PromoTheRobot Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 (edited) You can call into question some of his contracts. But if you want to give him a pass for it fine They aren't his contracts. Edited December 24, 2016 by PromoTheRobot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 They aren't his contracts. What exactly do you define his job as - try to really build it out though, as he's a long term high level executive so he surely has some level of legit responsibility Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike in Horseheads Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 On contract he did that i have No issues with is McCoys. Dareus on the other hand Of course you don't, it's easy to pick and choose in hindsight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zulu Cthulhu Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 What exactly do you define his job as - try to really build it out though, as he's a long term high level executive so he surely has some level of legit responsibility I can't say for certain, I don't have any inside information, but this is (broadly) what I do. Based on that Saint I would say JO has some influence and responsibility. For instance, with the sheer number of contract negotiations he's done over the years, he probably has opinions on contractual things that ownership would listen to. But I wouldn't conflate that influence to include making the actual hiring/firing of players, and the makeup of the team or the overall team philosophy on the field. Look if the Pegulas turned around January 2 and fired everyone, including JO and Russ and on down, I wouldn't complain. But these threads just seem like some sick exercise of scapegoating, with everyone trying to assign percentages of blame to a rotating roster of guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 (edited) I can't say for certain, I don't have any inside information, but this is (broadly) what I do. Based on that Saint I would say JO has some influence and responsibility. For instance, with the sheer number of contract negotiations he's done over the years, he probably has opinions on contractual things that ownership would listen to. But I wouldn't conflate that influence to include making the actual hiring/firing of players, and the makeup of the team or the overall team philosophy on the field. Look if the Pegulas turned around January 2 and fired everyone, including JO and Russ and on down, I wouldn't complain. But these threads just seem like some sick exercise of scapegoating, with everyone trying to assign percentages of blame to a rotating roster of guys. I can handle that take- some act like he's just a lackey doing everyone else's work. At the very least I think he's relatively high in the pecking order and has held influence for a good bit of this run. I have ZERO clue his opinion on individual choices so I'm not advocating that he's good or bad as much as trying to acknowledge that he's highly present and has a real role. We generally have no idea what sway he and Russ and formerly littman and some of these long time high level officers of the team hold. To peg it all on them seems as silly as to likewise absolve them completely. Whether it's an individual or the process or the group--- something hasn't worked in upper management across decades now Edited December 24, 2016 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zulu Cthulhu Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 I can handle that take- some act like he's just a lackey doing everyone else's work. At the very least I think he's relatively high in the pecking order and has held influence for a good bit of this run. I have ZERO clue his opinion on individual choices so I'm not advocating that he's good or bad as much as trying to acknowledge that he's highly present and has a real role. We generally have no idea what sway he and Russ and formerly littman and some of these long time high level officers of the team hold. To peg it all on them seems as silly as to likewise absolve them completely. Whether it's an individual or the process or the group--- something hasn't worked in upper management across decades now Exactly. Way I look at it is there's not a lot of insight to be gained conjuring up executive level conspiracy theories about in-house backstabbing, overstepping, power struggles, or whatever else - doubt anyone here has the access or info to back those theories up. Real simple, if you want to blame someone, blame ownership. Wilson and the Pegulas are responsible for this laughingstock playoff drought. All these executives and other assorted lackeys serve at the pleasure of the owners. If they've been, in your opinion, in power for too long, ain't their fault is it? I know it sucks, since the owners are the only ones that can't get fired, but that's where the blame lies. Anything else is just passing the buck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 (edited) I can handle that take- some act like he's just a lackey doing everyone else's work. At the very least I think he's relatively high in the pecking order and has held influence for a good bit of this run. I have ZERO clue his opinion on individual choices so I'm not advocating that he's good or bad as much as trying to acknowledge that he's highly present and has a real role. We generally have no idea what sway he and Russ and formerly littman and some of these long time high level officers of the team hold. To peg it all on them seems as silly as to likewise absolve them completely. Whether it's an individual or the process or the group--- something hasn't worked in upper management across decades now Does the expression witch hunt ring a bell? Edited December 24, 2016 by PromoTheRobot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 Blaming the owners at this point is silly. They did not expect to have to replace the coach so quickly. Real life experience, doing almost anything important, will tell you it takes time to build something that will pass the test of time. I think they'll get it right in the long run. Come back in 3-5 years and I may be more open to discussion. I'm thankful to our owners, more than words can express. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 They aren't his contracts. Sure yet his responsibility "Oversee ALL player contracts". Sure they are not Of course you don't, it's easy to pick and choose in hindsight. Never had an issue with Shadys contract to begin with actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gr8billsfan Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 Why does Pegula get a pass? He should be fired too, while we're at it. Why does Buffalo love to be fooled by clowns? Nix, Whaley, Rex, this guy, etc. WAKE UP and send them a message that you want real change or else they can kiss their asses goodbye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 Overdorf doesn't decide who to sign or for how much. The front office targets players and negotiates. Overdorf crunches the numbers so they fit under the cap. Hey, don't let reality get in the way of a good whine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QB Bills Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 The Bills are at best a middling team that doesn't pay big money to its QB. Yet they're still up against the cap. Blame whom you must, but that's just pathetic. Fire them all and start fresh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 Hey, don't let reality get in the way of a good whine. Show me one bit if reality. I have posted report after report showinf he does more than crunch numbers. On the flip side get nothing but conjecture that he doesnt do anything but crunch numbers and who is in reality here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 Show me one bit if reality. I have posted report after report showinf he does more than crunch numbers. On the flip side get nothing but conjecture that he doesnt do anything but crunch numbers and who is in reality here? None of your reports say what you think they say...he negotiates contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 (edited) None of your reports say what you think they say...he negotiates contracts. Ever negotiate a contract? I have. He negotiates the clauses or lack there of. Whaley gives him a not to exceed value for the player he negotiates everything to do with that contract under the not to exceed. So he gets the out clause in Taylors contract (Good) He also doesnt have a recoup clause negotiated in Dareus Contract (Bad) See how that works. Lets not forget two of the most player friendly contracts in NFL history Mario and Dareus are his as well. Edited December 24, 2016 by MAJBobby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zulu Cthulhu Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 (edited) Ever negotiate a contract? I have. He negotiates the clauses or lack there of. Whaley gives him a not to exceed value for the player he negotiates everything to do with that contract under the not to exceed. So he gets the out clause in Taylors contract (Good) He also doesnt have a recoup clause negotiated in Dareus Contract (Bad) See how that works. Lets not forget two of the most player friendly contracts in NFL history Mario and Dareus are his as well. I've done many as well - and you're right, in hindsight, both of those deals could have been done (slightly) better. But mario was going to get paid by someone, with comparable guaranteed money. And, he actually produced most of the time he was here. So not sure what the problem is there. Could JO and the rest of them insist on stricter character clauses in Dareus's deal? Sure. I get what you're saying there too. But he's played up to his potential (and contract) as well, when he's on the field. Edited December 24, 2016 by Zulu Cthulhu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest K-GunJimKelly12 Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 (edited) So basically the response to my thread from many people is your an idiot and don't know anything, but those same people have no legit response when evidence is presented that shows Overdorf to be much more than a numbers guy. Ninety percent of this board has no !@#$ing clue what they are talking about. Merry Christmas. http://buffalonews.com/2014/02/23/sources-disconnect-youngsters-lifers-bills-organization/ Overdorf oversees all player contracts. Overdorf, not Whaley, will handle contract negotiations for Pro Bowl safety Jairus Byrd. Same as last year. Overdorf reports not to Whaley, but to CEO Russ Brandon. But team sources tell me executives such as Littmann, Overdorf and Berchtold still hold too much sway and haven't afforded Whaley or Marrone as much control as either feels he needs to correct a losing culture. Edited December 24, 2016 by K-GunJimKelly12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PO16FFS Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 Sometimes I wonder if it had been better if the team moved to another city. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 Does the expression witch hunt ring a bell? Right but totally absolving everyone seems just as irrational, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted December 24, 2016 Share Posted December 24, 2016 I can handle that take- some act like he's just a lackey doing everyone else's work. At the very least I think he's relatively high in the pecking order and has held influence for a good bit of this run. I have ZERO clue his opinion on individual choices so I'm not advocating that he's good or bad as much as trying to acknowledge that he's highly present and has a real role. We generally have no idea what sway he and Russ and formerly littman and some of these long time high level officers of the team hold. To peg it all on them seems as silly as to likewise absolve them completely. Whether it's an individual or the process or the group--- something hasn't worked in upper management across decades now I agree...Do you remember the draft room after the talk of the Cowboys wanting to trade up with us...the video showed Overdorf taking the call and talking with Stephen Jones Sometimes I wonder if it had been better if the team moved to another city. I don't...just stop following them if you feel that way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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