Buftex Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 Joe Flacco was spooked even worse by Watt. Our offensive line was getting destroyed by him. Watt had a few borderline dirty hits on EJ's knees as well. Brady would have flipped his lid if that happened to him. Yeah, I completely support EJ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 One more year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 One more year. That's completely fair. I think the last coaching staff was part of the problem. If this staff doesn't think EJ has it or he doesn't show anything, I will be leading the charge to get a new QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 Great point. all offensive players seem to regress under Marrone's staff. Every. Single. One. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 (edited) That's completely fair. I think the last coaching staff was part of the problem. If this staff doesn't think EJ has it or he doesn't show anything, I will be leading the charge to get a new QB. Agreed. I just hope that there is competition that actually pushes EJ to be better Edited February 23, 2015 by BuffaloHokie13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 (edited) I though EJ was quite poor last year. But, I think he deserves one more chance and I actually think he will figure it out. This is a common belief, but I don't know why - and there seems to be precious little evidence to support the claim that EJ "will figure it out". Playing QB in the NFL is the most difficult thing in sports. EJ has the physical tools to be sure, but the mental part is so difficult virtually no one can project in that respect. I hope he does, but right now it is just wishful thinking. There is no way the Bills should put themselves into a position where he's the only viable option. Again, I'm not running him out of town and he deserves a chance to prove himself here, but it should be in a situation where there is legitimate competition. His opportunity to prove himself should come ipby way of a QB competition, not by being handed the starting job and seeing how it goes. If he can beat out a QB like Sanchez or Locker, then he's earned it. If not, he knows where the bench is. It's up to the Bills FO to get a guy like that on this roster. Then we will see what we have in him. Edited February 23, 2015 by BarleyNY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 Whoa...not really sure what point you are trying to make...I wasn't laying blame on "EJ alone" for the Texans loss at all...just countering the argument that somebody was making that he was awful last season...by my count, the Texans game was his only really horrible game, and Watt had a bit to do with that. Yes, the line play was awful, receivers didn't have a great day... but in the end, there were plays that EJ could have made, but didn't...in my estimation, it was because he was a little shell-shocked by the Texans D/Watt. His accuracy (his biggest issue) was very off that game. I think we are making the same point... my apologies. I obviously misread the post then. I was distracted as I was on a call trying to see why my state efile didn't go through. I've had "discussions" with main 3 or 4 EJ detractors that typically point to that game as EJ's (continued) failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 That's 100% valid. With any QB, the more they get hit, the more their head goes down and they lose accuracy. Orton turtled and dove to the ground when facing pressure. Manuel escaped a few times but his accuracy was way off. Dude just needs to stop thinking so much and let it rip. He is capable of that Mike Williams play but he is all up in his head. He has a similar play to Chandler against SD. I lend some credence to the notion that he was a bit "over-coached". Personality wise, EJ seems like somebody who is very eager to please. Having three people telling you different things can make that task all that much harder...we want him to get to the point where he is "free to be me". The first 6 or so games of his career (til that injury against the Browns) I was pretty excited by what I saw from him... no moment ever seemed "too big" for him, he seemed pretty unflappable. I understand why Marrone benched him, and I couldn't really fault him for that...but in the end, the only way he is going to improve, or the only way we are really going to know what we have in EJ, is to see him play more. When he was drafted, everyone acknowledged he was a raw talent...but then nobody seemed to have the stomach to let him learn on the job. Manuel is a smart kid, and I think he has the desire to be great. I haven't heard anything to the contrary. He can use the benching as a positive. Here is hoping he will! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 One more year. then we shall see once and for all if the Marry band of EJ detractors is right or not. Also those of us that still feel EJ deserves a fair chance at proving himself will be able to have more data to classify EJ as a success or failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 Every. Single. One. Except Dixon, Hogan, Woods etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 That's completely fair. I think the last coaching staff was part of the problem. If this staff doesn't think EJ has it or he doesn't show anything, I will be leading the charge to get a new QB. I see what you did there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 This is a common belief, but I don't know why - and there seems to be precious little evidence to support the claim that EJ "will figure it out". Playing QB in the NFL is the most difficult thing in sports. EJ has the physical tools to be sure, but the mental part is so difficult virtually no one can project in that respect. I hope he does, but right now it is just wishful thinking. There is no way the Bills should put themselves into a position where he's the only viable option. Again, I'm not running him out of town and he deserves a chance to prove himself here, but it should be in a situation where there is legitimate competition. His opportunity to prove himself comes in a QB competition, not getting handed to starting job and seeing how he does. If he can beat out a QB like Sanchez or Locker, then he's earned it. If not, he knows where the bench is. It's up to the Bills FO to get a guy like that on this roster. Then we will see what we have in him. Let's hope EJ figures it out. You are of course correct in saying the Bills need to bring in viable competition. But looking at the FA QBs available, and college kids in the draft this year, it seems the most likely scenario is that we enter the 2015 season with EJ under center. So here's my list of wishful thinking: * Greg Roman will do for EJ what he did for Alex Smith * Richie Incognito and a better OL overall will make EJ's job easier. * A capable running game (Roman's running games are almost always in the top 10) will take some pressure off EJ * EJ had contradictory guidance and different 'voices in his head' in 2014. A unified coaching staff will help the young QB develop. * David Lee has an excellent reputation working with young QBs and he'll do a nice job mentoring EJ * EJ learned a lot when he sat on the bench last season. * The defense will be so good under Rex that the offense won't have to score a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 It's fun because it's true: EJ Manuel has played in 4 of Buffalo's 12 division games since he was drafted. 0-1 against the Pats*, 1-1 against the Jets, 1-0 against the Dolphins. His two losses came in the first three games of his career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BarleyNY Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 (edited) Let's hope EJ figures it out. You are of course correct in saying the Bills need to bring in viable competition. But looking at the FA QBs available, and college kids in the draft this year, it seems the most likely scenario is that we enter the 2015 season with EJ under center. So here's my list of wishful thinking: * Greg Roman will do for EJ what he did for Alex Smith * Richie Incognito and a better OL overall will make EJ's job easier. * A capable running game (Roman's running games are almost always in the top 10) will take some pressure off EJ * EJ had contradictory guidance and different 'voices in his head' in 2014. A unified coaching staff will help the young QB develop. * David Lee has an excellent reputation working with young QBs and he'll do a nice job mentoring EJ * EJ learned a lot when he sat on the bench last season. * The defense will be so good under Rex that the offense won't have to score a lot. That's all great in theory, but many of your points would help ANY QB and it also assumes a lot. EJ needs to address his mechanics/accuracy in a big way and he needs to clean up his pocket presence and reads. And I've seen flashes of almost everything needing fixed, however. That's what makes him so tempting. For instance, his pocket presence looked much improved at the start of last season, but he fell back into bad habits. It's almost like he's trying to fix a golf swing with him. He fixes one thing and something else goes to hell, then he fixes something else and the last thing he fixed goes bad. It's so difficult to put it all together that I just don't believe that he will. Rushing him out as a starter hurt him immensely. His mechanics needed a total overhaul before he saw an NFL field and he never got that. He never ingrained new habits so he falls back onto his old ones. His best opportunity might be to catch on somewhere as a back up for 2 or 3 years and take time to fix those mechanics (make the proper ones habit) and get more comfortable with the NFL game, then go somewhere to compete for a starting job in a less pressure packed situation. I don't see how that's possible for him in Buffalo. Alex Smith is the only player that ever managed to come close to that for the team that drafted him and he still lost his job to Kaepernick. I hope he proves me wrong, but I just don't see it happening for him here in Buffalo. He still deserves another shot at it though. Edited February 23, 2015 by BarleyNY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2003Contenders Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 (edited) The thing I always noticed about EJ was his unnatural feel for the game. He always seemed to be very robotic in terms of his mechanics and progressions. Usually that is a signal of being over-coached. Being reminded over and over again "Do this!" or "Don't do that!" It is almost like he had to go through a step-by-step sequence in his head on every play, rather than just (as Ted Marchibroda used to say) "Ler 'er rip!" I hope Roman/Lee/Palmer can work jointly to provide EJ with a cohesive plan for progression. I hope that they also work with the young man to identify what his strengths are and what he is most comfortable doing. He clearly has all the physical talent, is by all accounts very bright and is willing to put forth the effort. This will be a big year for him. As Bill Parcells used to say, every team should have a 4-year plan for a QB. Year 1 should be considered developmental for a rookie. Year 2 should show progress. Year 3 should be the year that the evaluation rings true: either the guy has it or he doesn't. So that in Year 4 he is THE man -- or the team elects to acquire a different QB in year 4 instead. This is the year for EJ where he needs to prove for once and for all whether he CAN be the man. Edited February 23, 2015 by 2003Contenders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 The thing I always noticed about EJ was his unnatural feel for the game. He always seemed to be very robotic in terms of his mechanics and progressions. Usually that is a signal of being over-coached. Being reminded over and over again "Do this!" or "Don't do that!" It is almost like he had to go through a step-by-step sequence in his head on every play, rather than just (as Ted Marchibroda used to say) "Ler 'er rip!" I hope Roman/Lee/Palmer can work jointly to provide EJ with a cohesive plan for progression. I hope that they also work with the young man to identify what his strengths are and what he is most comfortable doing. He clearly has all the physical talent, is by all accounts very bright and is willing to put forth the effort. This will be a big year for him. As Bill Parcells used to say, every team should have a 4-year plan for a QB. Year 1 should be considered developmental for a rookie. Year 2 should show progress. Year 3 should be the year that the evaluation rings true: either the guy has it or he doesn't. So that in Year 4 he is THE man -- or the team elects to acquire a different QB in year 4 instead. This is the year for EJ where he needs to prove for once and for all whether he CAN be the man. When you look at his rookie year, and during various 2 minute drill sort of situations, you can see he plays with a lot more feel for the game. I completely agree that he's thinking too much, during much of the game... hopefully that's a sign of bad coaching, and not a long term problem for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 How is E.J. any better then when he came out of college? I have seen several reviews/analysis of him and the same issues are there. He has show the ability to get out of bounds and get "down" not taking hits, but that's about it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 (edited) then we shall see once and for all if the Marry band of EJ detractors is right or not. Also those of us that still feel EJ deserves a fair chance at proving himself will be able to have more data to classify EJ as a success or failure. Except that if Manuel does not have a good season there will still be (people don't like the use of the word excuses here so) reasons for it such as his limited play in his first 2 seasons, the Marrone regime stunted his growth and so on. Not sure what the time limit for EJ Manuel is here, or even if there is one. Admitting a first round QB is a bust (and I'm not saying he is yet) is almost as hard for a fanbase as it is for the front office. Particularly when the player is as nice a guy as Manuel seems to be. Edited February 23, 2015 by CodeMonkey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted February 23, 2015 Author Share Posted February 23, 2015 Except that if Manuel does not have a good season there will still be (people don't like the use of the word excuses here so) reasons for it such as his limited play in his first 2 seasons, the Marrone regime stunted his growth and so on. Not sure what the time limit for EJ Manuel is here, or even if there is one. Admitting a first round QB is a bust (and I'm not saying he is yet) is almost as hard for a fanbase as it is for the front office. Particularly when the player is as nice a guy as Manuel seems to be.the timeline for him with the team will depend on how much of a project they thought he was to begin with. He was drafted as a project so I'm sure they had a time frame in mind. Whether that has changed with injuries and coach changes, unsure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What a Tuel Posted February 23, 2015 Share Posted February 23, 2015 (edited) Except that if Manuel does not have a good season there will still be (people don't like the use of the word excuses here so) reasons for it such as his limited play in his first 2 seasons, the Marrone regime stunted his growth and so on. Not sure what the time limit for EJ Manuel is here, or even if there is one. Admitting a first round QB is a bust (and I'm not saying he is yet) is almost as hard for a fanbase as it is for the front office. Particularly when the player is as nice a guy as Manuel seems to be. I think the determining factor would be whether or not there is a suitable replacement. Getting rid of someone just to get rid of them is stupid. Keep him on the team while pursuing other options and competition, like we are doing right now. Most EJ supporters are all for bringing in competition, but stop short of throwing 50% of our cap space or more at that competition (ie bradford, cutler). God forbid, if we are in the same spot in 2016, and EJ beats said competition out, then we are playing the best QB option we have got. I don't think we ever stop looking for another QB though, even this year. Is that what people think happens when we play EJ? Cutting EJ at any point doesn't mean a magical franchise QB pops out of the hopper. Edited February 23, 2015 by What a Tuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts