Rob's House Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Correct, but they won't. Not because TP is afraid to make a move, but because it'll make Buffalo a toxic destination for the kind of coach we would want to lure here, and we'd end up with another Marrone. Mind you, I'd take last year's coaching staff over this one. Last year we wont most of the games we were supposed to, except for maybe the Oakland game. I also just realized looking at last year's record, we had a .500 or above record all season. Rex is quantifiably worse than Marrone. Last year we had a serviceable NFL QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountDorkula Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Denver's 6-0. What the hell are you talking about? I'm making wild acusations, like everyone else. Its the theme of the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorquemada Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Denver's 6-0. What the hell are you talking about? I think maybe the point is, Denver would be winning with or without Peyton. Be that as it may, they are winning, an emotion that is a distant memory for our Bills. Losing is ingrained in the culture here, and this team will always regress towards the mean of 7-9. We got our 9-7 (super bowl!) last year so prepare for a long stretch of 7-9 or below while we 'rebuild' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drinkTHEkoolaid Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Have we fired everyone yet? F5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 regress towards the mean This sounds oddly familiar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorquemada Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Funny thing is, I'm reading the weekly 'winners and losers from week X' columns and they don't even include the Bills any more. It's assumed we're going to lose, and it's not noteworthy any longer. That's something, and earlier in the season than we've seen the last couple years. The Bills are a sloppy, marginally talented team (lets admit this and stop trying to twist reality to make it out that this roster is full of talent) led by a retarded frat boy who looks lost on the sideline, like the game is happening to him rather than being an active participant. I have some faith that the Pegulas can turn this around, but it probably wasn't realistic to expect great things in year one. He had to flatline the Sabres before he figured it out. Historical performance is the best indicator for future performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southern Bills Fan Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 We have some really good talent on both sides of the ball. We are not so talented that we can constantly give away plays with stupid penalties on both sides of the ball. That's on the HC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tu-Toned Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 London Letdown Beat me to it! Funny thing is, I'm reading the weekly 'winners and losers from week X' columns and they don't even include the Bills any more. It's assumed we're going to lose, and it's not noteworthy any longer. That's something, and earlier in the season than we've seen the last couple years. The Bills are a sloppy, marginally talented team (lets admit this and stop trying to twist reality to make it out that this roster is full of talent) led by a retarded frat boy who looks lost on the sideline, like the game is happening to him rather than being an active participant. I have some faith that the Pegulas can turn this around, but it probably wasn't realistic to expect great things in year one. He had to flatline the Sabres before he figured it out. Historical performance is the best indicator for future performance. I have to agree with most of this especially the part about Rex looking like the game is happening to him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Last year we had a serviceable NFL QB. That serviceable NFL Quarterback only played 12 of the 16 games. More than likely Tyrod will prove serviceable and play at least 12. Marrone's team was better coached than Rex's team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorquemada Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 (edited) This sounds oddly familiar. Indeed. In my professional life, in managing teams, I've learned some things. One of them is, 'average' is a meaningful concept. Unless there are extraordinary individuals on a team (from bottom to top), it's going to be average. All of this new age nonsense that management consultants spew out about everyone being a special contributor is false on it's face, at least in the way they mean. The other thing is that teams are ultimately a reflection of management and leadership. Competent management can mitigate a certain amount of shortcoming on a team. Great management and leadership can lift the team and make a bunch of C players play like B players, or even better, because great leadership can unlock potential in others, or inspire extra effort. That brings us to the Bills. They're a team of mostly C players with a few Bs thrown in. Our DL is Cs right now, and I'll not hear otherwise. Our coaching and general management is built to keep this a solid C team. Because of the vagaries of football stats, 5-11 of 6-10 is more likely than 7-9. I think it's pretty safe to rule out 9-7 or better, so the numbers would tell us that 6-10 is probably where the Bills end up. I might play with the numbers a little more and find something more recent. There's a good article on http://archive.advancedfootballanalytics.com/2007/08/luck-and-nfl-outcomes.html that I pulled that graph from. The net here is, the Bills at this point because of injuries/bad coaching/mediocre talent aren't going to break through that trough and into a positive record (remember last year, it took the Pats taking the day off for the Bills to get to 9-7) and don't have a path with the current team/coach. Edited October 26, 2015 by dorquemada Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Last year we had a serviceable NFL QB. I think i know who you are referring too. Although everyone can questions his heart. he was Serviceable. 9-7 would not have happened without him. the back up situation in all likelyhood will not change this season. But I would bet the house it is not the same next season. Too much is riding on a 16 game season too lose to one of the worst teams in the league in that fashion. Screw this "But he brought the team back" narrative. he is not an NFL QB. I would think his coaches agree, and Marrone For all his faults knew it too. At this point IMO both the GM and HC are in ass kissing mode with the owner In all Likelyhood. to keep their own jobs. Whaley more so than Rex. Still hard to believe the Bills lost to that team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Indeed. In my professional life, in managing teams, I've learned some things. One of them is, 'average' is a meaningful concept. Unless there are extraordinary individuals on a team (from bottom to top), it's going to be average. All of this new age nonsense that management consultants spew out about everyone being a special contributor is false on it's face, at least in the way they mean. The other thing is that teams are ultimately a reflection of management and leadership. Competent management can mitigate a certain amount of shortcoming on a team. Great management and leadership can lift the team and make a bunch of C players play like B players, or even better, because great leadership can unlock potential in others, or inspire extra effort. That brings us to the Bills. They're a team of mostly C players with a few Bs thrown in. Our DL is Cs right now, and I'll not hear otherwise. Our coaching and general management is built not to keep this a solid C team. Because of the vagaries of football stats, 5-11 of 6-10 is more likely than 7-9. I think it's pretty safe to rule out 9-7 or better, so the numbers would tell us that 6-10 is probably where the Bills end up. I might play with the numbers a little more and find something more recent. There's a good article on http://archive.advancedfootballanalytics.com/2007/08/luck-and-nfl-outcomes.html that I pulled that graph from. The net here is, the Bills at this point because of injuries/bad coaching/mediocre talent aren't going to break through that trough and into a positive record (remember last year, it took the Pats taking the day off for the Bills to get to 9-7) and don't have a path with the current team/coach. I read all that, and I saw only "3.5" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Yesterday's game really happened. The Bills have three choices, 1) they can go forward without changes and assume they are on the right course. 2) The teams leaders can try to forge a new direction for the team (new personnel, coaching or schemes) or 3) the team could start in the direction of getting new leadership. For all the ranting for the Bills about lack of continuity, OBD has had a remarkable run of continuity in the executive suite and at the GM/Assistant GM position. New leadership at the OBD/GM level should be on the table. I for one am sick of the lack of continuity that we have had with regards to GM and HC over the last 15 years. We've let some wear out their welcome, and others have flat out quit. Firing a coach who has been mildly successful in this league because our BACKUP QB decided to have an absolute meltdown in the 2nd quarter, doesn't make sense to me. Firing the GM of the most talented roster we have had in a decade because our backups aren't good, doesn't make sense. But hey, if you want to bring in another marrone, gailey, jauron, donahoe, brandon (can you believe that this guy was our GM for a time?)... more power to you. Those are the types who would be willing to take TPs money and dive on this grenade. I agree that what is going on right now is bad, and I'm not in denial. But I guess I just believe in giving the guys a chance to do something with our roster over a couple of years, or right the ship this year. Not a what, 5 game stretch of the season when we are decimated with injuries. As for the actual "execs", I really hate Russ Brandon. Hopefully his football decision making has been fully removed, because he doesn't know a thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 That serviceable NFL Quarterback only played 12 of the 16 games. More than likely Tyrod will prove serviceable and play at least 12. Marrone's team was better coached than Rex's team. Perhaps, but Orton came in week 5 with a 2-2 record, and you can't read too much in to the first 2-3 weeks of the season. In both seasons we were 3-2. From that point on last year we had Orton starting. From that point this year we've had EJ. If Orton goes out after week 5 and EJ comes in it's hard to say how that plays out. It'll be interesting to see how we fare when TT comes back. And let's be honest, he's had some great moments, but we still don't really know what we have in Taylor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth on hold Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Buffalo Bills fallling down, falling down......Nice one. How about "Screaming Live at Yahoos" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 The game was brutal to watch. So have a couple others. Having said that, right now is a terrible time to start making massive changes. Not to get to cliché, but plans don't always work out immediately as planned....and once the bullets start flying, all plans go out the window. 1. I'm for giving this Tyrod Taylor thing more time to see where it goes. It's not like there is a lot of choice right now anyway. 2. Rex/Roman needs to be given more of a chance to get this squad healthy and make a run. That isn't a playoff guarantee.It's not like there is a lot of choice right now anyway. 3. Separating what is reality and what is random is very difficult right now. That is the job of Whaley and the FO to figure out. Not the fans. If it takes bringing in some outside perspective to help. So be it. It's not like there is a lot of choice right now. JMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Frankish Reich Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 No just no. Can we blame the Denver GM because everyone thought he got good value for Peyton Manning but inreality he just got an old Peyton Manning? I mean it hasnt worked out for them and all. Demarcus Ware, old and injured. Aqib Talib, old and injured. He must suck too. Manning "hasn't worked out for them"??? I know people are never satisfied without multiple Super Bowl wins, but that's like saying Jim Kelly "didn't work out" for us. Manning was a calculated risk for Elway, and it paid off big time. But the earlier point is correct: durability is best thought of as a skill. And I think it's fair to say that injury risk was high for certain guys: - Tyrod: because a running QB is always an injury risk unless he's Russell Wilson - McCoy: because an aging RB is always an injury risk unless he's Frank Gore (by the way, the guy I would have targeted) - Goodwin: because a track star playing football is always a high injury risk I will give him a pass on Watkins -- there really wasn't anything in his past or profile that would make you think he'd be a consistent presence on the injury reports. Sometimes it's just bad luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorquemada Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 The game was brutal to watch. So have a couple others. Having said that, right now is a terrible time to start making massive changes. Not to get to cliché, but plans don't always work out immediately as planned....and once the bullets start flying, all plans go out the window. 1. I'm for giving this Tyrod Taylor thing more time to see where it goes. It's not like there is a lot of choice right now anyway. 2. Rex/Roman needs to be given more of a chance to get this squad healthy and make a run. That isn't a playoff guarantee.It's not like there is a lot of choice right now anyway. 3. Separating what is reality and what is random is very difficult right now. That is the job of Whaley and the FO to figure out. Not the fans. If it takes bringing in some outside perspective to help. So be it. It's not like there is a lot of choice right now. JMO This is a calm, rational, and correct response to this 'crisis' but not nearly as satisfying as gathering the townfolk with pitchforks and torches and screaming BURN THE WITCHES so BURN THE WITCHES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D. L. Hot-Flamethrower Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 This is a calm, rational, and correct response to this 'crisis' but not nearly as satisfying as gathering the townfolk with pitchforks and torches and screaming BURN THE WITCHES so BURN THE WITCHES LOL. Gotta admit a good nights sleep always helps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlayoffsPlease Posted October 26, 2015 Author Share Posted October 26, 2015 No just no. Can we blame the Denver GM because everyone thought he got good value for Peyton Manning but inreality he just got an old Peyton Manning? I mean it hasnt worked out for them and all. Demarcus Ware, old and injured. Aqib Talib, old and injured. He must suck too. Didn't they advance in the Playoffs with Peyton? Aren't they undefeated now? Fairly asinine example to compare to a team that is 3 1/2 games out of first after 6 games, and who has never made the playoffs since the current GM joined the team in 2010. Funny thing is, I'm reading the weekly 'winners and losers from week X' columns and they don't even include the Bills any more. It's assumed we're going to lose, and it's not noteworthy any longer. That's something, and earlier in the season than we've seen the last couple years. The Bills are a sloppy, marginally talented team (lets admit this and stop trying to twist reality to make it out that this roster is full of talent) led by a retarded frat boy who looks lost on the sideline, like the game is happening to him rather than being an active participant. I have some faith that the Pegulas can turn this around, but it probably wasn't realistic to expect great things in year one. He had to flatline the Sabres before he figured it out. Historical performance is the best indicator for future performance. If you ignore things like discipline, durability, guys like Aaron Williams and Marquis Goodwin are athletic studs. In terms of being the complete football package, the Bills rank in the lower half of the league on "o-line" "linebackers" "recievers" and "QBs". The roster is fairly average overall. Too many posters seem to think the benchmark of "talented" is being better than the 2009 Bills roster. Personally I think the benchmark is being better than the three teams in your division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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