truth on hold Posted January 9, 2015 Share Posted January 9, 2015 (edited) Yet this whole thread is full of people trying to prove that Watkins is better than ODB.Yeap exactly. The OP was a tortured, desperate and ... let's face it ... silly attempt to try and explain away ODBs superior season. Unreal, just deal with it folks, ODB is better. Edited January 9, 2015 by JTSP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsfan1972 Posted January 9, 2015 Author Share Posted January 9, 2015 (edited) Yeap exactly. The OP was a tortured, desperate and ... let's face it ... silly attempt to try and explain away ODBs superior season. Unreal, just deal with it folks, ODB is better. Still waiting as to what you think ODB would have produced on the Bills as per the thread title. One year in and ODB has much better #'s, however was not responsible for two last second wins as opposed to SW. However I'm more then happy cheering for someone (SW) as opposed to commenting on the footwork of some offensive tackle...... Let's make it simple JTSP.... How many games did ODB win for the Giants in the last minute? Edited January 9, 2015 by Billsfan1972 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leroi Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Zero. He is not on the Bills. It's a stupid scenerio to try and guess. You are wrong either way. Imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Yet this whole thread is full of people trying to prove that Watkins is better than ODB. There isn't one poster in the entire thread trying to prove Watkins is better. There are plenty that are trying to disprove JTSP and Co.'s crusade/trolling that ODB is undoubtedly better and will always be better than Sammy. The rational folks are just saying it's too early to determine unequivocally one way or the other. Big difference. That is unless you have a crusade to run: Yeap exactly. The OP was a tortured, desperate and ... let's face it ... silly attempt to try and explain away ODBs superior season. Unreal, just deal with it folks, ODB is better. Right on cue! You're ridiculous and I love it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What a Tuel Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) Yeap exactly. The OP was a tortured, desperate and ... let's face it ... silly attempt to try and explain away ODBs superior season. Unreal, just deal with it folks, ODB is better. Round 1 Pick 2 Calvin Johnson - 15 games 48 rec 95 targets 756 yards 4 tds Round 1 Pick 23 Dwayne Bowe - 16 games 70 rec 117 targets 995 yards 5 tds Would it be explaining away to say Calvin Johnson had Kitna throwing to him, and that his rookie year wasn't a fantastic assessment of his abilities? Bowe had Brodie Croyle and Damon Huard throwing to him..... This is not to say that Sammy Watkins is Calvin Johnson, or Odell Beckham is Dwayne Bowe, or vice versa, but rookie years are simply not great for evaluating a WR's true talent. Both had great rookie seasons. Let's leave it at that and quit the crusade. Edited January 10, 2015 by What a Tuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1B4IDie Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Round 1 Pick 2 Calvin Johnson - 15 games 48 rec 95 targets 756 yards 4 tds Round 1 Pick 23 Dwayne Bowe - 16 games 70 rec 117 targets 995 yards 5 tds Would it be explaining away to say Calvin Johnson had Kitna throwing to him, and that his rookie year wasn't a fantastic assessment of his abilities? Bowe had Brodie Croyle and Damon Huard throwing to him..... This is not to say that Sammy Watkins is Calvin Johnson, or Odell Beckham is Dwayne Bowe, or vice versa, but rookie years are simply not great for evaluating a WR's true talent. Both had great rookie seasons. Let's leave it at that and quit the crusade. (drops mic)[/thread] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Proteus Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) There isn't one poster in the entire thread trying to prove Watkins is better. There are plenty that are trying to disprove JTSP and Co.'s crusade/trolling that ODB is undoubtedly better and will always be better than Sammy. The rational folks are just saying it's too early to determine unequivocally one way or the other. Big difference. That is unless you have a crusade to run: Right on cue! You're ridiculous and I love it. People are coming up with all sorts of what if scenarios to try to explain the gap between Beckham and Watkins. Think whatever you want but there is definitley a crusade going on to try and prove that Watkins is as good or better. How is this for a scenario. It is pick 9 at the last draft, you have not made the trade and you have your choice between Watkins or Beckham. Who are you taking? Also it is a sure fire sign of someone who has no argument to just throw up a couple of laughing emoticons to try and discredit the poster instead of having something worthwhile to make other posters think about. The latter is something you never really do. You almost always try to make the other poster seem not credible. It is pretty much all you got and it is weak and transparent. Edited January 10, 2015 by Proteus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaaadThingsMan Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) Zero, after 4 weeks injured Moron would have sent him to IR for the year. Gotta be available.... Edited January 10, 2015 by NorCalBillsSabres Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 I couldn't find better stats, and there is something wrong with these splits from ESPN, because it only counts 79 of his 91 catches. But counting only 79 of them, OBJ caught 17 passes behind the line of scrimmage. So I imagine with the 12 extra, which may have been the last game they didn't count, over 20 of his catches, which are about 95% target completion, were behind the line. Watkins caught 4 balls behind the LOS. http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/16733/odell-beckham-jr Did it say they were 95% completions? Or are you making that up out of thin air? I don't know what's up with those stats. They still are missing a bunch of Beckham's passes there and a few of Sammy's too. It's hard to know what to say about them because who knows what happened with the missing ones? Hard to say what's up with those flawed figures. Is there any other site with better ones? But teams must have had to start defensing Beckham closer to the line. He was averaging more than nine yards a catch on those balls he caught behind the line. Sammy averaged 4 yards per catch on his. By the end of the season teams were scheming to take away Beckham. More than 1100 yards. In 12 games. That's insane for anyone, much less a rookie. Against Buffalo, teams loved it when Orton passed. The announcers were saying in the second Pats game that they were scheming to take away Chandler, who'd had more than 100 yards against them in the first game. Beckham simply had a better year than Sammy. Played better. There's no question outside of Buffalo. Did it help Beckham to play with Eli and hurt Sammy to play with who he played with? Sure. But not enough to offset how much better Beckham played. Could Sammy prove to be better in the long term? Yeah, sure, it's possible. But Beckham was better this year, by a large margin. And again, the OP claimed that if Beckham were on Buffalo, "a fair assumption based on these stats is 45 [completions] at best." I mean, come on. Still waiting as to what you think ODB would have produced on the Bills as per the thread title. One year in and ODB has much better #'s, however was not responsible for two last second wins as opposed to SW. However I'm more then happy cheering for someone (SW) as opposed to commenting on the footwork of some offensive tackle...... Let's make it simple JTSP.... How many games did ODB win for the Giants in the last minute? Doesn't matter. Wins are based on a lot of things, including how good your defense is and how close your team is in the last minute of games. That's just as much about the team as the receiver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Beckham wasn't getting much action until the WR corps in NY got decimated by injuries. He then became the go to guy and with great results. My guess is that if he were here, he would have been used much the same as Watkins and the results would have been similar. Beckham first missed a lot of TC. Then he missed the first four games with a hamstring injury. Not surprising he got a slow start. What is surprising is that with such little time to work with Eli and get experience that he still caught fire so relatively early in the year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Face it. OBJ would have had zero catches this year because Maroon would have put him on IR for the entire year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffaloed in Pa Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Who cares ? Sammy is still the better wideout.Bigger faster stronger. He`s a Bill and I`m happy about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Did it say they were 95% completions? Or are you making that up out of thin air? I don't know what's up with those stats. They still are missing a bunch of Beckham's passes there and a few of Sammy's too. It's hard to know what to say about them because who knows what happened with the missing ones? Hard to say what's up with those flawed figures. Is there any other site with better ones? The missing stats were his last game where he caught 12 balls. I checked the yardage and it works out. He caught at least three WR screens of the 12 catches. I watched some of the game and saw a couple and then looked at the gamebook. So he caught 20 give or take 1 behind the LOS. Those are automatic catches. I made up the 95% number but you know what I mean. That's a huge number of screens and that makes his catches and his target percentage skyrocket. I'm not at all saying he is not great. He had a fabulous season. But looking inside the numbers gives you more information. You dont have to do much of anything to get a WR screen catch. Running after the catch is another story, but I am talking about the catches. If you add 16 to Sammy's and subtract 16 from OBJ just on WR screens that dont require any talent, it looks a little different, huh? Sammy catches 80 or so and OBJ catches 75 or so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 I don't understand why this is a debate. Both are talented young WRs. OBJ had a better year, but played in a better system, so it skews things a bit, but unless we put them in the *exact* same scenario, it'll be difficult to tell "who's better" right away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1B4IDie Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Who cares ? Sammy is still the better wideout.Bigger faster stronger. He`s a Bill and I`m happy about it.Don't you understand, we can never be happy that we have a Perenial all star Reveiver. The Front office couldn't see the future that ODB would have more yards in his rookie year that Sammy, therefore they are incompetent and should all be fired.Duh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Proteus Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) Don't you understand, we can never be happy that we have a Perenial all star Reveiver. The Front office couldn't see the future that ODB would have more yards in his rookie year that Sammy, therefore they are incompetent and should all be fired. Duh. Dude enough with the hyperbole. Nobody has said anything even close to this. I don't care to have this debate anymore. I love Sammy, He is going to be a great WR and I am glad we have him. I hope Sammy is the best WR in the NFL next year, outshines ODB, and I am proven wrong. Edited January 10, 2015 by Proteus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Passepartout Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 But really Beckham is really a great WR and will be here to stay for the long haul. Just if he doesn't get injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffaloed in Pa Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Don't you understand, we can never be happy that we have a Perenial all star Reveiver. The Front office couldn't see the future that ODB would have more yards in his rookie year that Sammy, therefore they are incompetent and should all be fired. Duh. It`s the board. Say your piece and move on. It`s hard BUT its easier on you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth on hold Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 (edited) Givens: 1. Watkins is a good player 2. ODB is better 3. We overpaid for Watkins Debatable: 1. ODB is better but how much better? IMO a lot better 2. Should we have known we could have waited, kept our 2015 picks, and @9 gotten someone better like ODB or someone also in the mix like Benjamin? 3. Was it wise to pay that much for a WR in the first place? Edited January 10, 2015 by JTSP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumbalaya Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Odell would have had more then Sammy. He doesn't drop anything and he doesn't hear footsteps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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