QB guru George Whitfield's take on EJ

[Buftex]

huge mistake not playing EJ against NEngland scrubs in 2nd half of our last game

 

he would have shown up and played well. confidence to build on in the offseason.

 

whaley should have insisted. we're trying to win a title by developing players, not win meaningless games to pad our stats.

Hind-sight is always 20-20. At least usually! A GM insisting that certain players play, over the coaches wishes, can lead to a lot of problems down the road. The day that game was played, very few knew that Orton was planning to retire in 24 hours, and certainly, nobody knew that Marrone was going to bolt. We bash Marrone a lot here (and with good reason mind you) but he did a credible job, if nothing else, of "changing the culture" with this team. At that point in time, Whaley was letting his coach manage the game-day roster, as was his job. It is the way it should be.

[BuffaloFan68]

The fact that every QB regressed as they played for the Bills supports the poor coaching on offense theory. I still say we would have won at least 9 games had we stuck it out with EJ. Glad Marrone is gone.

[BillsFan-4-Ever]

He was really poor, mostly, against the Texans. JJ Watt had him spooked...the only way he will learn to handle that, is by experience. I actually think a lot of his woes with inaccuracy are the product of not being sure of himself...throwing not to get intercepted, rather than to complete a pass. He needs to see more defenses.

I think Eric Woods kind of said the same thing about the O-line...I think he said on the offensive side of things, they had "too many voices in their heads". Hopefully, Rex can manage this kind of thing better, because he has a similar number of coaches...Lee, Palmer and Roman...sounds like Rex has the good sense to stay out of the offense.

PLEASE to just lay blame on EJ alone is ludicrous.

Do yourself a favor and LOOK up how many games in which JJ WATT "singlehandedly" took control of a game and brought the Texans a victory,

 

beyond the Bills game you can credit JJ up to 4 games!

 

If you stick to your story then last season vs the Texans EJ = A. Luck, = J Flacco

 

in the link you will also see ESPN links that credit the win vs the Jag's and Raiders.

 

http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/176252-ej-vs-derek-carr-perception/?p=3465157

please note the following post by C.Biscuit97

He also completely dominated the Ravens game, where Flacco had a worse game than EJ. Watt is an animal.

 

The only thing I have to say about this is "eff Marrone." I feel remarkably similar to how I felt about Wannstedt after that year he completely screwed up the defense.

:thumbsup:

Edited February 23, 2015 by BillsFan-4-Ever

[respk]

Since EJ is on the roster I'm sure he will get another chance. I don't expect much improvement from EJ. In 14 games he has shown the same problems that he showed coming out of college and with no improvement. It appears that he is what he is. While it's too soon to give up on EJ, I'm just hoping the Bills can get someone who has the chance to be much better than EJ. If EJs play doesn't improve and he is the starter, the Bills probably don't make the playoffs unless the defense and run game are absolutely dominating. I'd try to sign Locker as he and EJ can run a similar offense. Assuming that the relationship between Sanchez and Ryan is still good, I'd also try to sign Sanchez. Between EJ, Locker and Sanchez hopefully one separates himself and can become average at least. It is the key to the playoffs.

[dezertbill]

Whitfield sounds like he is lending his expertise on how he would get Manuel up to speed with the pro game.

 

He obviously believes that Manuel wasn't coached up properly by the old regime when he makes comments about what EJ needs to be able to do in the pocket to be successful (make atleast one defender miss). He also comes across as Manuel didn't use his atheticism enough (scramble around and use his legs as a weapon), which probably came upon the directive of Marrone and crew.

 

When Manuel was first drafted, he was marketed as an athletic QB who like Kaepernick or Wilson can use his legs to make plays and be a threat. During his rookie season, you saw a bit of that, but more times than not he handed the ball off on read option plays rather than keep it, which based on the open field he had in front of him was a bit frustrating.

 

Last year it seemed that Hackett and Marrone wanted him to be more of a pocket passer. HIs rushing attempts dropped from 5.3 per game in 2013 to 3.3 in 2014, and his yard per carry dipped from 3.5 to 3.2. It doesn't seem as if he was comfortable keepingthe ball or breaking out of the pocket and tucking it.

 

Kaepernick on the other hand avg 6.5 rushes per game in 2014 for 6.1 yards per rush. Wilson had 7.4 carries per game for 7.2 yard avg.

 

I think if EJ uses his legs more he'll increase his avg per rush. This will also open up things down the field.

 

Roman also came across sounding like EJ needs to be more athletic, stretch the pocket and use his legs more. Same as what Whitfield is saying.

 

Bottom line I think there is fair amount of criticism on how Manuel was brought up his first two years. It might have been the Cleveland game his rookie season when Marrone was trying to instill in Manuel to stay in the pocket more and try to make plays with his arm in order to stay healthy, which is kind of defeats the purpose of why we drafted Manuel in the first place.

 

It will be interesting to see how Manuel is tutored by Roman, Lee and Palmer. I think you'll see him take off more, and I welcome that change in his game. I think it will lead to good things for Manuel, and the Bills.

Edited February 23, 2015 by dezertbill

[Southern Bills Fan]

I have seen this "quarterback guru" on T.V. a few times and to me he seems like a fraud. He never says anything insightful, just the same cliche's that others use. It feels like he invented that title for himself and is making a living off it now. I think E.J. can be an average QB at best. He had some decent games but looking back even before J.J. Watt's pick six, you can see the receiver's were becoming very frustrated with his inaccuracy.

[YoloinOhio]

I have seen this "quarterback guru" on T.V. a few times and to me he seems like a fraud. He never says anything insightful, just the same cliche's that others use. It feels like he invented that title for himself and is making a living off it now. I think E.J. can be an average QB at best. He had some decent games but looking back even before J.J. Watt's pick six, you can see the receiver's were becoming very frustrated with his inaccuracy.

whitfield is well respected in both CFB and the NFL as a QB coach

[negativo]

Being "Presidential" is all well and good, but what EJ needs to show more than anything else, including accuracy, is balls. He's got to somehow demonstrate competitive fire and toughness on game day or he's doomed.

[YoloinOhio]

Being "Presidential" is all well and good, but what EJ needs to show more than anything else, including accuracy, is balls. He's got to somehow demonstrate competitive fire and toughness on game day or he's doomed.

i saw plenty of both. He played the 2nd half through an injured knee at Jax his rookie year and won. He has led at least 3 game winning drives. Why don't you think he has competitive fire or toughness on gameday? Edited February 23, 2015 by YoloinOhio

[CodeMonkey]

Thurman Thomas said the offensive coaching was a mess last year and EJ was being told different things by Marrone, Hackett, and Downing. Hopefully the coaching staff will be on the same page this year and beyond.

How would Thurman know? Plus by definition all problems were due to the outgoing regime!

[YoloinOhio]

How would Thurman know? Plus by definition all problems were due to the outgoing regime!

thurman attends practice a lot and is on the sideline at home games.

 

Not all problems are due to the last coaching staff but some may be like those indicated publically by multiple people like Fred Jackson, Hackett and Thurman.

Edited February 23, 2015 by YoloinOhio

[CodeMonkey]

thurman attends practice a lot and is on the sideline at home games.

 

Not all problems are due to the last coaching staff but some may be like those indicated publically by multiple people like Fred Jackson, Hackett and Thurman.

Still not sure how that translates to knowing what goes on in team meetings, film review sessions etc. which is where most of the coaching takes place.

But hopefully this season will show what Manuel is, good bad or in between. And the excuses can stop.

[YoloinOhio]

Still not sure how that translates to knowing what goes on in team meetings, film review sessions etc. which is where most of the coaching takes place.

But hopefully this season will show what Manuel is, good bad or in between. And the excuses can stop.

did he refer to meetings and film room specifically? I didn't hear the interview myself but assumed he meant what he was being told in actual practice. He also could have heard that directly from EJ's teammates who are in the meetings, since he spends time with many of them.

[C.Biscuit97]

He was really poor, mostly, against the Texans. JJ Watt had him spooked...the only way he will learn to handle that, is by experience. I actually think a lot of his woes with inaccuracy are the product of not being sure of himself...throwing not to get intercepted, rather than to complete a pass. He needs to see more defenses.

I think Eric Woods kind of said the same thing about the O-line...I think he said on the offensive side of things, they had "too many voices in their heads". Hopefully, Rex can manage this kind of thing better, because he has a similar number of coaches...Lee, Palmer and Roman...sounds like Rex has the good sense to stay out of the offense.

Joe Flacco was spooked even worse by Watt. Our offensive line was getting destroyed by him. Watt had a few borderline dirty hits on EJ's knees as well. Brady would have flipped his lid if that happened to him.

 

And Whitfield says something that most people supporting EJ (if you're a Bills fan why won't you support him) and most young Qbs that is so true:

“I know he’s had a little bit of turbulence getting off the ground,” Whitfield told host John Murphy. “Getting healthy and finding his rhythm. He will. He’s young.”

“In the microwave sports society we live in, ‘How is he not an All Pro already? Where is our Super Bowl trip?’ People just have to invest in him. Peyton Manning had thirty turnovers his first year. It’s a position of maturation. He’s maturing. People should rest easy knowing they have a guy who can go win games.”

 

How would Thurman know? Plus by definition all problems were due to the outgoing regime!

What offensive players improved under Marrone/ Hackett? Spiller got worse, so did Wood, Glenn, Pears, Stevie Johnson, etc.

Being "Presidential" is all well and good, but what EJ needs to show more than anything else, including accuracy, is balls. He's got to somehow demonstrate competitive fire and toughness on game day or he's doomed.

I agree with this 100%. EJ is too nice. If I was in EJ's shoes and Tim Graham tried to punk me, I'd let him know about it.

I have seen this "quarterback guru" on T.V. a few times and to me he seems like a fraud. He never says anything insightful, just the same cliche's that others use. It feels like he invented that title for himself and is making a living off it now. I think E.J. can be an average QB at best. He had some decent games but looking back even before J.J. Watt's pick six, you can see the receiver's were becoming very frustrated with his inaccuracy.

What does Belichick ever say to the media that is insightful? He has worked with numerous QBs and had a bunch of 1st round picks. He helped make them a lot of money. I'd love to have that kinda of fraud in my life.

[What a Tuel]

Still not sure how that translates to knowing what goes on in team meetings, film review sessions etc. which is where most of the coaching takes place.

But hopefully this season will show what Manuel is, good bad or in between. And the excuses can stop.

I'll never understand how we can all admit we have several problems on offense including tight end, o line, running game (as a result of oline), coaching, inexperience and yet these are all labeled as excuses as to why Manuel performed poorly. These aren't excuses they are legitimate reasons of why a player is not performing as expected. Whether or not Manuel will turn out to be good or not is debatable and no one knows the answer to that, but he certainly isn't being set up to succeed.

 

I also find it interesting how Thad Lewis was able to go in and win us a few games last year, but this year in preseason he couldn't complete a pass. I also feel like Orton wasn't performing up to his par either most of the time.

[C.Biscuit97]

I'll never understand how we can all admit we have several problems on offense including tight end, o line, running game (as a result of oline), coaching, inexperience and yet these are all labeled as excuses as to why Manuel performed poorly. These aren't excuses they are legitimate reasons of why a player is not performing as expected. Whether or not Manuel will turn out to be good or not is debatable and no one knows the answer to that, but he certainly isn't being set up to succeed.

 

I also find it interesting how Thad Lewis was able to go in and win us a few games last year, but this year in preseason he couldn't complete a pass. I also feel like Orton wasn't performing up to his par either most of the time.

Great point. all offensive players seem to regress under Marrone's staff.

[billsfan_34]

I though EJ was quite poor last year. But, I think he deserves one more chance and I actually think he will figure it out.

Young QB with a mess of a coaching staff coupled with minimal game experience equals less than average play. I am not ready to write him off yet. Shame on the staff for not playing him when we were mathematically eliminated from the playoffs. This kid has been nothing but professional and mature through it all. Edited February 23, 2015 by billsfan_34

[C.Biscuit97]

Young QB with a mess of a coaching staff coupled with minimal game experience equals less than average play. I am not ready to write him off yet. Shame on the staff for not playing him when we were mathematically eliminated from the playoffs. This kid has been nothing but professional and mature through it all.

See and that's what I love about EJ. If I was in his shoes, I would have been talking about how much the staff and Orton sucks. Obviously, he's a lot more mature than I am.

[Buftex]

PLEASE to just lay blame on EJ alone is ludicrous.

Do yourself a favor and LOOK up how many games in which JJ WATT "singlehandedly" took control of a game and brought the Texans a victory,

 

beyond the Bills game you can credit JJ up to 4 games!

 

If you stick to your story then last season vs the Texans EJ = A. Luck, = J Flacco

 

in the link you will also see ESPN links that credit the win vs the Jag's and Raiders.

 

 

Whoa...not really sure what point you are trying to make...I wasn't laying blame on "EJ alone" for the Texans loss at all...just countering the argument that somebody was making that he was awful last season...by my count, the Texans game was his only really horrible game, and Watt had a bit to do with that. Yes, the line play was awful, receivers didn't have a great day... but in the end, there were plays that EJ could have made, but didn't...in my estimation, it was because he was a little shell-shocked by the Texans D/Watt. His accuracy (his biggest issue) was very off that game. I think we are making the same point...

[C.Biscuit97]

Whoa...not really sure what point you are trying to make...I wasn't laying blame on "EJ alone" for the Texans loss at all...just countering the argument that somebody was making that he was awful last season...by my count, the Texans game was his only really horrible game, and Watt had a bit to do with that. Yes, the line play was awful, receivers didn't have a great day... but in the end, there were plays that EJ could have made, but didn't...in my estimation, it was because he was a little shell-shocked by the Texans D/Watt. His accuracy (his biggest issue) was very off that game. I think we are making the same point...

That's 100% valid. With any QB, the more they get hit, the more their head goes down and they lose accuracy. Orton turtled and dove to the ground when facing pressure. Manuel escaped a few times but his accuracy was way off.

 

Dude just needs to stop thinking so much and let it rip. He is capable of that Mike Williams play but he is all up in his head. He has a similar play to Chandler against SD.