You are my sunshine, my only sunshine Jerry

[oldmanfan]

We agree that Whaley stuck with EJ too long. But there was a reason for it. He over-rated the player he scouted. He over-rated him as a prospect and as a pro. It was a damaging decision because the organization was so invested in EJ it passed on better prospects later on.

I'm not saying Whaley had nothing to do with th EJ draft. He,Nix, and Martinez went and evaluated him. Only that when it came time to pick that was Nix as the GM responsible.

The Bills media. You know, the organization. They said it was Doug.

 

No conjecture. It's clear the organization has been talking out of both sides of their mouth in their attempt at PR spin. They praised Whaley for the 2013 draft until that draft proved to suck. Now it was Nix's draft because his name was on the door, but any of the good moves were Whaley's.

 

Like I said, no wonder they find it so easy.

I'd be interested in any actual articles etc from the Bills saying this.

[Green Lightning]

 

 

So you are saying that clicks have created the current Jerry Sullivan? That he wasn't read (or writing the same pieces) before they went to on line format?

 

He's never changed his takes no matter the format.

OK, one last time. No, I am saying clicks drive his bile even more to extreme views to drive more to read his stuff. He's more negative than ever. Now there is an newsroom tool to track in real time and for all to see, every time someone clicks on his story. This is leading many writers to go to more extremes to provoke readers to read them - to agree or to loathe them - doesn't matter, a click's a click. So if you don't like his stuff, don't read it. If enough folks do it, editors and publishers take note. There, I'm done laying it out. If you done agree, whatever.

[dave mcbride]

You refuse to deal in fact. Nix was GM in 2013at the time of the draft. Nix also said before he retired he wanted to make sure he brought ina QB. Blame Whaley for staying with him too long , but he wasn't GM that draft.

I have fact, you have conspiracy theory.

? -- are you aware that Whaley personally scouted Robert Woods and EJ that year? His USC scouting trip also also led him to conclude that Barkley wasn't good enough. That was the first draf in years that saw the Bills draft players from the west coast (woods and Alonso). That draft was all Whaley. I thought people here were aware of this.

[KellyToTasker]

You are right that Nix was the GM when EJ was selected. But it was Whaley who evaluated and ranked the qb prospects in that draft. EJ should have had a third or fourth round grade on him. Whaley stuck with EJ longer than he should because he over-rated him. That's his fault.

 

Do we know that Whaley didn't have a 3rd or 4th round grade on EJ? Or, is it speculation that Whaley had a 1st round grade on EJ because he was taken in the first. It can be a case of....Hey Buddy, out of these QBs.....He's your best option. Due to open comments, pre-draft 2013, about taking a QB....They were locked into taking a guy like EJ in round 1.

 

Buddy loved big school players. EJ was an easy guy to talk themselves into (Big QB, big school, good leadership traits, etc.).

[oldmanfan]

? -- are you aware that Whaley personally scouted Robert Woods and EJ that year? His USC scouting trip also also led him to conclude that Barkley wasn't good enough. That was the first draf in years that saw the Bills draft players from the west coast (woods and Alonso). That draft was all Whaley. I thought people here were aware of this.

Yes. Are you aware Nix and Marrone went with Whaley to look at EJ? And are you aware who the GM was at the time of the draft?

[dave mcbride]

Do we know that Whaley didn't have a 3rd or 4th round grade on EJ? Or, is it speculation that Whaley had a 1st round grade on EJ because he was taken in the first. It can be a case of....Hey Buddy, out of these QBs.....He's your best option. Due to open comments, pre-draft 2013, about taking a QB....They were locked into taking a guy like EJ in round 1.

Buddy loved big school players. EJ was an easy guy to talk themselves into (Big QB, big school, good leadership traits, etc.).

And Buddy never drafted guys from the west coast EVER. It was basically an all-stars from the former confederacy draft every year. That's not a horrible approach--the SEC, Florida State, and (usually) Texas are loaded with talent. The Bills' two second round picks that year were from the west coast. Whaley did a scouting trip to the west that spring and scouted Manuel on a windy, rainy day, concluding that he could, in his words, really "spin" the ball.

Yes. Are you aware Nix and Marrone went with Whaley to look at EJ? And are you aware who the GM was at the time of the draft?

I am quite aware that a septuagenarian was the nominal GM who was halfway out the door on his way to his retirement home in Alabama.

 

And, by the way, I'm not even criticizing Whaley here -- they had to take a qb, and there weren't any better ones than Manuel. The guy they got in the tradedown was Alonso, who has proven to be a better player than a lot of first round picks (he played pretty well last season--PFF's 48th best LB overall last season). Woods is a solid player too.

Edited March 26, 2017 by dave mcbride

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

🍿

 

and real football talk is months away

Is there some kind of reward for the # of times people type EJ?

[oldmanfan]

And Buddy never drafted guys from the west coast EVER. It was basically an all-stars from the former confederacy draft every year. That's not a horrible approach--the SEC, Florida State, and (usually) Texas are loaded with talent. The Bills' two second round picks that year were from the west coast. Whaley did a scouting trip to the west that spring and scouted Manuel on a windy, rainy day, concluding that he could, in his words, really "spin" the ball.

I am quite aware that a septuagenarian was the nominal GM who was halfway out the door on his way to his retirement home in Alabama.

 

And, by the way, I'm not even criticizing Whaley here -- they had to take a qb, and there weren't any better ones than Manuel. The guy they got in the tradedown was Alonso, who has proven to be a better player than a lot of first round picks (he played well last season). Woods is a solid player too.

Meaning Nix was the GM when EJ was drafted

[dave mcbride]

Meaning Nix was the GM when EJ was drafted

It's clear that's your story and you're sticking with it. We aren't going to agree, and I'll leave it at that.

[oldmanfan]

It's clear that's your story and you're sticking with it. We aren't going to agree, and I'll leave it at that.

Here's the thing. I have no problem debating opinions. But when you have an actual fact, in this case that Buddy Nix was the GM of the Buffalo Bills on the day of the 2013 draft, why argue?

[jethro_tull]

Wow another hateful rant by Jerry, I wonder if he can even order a cup of coffee without bitching about how hot it is. I sometimes wonder if the Pegulas sit around and shake their heads sometimes regarding the media in Buffalo. The most negative market in the country bar none. Hopefully Monday we can get more "drought trivia" from the geniuses at WGR. Simply awful and embarrassing to see how negative the whole market is

negativity exists in other markets. the press in ny and chicago easily eclipse the buffalo media when it comes to negativity and people bashing. heck, the chicago media trashes mike ditka!

Edited March 26, 2017 by jethro_tull

[Rico]

No, they are swindling because the company line is accepted without thought.

The naive section of the fanbase is more than happy to defend the indefensible. Sad!

[JohnC]

It's clear that's your story and you're sticking with it. We aren't going to agree, and I'll leave it at that.

What's clear is that Wilson's hiring of Levy and following it up with Nix set this franchise back by years. I had high hopes for Whaley to bring this backwater franchise into the modern era. In that respect I think he did modernize the scouting department and organizational structure. My criticism is over his performance. His drafting has been average at best and his cap management has been poor. There seems to be a lack of coherency and philosophy to his roster building.

 

Whaley's biggest failure is not only his inability to secure the qb position but his seemingly passivity to address it . As a GM the roster you put together can have a number of flaws but by having a good qb those flaws can be overridden. When you don't have a credible qb taking the snaps your weaknesses get magnified. That's the issue that is going to sabotage everything he wants to accomplish. Dithering is not a solution. And that is his fault.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

What's clear is that Wilson's hiring of Levy and following it up with Nix set this franchise back by years. I had high hopes for Whaley to bring this backwater franchise into the modern era. In that respect I think he did modernize the scouting department and organizational structure. My criticism is over his performance. His drafting has been average at best and his cap management has been poor. There seems to be a lack of coherency and philosophy to his roster building.

 

Whaley's biggest failure is not only his inability to secure the qb position but his seemingly passivity to address it . As a GM the roster you put together can have a number of flaws but by having a good qb those flaws can be overridden. When you don't have a credible qb taking the snaps your weaknesses get magnified. That's the issue that is going to sabotage everything he wants to accomplish. Dithering is not a solution. And that is his fault.

 

....a couple of points.....the DonoHOLE era of disaster with his demand to be anointed "El Presidente" and his total control freak nature set this club back a decade......RW went into panic mode when he learned his inner circle of trust was woefully violated.....so he called Marv who he trusted, started elevating Brandon who he trusted into positions not qualified for and relied on Buddy (think he was about 70) who he trusted....thus the era of "OBD Patchwork FO" began.......followed by Jauron, Gailey and Marrone......"Nightmare on Abbott Road"....Whaley came from pretty good pedigree ala the Steelers and I sure as hell hope Colbert was MORE influential than DonoHOLE........DW has been "middle of the pack" despite this mess which is not quite good enough....BUT....Pegula is a pretty smart guy....he is starting year 3 of ownership and the club is 15-17 so far, hardly what TP would want.....so me thinks DW is on TP's radar and if he does not like what he sees, he'll pull the plug just as he did with Regier when he determined ON HIS OWN TIMETABLE that 'ol Darcy needed to pack....stay tuned..............

Edited March 26, 2017 by OldTimeAFLGuy

[oldmanfan]

 

....a couple of points.....the DonoHOLE era of disaster with his demand to be anointed "El Presidente" and his total control freak nature set this club back a decade......RW went into panic mode when he learned his inner circle of trust was woefully violated.....so he called Marv who he trusted, started elevating Brandon who he trusted into positions not qualified for and relied on Buddy (think he was about 70) who he trusted....thus the era of "OBD Patchwork FO" began.......followed by Jauron, Gailey and Marrone......"Nightmare on Abbott Road"....Whaley came from pretty good pedigree ala the Steelers and I sure as hell hope Colbert was MORE influential than DonoHOLE........DW has been "middle of the pack" despite this mess which is not quite good enough....BUT....Pegula is a pretty smart guy....he is starting year 3 of ownership and the club is 15-17 so far, hardly what TP would want.....so me thinks DW is on TP's radar and if he does not like what he sees, he'll pull the plug just as he did with Regier when he determined ON HIS OWN TIMETABLE that 'ol Darcy needed to pack....stay tuned..............

Perfectly stated. I would add that Butler leaving begat Donahue. And Butler got canned by Ralph because he was negotiating with the Chargers while still working for Ralph.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

Perfectly stated. I would add that Butler leaving begat Donahue. And Butler got canned by Ralph because he was negotiating with the Chargers while still working for Ralph.

....great point on Butler....and he was responsible for cap jail...a very good friend of mine was at OBD the day RW fired John.....man died way too early.....BTW, I'm confused by some posts pointing the finger at DW for "cap management".....Overdorf is the capologist and the lead dawg for contracts...I see HIM telling Whaley, "sorry it won't fit" versus DW telling Jim what to do....

[FireChan]

I'm not saying Whaley had nothing to do with th EJ draft. He,Nix, and Martinez went and evaluated him. Only that when it came time to pick that was Nix as the GM responsible.

 

I'd be interested in any actual articles etc from the Bills saying this.

Your wish is my command.

 

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/Jerry-Hughes-trade-among-best-in-NFL-in-2013/192f0b71-c9f8-4eeb-958f-d7f0c3c1a9e0

 

http://blogs.buffalobills.com/2015/03/09/bills-trade-for-hughes-not-lost-on-pass-rusher/

 

Funny how Nix resigned 2 weeks after that but I just don't see his name anywhere.

[Maynard]

I'm ready to move on from Whaley. I actually hope Jerry is accurate here.

[oldmanfan]

Your wish is my command.

 

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/Jerry-Hughes-trade-among-best-in-NFL-in-2013/192f0b71-c9f8-4eeb-958f-d7f0c3c1a9e0

 

http://blogs.buffalobills.com/2015/03/09/bills-trade-for-hughes-not-lost-on-pass-rusher/

 

Funny how Nix resigned 2 weeks after that but I just don't see his name anywhere.

Brown is wrong in article 2. Article 1 was written months after the trade when Whaley was actually GM.

 

And Nix was still GM for the 2013 draft, the one in which he said he was going to be sure he found a QB before he retired.

[FireChan]

Brown is wrong in article 2. Article 1 was written months after the trade when Whaley was actually GM.

 

And Nix was still GM for the 2013 draft, the one in which he said he was going to be sure he found a QB before he retired.

Right, they are just simple errors occurring that keep giving Whaley credit for the good moves under Nix who was the nominal GM.

 

Like I said, boy do they make it easy.