Kirby Jackson Posted December 24, 2015 Share Posted December 24, 2015 facts don't matter. no matter what every loss is on the backup. I am aware of that. But that wasn't my point. WINS AND LOSSES. Does it matter what the stats are if the team wins more than loses? Since you insist - How many passes were thrown by the rookie and now 4 year Vet? Why are you not discussing that horrible NE game by Tyrod? Because he rallied 19 points in the 4th? Guess what look who else rallied the team late in the JAX game. You are more than willing to criticize the backup but not the starter. Why is that when the backup isn't challenging the starter? Actually don't answer. Merry Christmas. My wish is that people end the silliness. Rallied them against Jax?!? You mean the same game that he and he alone spotted them 21 points?!? Also, wins and losses is all that you care about. In those same 12 games Tyrod is 6-6 (with a bad defense) and EJ is 4-8 (and played with a better defense in 2013-2014). What makes them the same to you? What is it that you are seeing that the coaches, scouts, analysts and gm's around the league aren't? I'm curious what you are seeing that Bill Polian is missing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOVABillsFan Posted December 24, 2015 Share Posted December 24, 2015 (edited) Rallied them against Jax?!? You mean the same game that he and he alone spotted them 21 points?!? Also, wins and losses is all that you care about. In those same 12 games Tyrod is 6-6 (with a bad defense) and EJ is 4-8 (and played with a better defense in 2013-2014). What makes them the same to you? What is it that you are seeing that the coaches, scouts, analysts and gm's around the league aren't? I'm curious what you are seeing that Bill Polian is missing? look If you want to discuss things fine. If you want to argue for the sake of argument then I ask you most kindly Stop. For the record YES, EJ had a horrible 2 INT's and 1 fumble against the Jags. I don't argue that. FACT the Bills led by EJ overcame those early mistakes to take a 31 to 27 lead scoring 18 points in the 4th QTR and then the defense failed to stop the JAGS from retaking the lead. Also Shady fumbled the ball 4 yards short of a TD taking 3 to 7 points off of the board. http://espn.go.com/nfl/game?gameId=400761515 Tyrod had 2 INTs that allowed the Pats to take a 37 to 13 lead before scoring 19 points in the 4th QTR that fell way short with an INT 40-32 with 1:15 left on the clock. http://espn.go.com/nfl/playbyplay?gameId=400791664 Edited December 24, 2015 by NOVABillsFan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted December 24, 2015 Share Posted December 24, 2015 look If you want to discuss things fine. If you want to argue for the sake of argument then I ask you most kindly Stop. For the record YES, EJ had a horrible 2 INT's and 1 fumble against the Jags. I don't argue that. FACT the Bills led by EJ overcame those early mistakes to take a 31 to 27 lead scoring 18 points in the 4th QTR and then the defense failed to stop the JAGS from retaking the lead. Also Shady fumbled the ball 4 yards short of a TD taking 3 to 7 points off of the board. http://espn.go.com/nfl/game?gameId=400761515 Tyrod had 2 INTs that allowed the Pats to take a 37 to 13 lead before scoring 19 points in the 4th QTR that fell way short with an INT 40-32 with 1:15 left on the clock. http://espn.go.com/nfl/playbyplay?gameId=400791664 EJ did not score 18 points in the 4th Q. We got a pick six to take the lead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOVABillsFan Posted December 24, 2015 Share Posted December 24, 2015 I've read the arguments on EJ with playing time. We've had 16 regular season games with EJ and 10 pre-seasonwe know what we need on EJ. He's toast at the end of the year. I don't hate the guy, just don't want him in a Bills uniform ever again. The argument on playing time is the exact reason to have TT out there. He's played in 12 regular season games. We've read from multiple people including me the parallels to other QB's in their first year and their stats. Manning, Rodgers and so on. TT has many strengths, and the thing i keep seeing is him holding the ball too long. He continues to make improvements on his progressions and the only way to improve is to play in game time speed. If he finishes with two wins, then he can go into the off season with some momentum, while we most likely get him a capable veteran back up, and we draft someone for the future. wasn't it 10 games in 2013 (4-6 record) and 4 in 2014 (2-2 record) totaling 14 games? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted December 24, 2015 Share Posted December 24, 2015 wasn't it 10 games in 2013 (4-6 record) and 4 in 2014 (2-2 record) totaling 14 games? I'm not hoping for this, but it would be kindof funny if both EJ and Tyrod had a career win/loss of 6-8 at the end of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted December 24, 2015 Share Posted December 24, 2015 (edited) look If you want to discuss things fine. If you want to argue for the sake of argument then I ask you most kindly Stop. For the record YES, EJ had a horrible 2 INT's and 1 fumble against the Jags. I don't argue that. FACT the Bills led by EJ overcame those early mistakes to take a 31 to 27 lead scoring 18 points in the 4th QTR and then the defense failed to stop the JAGS from retaking the lead. Also Shady fumbled the ball 4 yards short of a TD taking 3 to 7 points off of the board. http://espn.go.com/nfl/game?gameId=400761515 Tyrod had 2 INTs that allowed the Pats to take a 37 to 13 lead before scoring 19 points in the 4th QTR that fell way short with an INT 40-32 with 1:15 left on the clock. http://espn.go.com/nfl/playbyplay?gameId=400791664 No one is arguing, just providing facts. You made a claim that they were virtually the same. I supplied a stat comparison that proved your claim false. Then you said that wins and losses are all that matter and I provided their records over their last 12 starts that proved that false. In addition Tyrod is 6-6 with the same team that EJ is 0-2 with. Edited December 25, 2015 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted December 24, 2015 Share Posted December 24, 2015 (edited) In addition Tyrod is 6-6 with the same team that EJ is 0-2 with. This is true. But consider that one of the losses was to the Bungles. Our D got demolished and run over for 34 points in that game. Meanwhile, Tyrod racks up wins against Fish (2), Titans, and Suck for Lucks. Does anyone really think if Tyrod starts we win that game? Really? The whole QB win/loss thing can kindof be misleading sometimes. Edited December 24, 2015 by reddogblitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted December 24, 2015 Share Posted December 24, 2015 This is true. But consider that one of the losses was to the Bungles. Our D got demolished and run over for 34 points in that game. Meanwhile, Tyrod racks up wins against Fish (2), Titans, and Suck for Lucks. Does anyone really think if Tyrod starts we win that game? Really? The whole QB win/loss thing can kindof be misleading sometimes. No, but they beat Jacksonville for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted December 25, 2015 Share Posted December 25, 2015 The first two cuts or trades for very late round picks, EJ and McKelvin. If either or both of them remain on this team, it's symptomatic of lack of progress. Actually it's symptomatic of there being no point to cutting your backup and eating his guaranteed salary until you see who falls to you in the draft and/or no one is interested in trading right now because they want to see who falls to them in the draft What is the point of creating these artificial scenarios "first two cuts or trades must be....or the sky is pink, the rain is green, and the Bills show lack of progress"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted December 25, 2015 Share Posted December 25, 2015 (edited) Actually it's symptomatic of there being no point to cutting your backup and eating his guaranteed salary until you see who falls to you in the draft and/or no one is interested in trading right now because they want to see who falls to them in the draft What is the point of creating these artificial scenarios "first two cuts or trades must be....or the sky is pink, the rain is green, and the Bills show lack of progress"? Exactly. Cutting him is an almost 100% certainty, but there's no hurry. You might get lucky and get something for him in trade or, since you're paying him anyway, why not use him as a hedge against a rash of QB injuries in training camp. And why completely tip your hand? Teams and agents know we are in the market, but it's in the team's best interest to not look completely desperate. Edited December 25, 2015 by BarleyNY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
klos63 Posted December 25, 2015 Share Posted December 25, 2015 Bill Polian believes the Bills should waste no time parting ways with current No. 2 QB EJ Manuel to finally bring closure to the mistake of making him a first-round draft pick in 2013. Did Polian say anything about improving the defense? because that was the reason we stunk the season. He's concerned about the backup QB position????? There are so many great ones to choose from, right Bill? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted December 25, 2015 Share Posted December 25, 2015 Did Polian say anything about improving the defense? because that was the reason we stunk the season. He's concerned about the backup QB position????? There are so many great ones to choose from, right Bill? Polian basically tore into the D. Said that Schwartz had a simple D that worked with the players strengths and was drilled week after week. Said Rex's terminology is overly complex, changes every week so there's no carryover, and required Jim Leonhard to creak out onto the field in NJ because he was the only guy smart enough to figure it out and get everyone lined up. So essentially he pointed the finger at Rex and his scheme but he stopped short of any suggestions for what to do to improve it. I thought Polian's comments overall on the Bills were kind of wierd - shallow and off the cuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted December 25, 2015 Share Posted December 25, 2015 Did Polian say anything about improving the defense? because that was the reason we stunk the season. He's concerned about the backup QB position????? There are so many great ones to choose from, right Bill? Many teams are having trouble finding starting QBs and everyone here is concerned about the backup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted December 25, 2015 Share Posted December 25, 2015 wasn't it 10 games in 2013 (4-6 record) and 4 in 2014 (2-2 record) totaling 14 games? Nova- did you forget the starts this year against the Bengals and Jags - 0-2? So, it is 16 games bud. He knew in advance he was playing, was able to watch tape and practice with first team reps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted December 25, 2015 Share Posted December 25, 2015 I have no problem keeping EJM through TC. Have no problem with drafting one after the 1st round. I have no problem trading him. I do have a problem just letting him walk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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