klos63 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 35 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: What do you call "Big Contract" klos? Woods signed for $10M guaranteed, $7M this year and $8M next, then falls off. He's the 23rd paid WR in the NFL, which is pretty durn close to where he slots in if you project his 10 games as a starter out to 16 games. Goodwin signed for 2 years, $4.45M guaranteed ($3.2M cap this year). If willing to sign similar contracts, we could have signed both Woods and Goodwin and kept Sammy for ~$11M, which would put us like, 22 or 23rd for positional spending. The Bills are #30 in the league for positional spending on the WR group. We spent $5.4 M on Thompson, Jones, Matthews, Benjamin, and Holmes and got 1923 yds production. Woods and Goodwin contributed 1743 yds by themselves. In addition, the group of 5 above started 32 games. Goodwin and Woods started 27 games. Maybe they wouldn't have signed here for that, or wouldn't have done as well if they signed. Or maybe - just maybe- we got what we paid for, underwhelming performance out of a scrap-heap of other team's discards and an underperforming 2nd round rookie? Can we do the experiment? I guess big contract for a #2 WR when the #1 WR is making an anticipated $12MM. At the time of Woods leaving I assumed we were keeping Watkins and didn't think the team wanted to spend that much on their WR. I didn't calculate other teams positional spending in regards to ours. I just didn't think they wanted 2 big contracts at WR. I would have loved to have kept Woods, just explaining what I thought they were thinking. I don't believe we had a lot of cap space either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 4 hours ago, Spiderweb said: 59 for 962 and 56 for 781 (approx).. Goodwin seemed to have a pretty darned good year and Woods was very good for the Rams posse of WR's... Sure could have used some of that production and Goodwin's speed (17.2 per catch)...... Alas, we let them both walk... Let them walk?? I don't recall the specifics of Goodwin was he a FA or did we we release him, but do know Woods was a FA so we didn't "let him walk" HE CHOSE to leave!! big difference. Supposedly it was rumored he wanted to go to a west coast team. Could we have grossly overpaid, made him a crazy offer, couple million more than LA did to keep him here? Probably could have, for a couple more million, maybe he would have given up on the West Coast. But are you actually suggesting that would have been a smart idea? IMO that would have been one of the dumbest ideas to do that. Amazing how many keep posting like we somehow encouraged Woods to leave. The way you win these days in the NFL is re-sign your stars, look at your marginal players (Woods was a member of this group) and decide if they are worth paying the going rate for, (assuming they will accept that) but even then only re-sign a portion of them as you very quickly will be in salary cap hell if you sign too many. Then replace the rest with cheaper rookies and other FA's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1st Ammendment NoMas Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 (edited) Hogan has been doing well too. And Sammy did have 8TD's, just not a lot of catches or yards. Sammy, Hogan, Woods, Goodwin-- pretty solid group. I like Matthews and Benjamin. Thompson is ok, Holmes a major disappointment and Zay was terrible. We could use a good #2 and put Matthews in the slot and let Zay develop. Thompson stays as a deep threat and Holmes hits the road. I hope Streater improves and stays healthy and I want to see what Reilly can do. But we need a passer as a QB Edited January 9, 2018 by BillsRdue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 2 hours ago, Doc said: It pisses me off when guys, like Lynch and Goodwin, leave the Bills...and then decide to take their football careers seriously. Oh, yeah. But it kind of goes with losing, and a losing culture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 5 hours ago, Spiderweb said: 59 for 962 and 56 for 781 (approx).. Goodwin seemed to have a pretty darned good year and Woods was very good for the Rams posse of WR's... Sure could have used some of that production and Goodwin's speed (17.2 per catch)...... Alas, we let them both walk... Alas....Bills revision history. Please, NO ONE wanted Goodwin back on this team. In his 4 years in Buffalo he never showed that he could stay healthy enough to play a full season. He did show some great speed as a deep threat but it was very frustrating because he'd always get hurt and miss time. He also had some very costly drops. Bottom line, his play on the field didn't seem to warrant a contract extension. He had a great year in San Francisco and good for him, but you can't fault the Bills for not resigning him. Woods did show some flashes with the Bills but I think you can argue that he didn't show enough for the Bills to attempt to match the big deal he received with the Rams. While Woods made a huge contribution for the Rams this year, you can argue his best season (2017) wasn't that far off from his production in 2014. The Rams overpaid for a WR of his caliber on the open market, the Bills weren't prepared to do that. Again, it's hard to fault them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 (edited) 56 minutes ago, Ed_Formerly_of_Roch said: Let them walk?? I don't recall the specifics of Goodwin was he a FA or did we we release him, but do know Woods was a FA so we didn't "let him walk" HE CHOSE to leave!! big difference. Supposedly it was rumored he wanted to go to a west coast team. Could we have grossly overpaid, made him a crazy offer, couple million more than LA did to keep him here? Probably could have, for a couple more million, maybe he would have given up on the West Coast. But are you actually suggesting that would have been a smart idea? IMO that would have been one of the dumbest ideas to do that. Amazing how many keep posting like we somehow encouraged Woods to leave. The way you win these days in the NFL is re-sign your stars, look at your marginal players (Woods was a member of this group) and decide if they are worth paying the going rate for, (assuming they will accept that) but even then only re-sign a portion of them as you very quickly will be in salary cap hell if you sign too many. Then replace the rest with cheaper rookies and other FA's "Let them walk" is a common term for a FA we don't offer a contract to. I could be mistaken, but I believe we did not offer a contract to either Woods or Goodwin, hence, we "let them walk. Yes, Goodwin was a FA. I did not think Woods was a marginal player at all, and his performance this year given a larger role confirms this. We were in "salary cap hell" because we chose to re-sign "stars" at inflated prices without appropriate conditions (eg Dareus) and overpay for some FA who have not been difference makers (Clay). The facts are, we were #30 in the league for spending on WR and sometimes you get what you pay for. 2 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said: Alas....Bills revision history. Please, NO ONE wanted Goodwin back on this team. In his 4 years in Buffalo he never showed that he could stay healthy enough to play a full season. He did show some great speed as a deep threat but it was very frustrating because he'd always get hurt and miss time. He also had some very costly drops. Bottom line, his play on the field didn't seem to warrant a contract extension. He had a great year in San Francisco and good for him, but you can't fault the Bills for not resigning him. Woods did show some flashes with the Bills but I think you can argue that he didn't show enough for the Bills to attempt to match the big deal he received with the Rams. While Woods made a huge contribution for the Rams this year, you can argue his best season (2017) wasn't that far off from his production in 2014. The Rams overpaid for a WR of his caliber on the open market, the Bills weren't prepared to do that. Again, it's hard to fault them. I do understand the Bills letting Goodwin walk. He was a "screw job" here focused on his track career first, and we enabled that. Wood, on the other hand, got paid pretty much in line with his 2016 production extended to 16 games, and he showed all the intangibles you want in a team guy (blocking ability etc) Edited January 9, 2018 by Hapless Bills Fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 9 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Oh, yeah. But it kind of goes with losing, and a losing culture. Yeah and they were a part of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 1 hour ago, klos63 said: I guess big contract for a #2 WR when the #1 WR is making an anticipated $12MM. At the time of Woods leaving I assumed we were keeping Watkins and didn't think the team wanted to spend that much on their WR. I didn't calculate other teams positional spending in regards to ours. I just didn't think they wanted 2 big contracts at WR. I would have loved to have kept Woods, just explaining what I thought they were thinking. I don't believe we had a lot of cap space either. When we passed up Watkins 5th year option and didn't reno with him, it was pretty clear to me we didn't plan to keep him. FYI, positional spending by team is available on Overthecap https://overthecap.com/ and Spotrac http://www.spotrac.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klos63 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 40 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: When we passed up Watkins 5th year option and didn't reno with him, it was pretty clear to me we didn't plan to keep him. FYI, positional spending by team is available on Overthecap https://overthecap.com/ and Spotrac http://www.spotrac.com/ Not trying to start an argument, but Woods signed with the Rams in March, Whaley fired in April and Watkins declined by new regime in May. Very likely Whaley intended to pick up the option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptnCoke11 Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 14 hours ago, Spiderweb said: 59 for 962 and 56 for 781 (approx).. Goodwin seemed to have a pretty darned good year and Woods was very good for the Rams posse of WR's... Sure could have used some of that production and Goodwin's speed (17.2 per catch)...... Alas, we let them both walk... You really didn’t think this thought out did you? Just looked at stats and started typing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yav Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 14 hours ago, Kmart128 said: We as the Bills organization. The previous Bills regime.... Not the fans. They assumed cause of stats that they were the problem when it was clearly Tyrod Fair enough. I still don't like how that reads - lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Livinginthepast Posted January 9, 2018 Share Posted January 9, 2018 I was really impressed with Woods just in that game on Saturday. He looked like the stud receiver that we wanted Watkins to be. Over and over again unfortunately it comes back to TT as the weakest link. He just cannot get the ball to the WRs and if anything this year it got worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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