Whaley wants Cardale to be 2017 starter

[Buffalo Boy]

What is the difference between Kelly going 4-12 his first year and Jones doing it next year?

If he isn't the andswer and there is no hope in him becoming the answer or not, we know and have a shot the following season.

This is not a playoff caliber team and with a new staff and new systems on both sides of the ball it is a start from scratch proposition.

Cut the dead weight. See which dogs can hunt and set yourself up for 2018's draft.

[Gugny]

Depends on the improvements on defense and what other additions are made on offense.

 

Exactly. How about we look for a QB who can be good without everyone around him needing to be top 5 in the league? That's where I am with this situation.

 

Is the answer DEFINITELY out there? That is unknown.

 

Is the answer Tyrod Taylor? That is a 100% known, proven NO.

 

Time to move on.

[jeffismagic]

What is the difference between Kelly going 4-12 his first year and Jones doing it next year?

If he isn't the andswer and there is no hope in him becoming the answer or not, we know and have a shot the following season.

This is not a playoff caliber team and with a new staff and new systems on both sides of the ball it is a start from scratch proposition.

Cut the dead weight. See which dogs can hunt and set yourself up for 2018's draft.

 

Many fans still imagine the defense will be top 5 because Rex is gone. They forget that Mario Williams is gone, Kyle could retire, Jerry Hughes looked awful last year (injured?), Aaron Williams probably gone, Gilmore probably gone, Lorenzo Alexander FA, Zach Brown FA, and the one safety we have is older than old. Our linebackers were drafted for a different schemes that we won't be running any longer.

 

Defense is a mess and just playing a 4-3 won't make us great again.

[dave mcbride]

literally laughed out loud

 

I like Cardale but DW has been a big part of a front office that has missed on guys like Russell Wilson, David Carr and Dak Prescott......passed right under his nose....but he trusts his eyes on Cardale? Hmmm

I lol'ed too, but unlike you I have nearly zero hope for Jones. As I said elsewhere, he really does seem like a dolt. Taylor is a far better (and far smarter) player than him right now. I can only think that this is a plan to tank it. It's the only thing that makes sense, but of course we must bear in mind that Doug loves loves loves those QBs that he drafts ... Edited February 11, 2017 by dave mcbride

[PolishDave]

What is the difference between Kelly going 4-12 his first year and Jones doing it next year?

If he isn't the andswer and there is no hope in him becoming the answer or not, we know and have a shot the following season.

This is not a playoff caliber team and with a new staff and new systems on both sides of the ball it is a start from scratch proposition.

Cut the dead weight. See which dogs can hunt and set yourself up for 2018's draft.

 

Making decisions like it is Madden football is fun. But real NFL teams are run more like a business. There are negative consequences to throwing seasons away on a whim.

[Gugny]

I lol'ed too, but unlike you I have nearly zero hope for Jones. As I said elsewhere, he really does seem like a dolt. Taylor is a far better (and far smarter) player than him right now. I can only think that this is a plan to tank it. It's the only thing that makes sense, but of course we must bear in mind that Doug loves loves loves those QBs that he drafts ...

 

Smarter, based on what? That's a serious question.

[Gugny]

Yes because those QBs are a dime a dozen.

 

Look for a QB like that WHILE you have TT on your roster. What is so incomprehensible about this? You can afford TT plus another rookie QBs salary on your roster.

 

Is he the answer? What does that even mean? You can win with Tyrod given the right pieces around him such as a defense that doesn't blow and another weapon outisde of Sammy, IMO.

 

What is so incomprehensible is giving him starter money when he's nothing but a glorified backup. Not to mention, we won't win more than 8 !@#$ing games, so why bother?

 

The Bills had the best run game in football and receivers open ALL DAY, EVERY DAY, and he couldn't score when it mattered most. Ever.

 

At some point, people need to expect more out of the QB position. He sucks.

[Gugny]

Lol laughable.

 

He's an 8-8 QB because it was his fault his defense blew chunks? Top 7 scoring offense, never turns the ball over, and his ability to improvise is among the best in the NFL. He most certainly doesn't suck.... but then again I'm talking to a guy who thought EJ Manuel was great.

 

He's not an 8-8 QB.

 

The Bills are an 8-8 team.

 

Partially because the defense sucked. Partially because the passing game sucked.

 

I'm not putting this all on Tyrod, but to sit here and tell me that he has been even a "good" QB over the past two seasons, I will tell you and anyone who agrees with you that you are out of your mind.

 

He is not a good QB. We did not have a good defense. Our team sucked because of it.

 

And if we don't change BOTH of those areas, they will continue to suck.

[billsfan_34]

Cardale aint starting, period, end of story.

[Gugny]

He's a decent QB. I'd say slight above average. He's not a conventional QB which is what people seem to be up in arms about and it's !@#$ing idiotic in my opinion. If your team scores TDs then who the !@#$ cares how you do it? "Yea, but we rank close to the bottom in passing!!" Seriously? Who !@#$ing cares?

 

His ability to open up holes for the run game, improvise, and make something out of nothing is what separates him from guys like McCown or a Hoyer.... and he throws a great deep ball.

 

Like I said, im all for drafting a QB in round 1.... the chances of that guy being better then Tyrod over the next two years is slim to none, IMO. Keep Tyrod, draft a guy until he is BETTER then Tyrod.

 

It would be beneficial for EVERYONE in the organization to keep Tyrod, fix the defense then to kick Tyrod to the curb and bring in a rookie or scrub veteran while fixing the defense as well.

 

You're either trolling or you're Dog90210 in disguise.

 

Sweet Jesus.

[Kirby Jackson]

 

He's not an 8-8 QB.

 

The Bills are an 8-8 team.

 

Partially because the defense sucked. Partially because the passing game sucked.

 

I'm not putting this all on Tyrod, but to sit here and tell me that he has been even a "good" QB over the past two seasons, I will tell you and anyone who agrees with you that you are out of your mind.

 

He is not a good QB. We did not have a good defense. Our team sucked because of it.

 

And if we don't change BOTH of those areas, they will continue to suck.

Would you agree with average? Over the last 2 years here are 3 QBs that played 29 games (their record, yards, TDs and INTs):

 

QB A: 14-15, 259 YPG, 45 TDs, 24 INTs

QB B: 15-14, 249 YPG, 47 TDs, 12 INTs

QB C: 16-12-1, 268 YPG, 50 TDs, 15 INTs

 

answer: Tannehill, Tyrod, Dalton

 

The Bills didn't win because of Tyrod or despite Tyrod. He was a middle of the road QB. I think it will be difficult to improve this year based on what's out there. I do not think that he is the long-term answer. You can win with him though just like Dalton, Tannehill, and Smith.

[Gugny]

Coming from the guy who said EJ is great.

 

No one will forget that dude.

 

No ... you're misremembering. My stance was always that EJ was better than Tyrod. I admitted I was wrong at the end of this past season.

 

Never, ever, did I say that EJ was great.

 

And being better than EJ Manuel does not mean that Tyrod was good. It just means he was less bad.

[Buff808]

First it was EJ, now it's Cardelle. Jones maybe a good backup now, but he is still learning. This Whaley, he has to have his guy in there not Rex's guy, that's been the way since day one. Mc Dermott you better wake up, he will be the same way with you. Why mr Pegula doesn't see this is beyond me. Good luck Buffalo you are going to need it.

[Meathead]

its obvious the bills wanted to start ej for that last game to see how far he had come as a veteran backup who was forced to start a bunch of games out of the draft and struggled. its entirely possible he could have been ready to show he could be a reasonably effective middling starter, in which case they would have had another option to consider heading into next season

 

unfortunately we saw the same ej we always have - good for a stretch here and there, and then uncorking a bouncing wtf was that throw to a wide open touchdown positioned receiver

 

it wasnt the answer they wanted to see, but they got their answer. next

[Marty McFly]

If they choose to start Cardale than that means were gonna build the defense and a WR through the draft and tank next year for a QB high in round one of 2018.

 

 

He's a decent QB. I'd say slight above average. He's not a conventional QB which is what people seem to be up in arms about and it's !@#$ing idiotic in my opinion. If your team scores TDs then who the !@#$ cares how you do it? "Yea, but we rank close to the bottom in passing!!" Seriously? Who !@#$ing cares?

His ability to open up holes for the run game, improvise, and make something out of nothing is what separates him from guys like McCown or a Hoyer.... and he throws a great deep ball.

Like I said, im all for drafting a QB in round 1.... the chances of that guy being better then Tyrod over the next two years is slim to none, IMO. Keep Tyrod, draft a guy until he is BETTER then Tyrod.

It would be beneficial for EVERYONE in the organization to keep Tyrod, fix the defense then to kick Tyrod to the curb and bring in a rookie or scrub veteran while fixing the defense as well.

Seems obvious.

 

First it was EJ, now it's Cardelle. Jones maybe a good backup now, but he is still learning. This Whaley, he has to have his guy in there not Rex's guy, that's been the way since day one. Mc Dermott you better wake up, he will be the same way with you. Why mr Pegula doesn't see this is beyond me. Good luck Buffalo you are going to need it.

Im starting to think this comment might be true.

[Meathead]

if they had another game to play im pretty sure they would have started cardale. but they had to see where ej was first bc he wasnt going to be under contract after that

[Buff808]

I just can't wait to hear what happens at the draft. Coach Mc Dermott, we need good offensive linemen, Dougie, no Sean's we will trade everything we have for a QB, I know best! Coach Mc Dermott what the heck did I get into?

[Meathead]

i do agree that tyrod taylor is probably an above average nfl starter with all things considered. if you factor in the enormous threat of his running and the ability to not turn the ball over, he can definitely make an offense reasonably producitve enough to make the playoffs with a good defense

 

however, his style of play simply will not last. the grand total of qbs that have been able to be reliably productive by leveraging their running skills as an emphasis is exactly zero. every single one of them has been forced to become primarily a pocket passer bc they inevitably get injured and cant run as well. most of them fail when they get to that point, just make a list and it gets long really fast. their teams generally have no better option but to have them keep playing from the pocket, so their either sink or swim, and its usually sink

 

so if we could wave a magic wand and say tyrod will always be available for at least fourteen games a season and will always be able to rush effectively, then yeah he would be a pretty decent option. but you might as well have the tooth fairy play quarterback if you think thats going to happen

 

tyrod cant make the critical throws that a franchise qb has to make to win games on a consistent basis. thats why the team is balking. they would need him to transform himself like russell wilson, but im afraid tyrods ceiling in that regard is probably more like mike vick - just simply not good enough as a passer

[Gugny]

i do agree that tyrod taylor is probably an above average nfl starter with all things considered. if you factor in the enormous threat of his running and the ability to not turn the ball over, he can definitely make an offense reasonably producitve enough to make the playoffs with a good defense

 

however, his style of play simply will not last. the grand total of qbs that have been able to be reliably productive by leveraging their running skills as an emphasis is exactly zero. every single one of them has been forced to become primarily a pocket passer bc they inevitably get injured and cant run as well. most of them fail when they get to that point, just make a list and it gets long really fast. their teams generally have no better option but to have them keep playing from the pocket, so their either sink or swim, and its usually sink

 

so if we could wave a magic wand and say tyrod will always be available for at least fourteen games a season and will always be able to rush effectively, then yeah he would be a pretty decent option. but you might as well have the tooth fairy play quarterback if you think thats going to happen

 

tyrod cant make the critical throws that a franchise qb has to make to win games on a consistent basis. thats why the team is balking. they would need him to transform himself like russell wilson, but im afraid tyrods ceiling in that regard is probably more like mike vick - just simply not good enough as a passer

 

When a QB only does one thing well ... and that one thing is running ... how can said QB be above average?

 

As far as not turning the ball over, he doesn't throw any high-risk passes. He only throws to wide open receivers or along the sidelines. Of course he's going to throw less INTs. But he's also going to complete less "meaningful completions," i.e. - when the Bills need to get into the endzone to win a game.

 

Your last paragraph, IMO, is spot on. Since it's spot on, though, he can't be above average at anything other than being a running QB. And running QBs who cannot ALSO pass the ball effectively ... well they never lead their teams to anywhere other than 16 game seasons.

[DrDawkinstein]

 

When a QB only does one thing well ... and that one thing is running ... how can said QB be above average?

 

As far as not turning the ball over, he doesn't throw any high-risk passes. He only throws to wide open receivers or along the sidelines. Of course he's going to throw less INTs. But he's also going to complete less "meaningful completions," i.e. - when the Bills need to get into the endzone to win a game.

 

Your last paragraph, IMO, is spot on. Since it's spot on, though, he can't be above average at anything other than being a running QB. And running QBs who cannot ALSO pass the ball effectively ... well they never lead their teams to anywhere other than 16 game seasons.

 

 

Because nowadays the general QB play across the NFL is pretty stinky. You have a small handful of elite QBs, and then a bunch of just guys. Calling him "above average" doesnt refer to his place in NFL history, but rather comparing him to the current state of QB play in the entire league. With that, yes, it could be argued that TT is on the better side of average.