Bray Wyatt Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 In my opinion, the signs are pointing against Buffalo going QB at #10. But I wouldn't be surprised at all if they take one later in the draft. 1. Re-Signing Taylor (after months of back and forth debate) tells me they didn't see Free Agency or the Draft offering immediate upgrades at the position. 2. They haven't pursued a veteran backup. That tells me they are probably leaving a roster spot open alongside Taylor and Jones for a draft pick. 3. I have heard about draft visits for Mahomes and Watson. But nothing on Trubisky, who is generally considered the top QB prospect. There is a good chance Trubisky is still available at #10, but probably not much longer. The other guys may drop to late first or even second round. This tells me they are more interested in mid/late round prospects at QB. I think the only late round prospect at QB they have met with is Kelly (that I know of anyway) and man that would be a polarizing pick from a fan stand point! The only reason I haven't ruled out a top pick on a QB as typically new regimes want to bring in their guy and if a top prospect falls to us at 10 it would be hard to pass up, also TT's new deal is essentially a 2 year deal so I have to imagine they would hedge their bets and take a top prospect either this year or next year. Someone like Trubisky could benefit from sitting a year or two (although you would think we would at least bring him in for a visit if he was going to be an option) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 You are right on this year's draft. I think most years the "elite" talent is around 3-5 guys. This year is more like 6-7. Unfortunately, I don't see teams reaching for QBs early this year. And if any of the elite prospects drop, it's more than likely to be one of the Running Backs (which we don't need). The guys we need to drop (Jamal Adams, Malik Hooker, Marshon Lattimore)... I believe will be long gone. At #10, I think the Bills are likely to have a choice between guys like Mike Williams, Corey Davis, OJ Howard, Reuben Foster, Cam Robinson. Yes, they are all good prospects at positions of need. But in those cases, I don't see a huge drop off in talent by going down 5-10 spots. And there is a good chance someone on that list is still available. That's fair enough. I very much like the idea of Foster, but I would definitely be just as happy with Reddick and an extra pick or 2 from a trade back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted March 30, 2017 Author Share Posted March 30, 2017 (edited) In regards to Taylor, yeah you cant blame the scouts as we have the benefit of hindsight and yes he had talent. But if you knew now that you would only get a couple years out of him, would you have spent the pick on him? I wouldn't have. Hence the lived up to the spot point I was making. So your point no longer had anything to do with Taylor being a safety? That was how this started and was the point he and I were making with you. And Taylor played for three and a half years, not a couple, before being shot to death in the botched robbery. He fully lived up to his draft spot. I was trying to draw a similar comparison as I believe Jack's knee was a degenerative thing, and he is rumored to only have a limited number of years. Now that I think of it, wasn't Kuoandjio rumored to have a knee thing that wouldn't last long too? Could also explain his drop. I guess the point I was trying to make is that if people know that a players shelf life is limited, it impacts their draft stock and if there was a re-draft done, Taylor would not have been picked in the top 10 imo What? I have no idea what leap you're making here, and I've pretty much lost interest in the discussion at this point, as it has wandered very very far, from what I can figure out. Of course if people know your shelf life is limited it affects your draft stock. But they didn't know that about Taylor or any of the other safeties ... you know what, I don't even know what subject you're discussing anymore. Safeties in the top ten aren't necessarily a bad deal. Plenty of them have had enough impact to justify that kind of placement. See you around the boards. Edited March 30, 2017 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 I see what McD did here http://m.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/Bills-Today-Early-plans-for-Bills-defensive-backs-discussed/f3e62a5c-c2ac-407c-90ff-19c2f92b4186 Speaking with reporters at the owner's meetings, McDermott said that his defense is built on specific qualities that defensive backs need to have to be successful in his scheme. "It's nice to be out there and able to run but this is not track practice, this is football," McDermott said. "So we've got to be able to be physical and tackle. That's a big part of it for us and our identity - you guys have heard me say it before and you'll continue to hear me say it - our identity on defense will be built around our corners and their tackling ability and how much our defensive line runs to the football. Those to me are big selling points for our defense." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokestradamus Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 I see what McD did here http://m.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/Bills-Today-Early-plans-for-Bills-defensive-backs-discussed/f3e62a5c-c2ac-407c-90ff-19c2f92b4186 In a league where they pass more than they run, it's nice having it but it's not the first thing you should evaluate. If this means I get Corn Elder, happy days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 Well I guess we aren't taking Gareon my wayward son! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokestradamus Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 Well I guess we aren't taking Gareon my wayward son! I've had that song in my !@#$ing head for days because of you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 I've had that song in my !@#$ing head for days because of you lol... we started it (in a very drunken state) at the end of the Wisconsin game and I can't listen to that song anymore without inserting his name. Also, sorry! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bray Wyatt Posted March 30, 2017 Share Posted March 30, 2017 (edited) So your point no longer had anything to do with Taylor being a safety? That was how this started and was the point he and I were making with you. And Taylor played for three and a half years, not a couple, before being shot to death in the botched robbery. He fully lived up to his draft spot. What? I have no idea what leap you're making here, and I've pretty much lost interest in the discussion at this point, as it has wandered very very far, from what I can figure out. Of course if people know your shelf life is limited it affects your draft stock. But they didn't know that about Taylor or any of the other safeties ... you know what, I don't even know what subject you're discussing anymore. Safeties in the top ten aren't necessarily a bad deal. Plenty of them have had enough impact to justify that kind of placement. See you around the boards. Here was my original post, which maybe you missed: Bray Wyatt, on 29 Mar 2017 - 09:56 AM, said: Just went back to 2002 and here are the safeties selected in the top 10: Roy Williams Sean Taylor Michael Huff Donte Whitner (ugh) Laron Landry Eric Berry So in the last 15 years there have been 6 safeties in taken in the top 10, and the only real star (lived up to draft spot) I would argue is Berry. My point being a safety taken in the top 10 rarely seems to live up to that spot (ie not good value) I am not sure what is hard to grasp there but whatever You seem to like to split hairs, a couple of years vs three and a half years is really a point you want to argue? I used the term a couple as I knew it wasn't a lot but didn't know the specific amount, ridiculous to even have a discussion with you if you have to point these things out And if you think only playing 3 and a half years lives up to warrant a top ten pick (circumstances around it are irrelevant, imo it is no different than a career ending injury in regards to draft value in hindsight) You can disagree with it all you want as that is your opinion and this is mine, but your condescension is unnecessary Edited March 30, 2017 by Bray Wyatt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 Gilmore gave up numbers right in tune with the other top corners. He also gave up big plays by missing tackles or getting drug down field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldmanfan Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 I see what McD did here http://m.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/Bills-Today-Early-plans-for-Bills-defensive-backs-discussed/f3e62a5c-c2ac-407c-90ff-19c2f92b4186 If McD places emphasis on CBs tackling ability it makes sense that they let Gilmore go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TPS Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 Great piece. However, I found the most interesting Bills-related part was Kyle Shanahan. McDermott went up against him the past two years, and it obviously left an impression. The relevant part: "Shanahan’s Falcons offense was the best in football last year. Privately, some coaches even said it was the best they’d ever seen. Its brilliance was in the way it used running backs, fullbacks and tight ends. Shanahan would align those players anywhere on the field, giving the Falcons an unlimited supply of formations. Often, those unconventional formations would compel the defense to reveal whether it was in man or zone coverage. Knowing this would be the case, Shanahan would design for routes on one side of the formation to beat man coverage and routes on the other side to beat zone." So, what does McDermott do? First, he finds an OC from a similar coaching tree going back to Kyle's father. In FA, he goes after FBs who are good pass catchers, as well as adding another pass-catching RB. They also wanted to add another pass-catching TE, but couldn't land one. The run on FBs makes sense now. My read: this makes OJ Howard a prime candidate at 10. Imagine a 2-TE set (Clay and Howard) with shady and Dimarco in the backfield, and Watkins the only WR. This gives you the ability to have a power running set, then morph at will into 3-wide with Watkins, OJ, and either Shady (or DImarco). This type of O makes WR less of a need, so I think a TE will be taken with one of the first 2 picks, with OJ the one they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilcoam Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 Interesting post TPS Though I will say TT is not Ryan and we do not have a Sanu currently on our roster That being said Howard would be amazing pic at #10 if he's still there when we pick regardless jc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted March 31, 2017 Author Share Posted March 31, 2017 Well I guess we aren't taking Gareon my wayward son! There'll be peace when he is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted March 31, 2017 Author Share Posted March 31, 2017 (edited) Here was my original post, which maybe you missed: Bray Wyatt, on 29 Mar 2017 - 09:56 AM, said: My point being a safety taken in the top 10 rarely seems to live up to that spot (ie not good value) I am not sure what is hard to grasp there but whatever You seem to like to split hairs, a couple of years vs three and a half years is really a point you want to argue? I used the term a couple as I knew it wasn't a lot but didn't know the specific amount, ridiculous to even have a discussion with you if you have to point these things out And if you think only playing 3 and a half years lives up to warrant a top ten pick (circumstances around it are irrelevant, imo it is no different than a career ending injury in regards to draft value in hindsight) You can disagree with it all you want as that is your opinion and this is mine, but your condescension is unnecessary It wasn't condescension. It was annoyance at argument point drift. And your original post completely proves my annoyance reasonable. In your refusal to stop arguing you went from saying in your original post that Sean Taylor did not live up to his draft spot (which is just dead wrong, as I have been arguing all along) to somehow wanting to argue that his being shot somehow is an argument that he was a bad pick. Which is nonsense. That and something about Miles Jack's degenerative knee having something to do with why safeties shouldn't be taken in the top ten, which even after two posts where you tried to explain has no earthly connection which I can see. Things have gone far enough off-track that I am (actually) bowing out. You are obviously a guy who needs the last word. Go for it. As I said, see you on the boards. Edited March 31, 2017 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 He also gave up big plays by missing tackles or getting drug down field. They would all be in the numbers. Gilmore haters gonna hate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blokestradamus Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 They would all be in the numbers. Gilmore haters gonna hate. And missed as many tackles as great tackler Ronald Darby, while playing more snaps. But narratives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 (edited) There'll be peace when he is done. Lay your weary head to rest Don't you cry no more. Edited March 31, 2017 by ShadyBillsFan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wilcoam Posted March 31, 2017 Share Posted March 31, 2017 Regardless, Hooker and Adams are absolutely going top 10 this year And I don't think the 2 teams that take em will shy away because of this public info or perception that safeties rarely pan out as HOF's Remember where you go in the draft has less to do about your overall talent in comparison to NFL legends And more to do to with a comparison to that years draft class And if no QB's go in the top 10 this year neither Adams or Hooker will be there at #10 So it wont affect our Bills Though you make a great case from staying away from the next safety Peppers, lol I will say I'm jealous of the what the Phins and NE currently have at safety Humungous talent over and above our new additions Poyer and Hyde, based on previous play I drool over the conceptual idea of an Adams or Hooker on our Bills Don't care of they don't become HOF's, just give us 5 above average years jc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manther Posted April 1, 2017 Share Posted April 1, 2017 I really think a dude being murdered is a bit of an extenuating circumstance in regards to not living up to draft status, Taylor was well on his way to being a perennial All Pro. I also don't think the Steelers regret taking Polamalu, or the Ravens regret Ed Reed, or the Seahawks regret Earl Thomas, all three were 1st round picks. All good points! I really think a dude being murdered is a bit of an extenuating circumstance in regards to not living up to draft status, Taylor was well on his way to being a perennial All Pro. I also don't think the Steelers regret taking Polamalu, or the Ravens regret Ed Reed, or the Seahawks regret Earl Thomas, all three were 1st round picks. All good points! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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