first two that come to mind off the top of my head are Bud Dupree on Matt Moore...

 

 

And Kiko Alonso on Joe Flacco...