Billsfan1972 Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 This Watkins back and forth for 9 months now I find ridiculous. There are so many hits and misses and so few sure things..... Yep get lucky in the draft or draft well and it will reap rewards, but I posted this elsewhere and don't understand how this actually was the impetus for Marrone leaving (not that I really care that he's gone)..... How terrible it is to be a Bills fan and get excited about a gifted offensive player as opposed to lamenting what we may have drafted at # 19 in 2015...... Maybe we should have kept the pick, drafted Ebron & gone 6-10 again? Would that make people here happy? Can we all agree that Watkins is a very good player and could be great? BTW First Round Buffalo picks..... Not too many All-Pros http://en.wikipedia....und_draft_picks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voodoo poonani Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Well IMO, I think it is a reflection on the GM's ability to make personnel decisions and the scouting department's ability to evaluate talent and present their data. Was it wise to give up multiple picks for a WR when the draft class is showing to be very deep at that position? Did we not know it was that deep? Are we able to properly evaluate talent? There are more misses than hits -> that's true! So the more at bats you have, you increase your chances of getting a hit. The Patriots don't hit on every draft choice, but they always seem to have a plethora of draft picks. If it's 50/50 on every pick, they will wind up with more hits than we will. What's worth trading away picks for? How many games has a WR won compared to a QB or heck even a DE? I don't know, but why shouldn't we ask questions and debate? Isn't that the point of coming to the forums? Are we all just supposed to wait for things to happen and say, "YAY!"? Wouldn't we just watch Sportscenter then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillnutinHouston Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 We actually don't know what role if any the Watkins pick played in Marrone leaving. It's all speculation. Was it money, power, insecurity, treatment by the fans and press, control of videos posted to the website? If anything I think it was most likely power going forward, not Marrone looking backward at the Watkins pick and sulking about that. But I get your point. Angst over the loss of the first round pick should not obscure the fact that we have a ROY candidate in the fold and a solid #1 receiver on the roster for many years to come. I think his body of work, absolute refusal to even discuss his injuries and consistency given this offense's limitations was outstanding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Says Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I dont want a GM with good "hind sight". I want a GM (and FO) with good "fore sight" ;the ability to project/forecast a player's production and value. THAT seperates the best from the mediocre.Anybody can look back and say" we coud have had (XXXXX) with that pick;look how good he turned out"...etc. I am OK with Whaley being THE man for a year so we can fairly evaluate him. if we fix the HC,OC, QB and O Line, keep D intact,sign oun valuable FA's..I will be happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Fong Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Well IMO, I think it is a reflection on the GM's ability to make personnel decisions and the scouting department's ability to evaluate talent and present their data. Was it wise to give up multiple picks for a WR when the draft class is showing to be very deep at that position? Did we not know it was that deep? Are we able to properly evaluate talent? It was acknowledged as a deep draft at the position, but Watkins was widely regarded as the one can't miss of the bunch. A lot of people also had Mike Evans on that can't miss list, but he would have been gone as well without a trade up. In hindsight it is a shame that ODB is looking so good, but who knows what he would have looked like on this team. Watkins looked like he's an all pro just waiting for a decent QB to throw him the ball and a HC/OC to take the leash off of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Wagon Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I think a lot of it is people seeing the opportunity cost, mainly Odell Beckham. However, something that clearly stands out is Beckham's targets (132 in 12 games, 116 in his last 9 games) vs Sammy's targets (128 in 16 games, 67 in his last 9 games). Simply put the Giants were forcing the ball to Beckham while losing games (4-8 in games beckham played, 1 win was his first game where he only had 5 targets). We had our offensive struggles and perhaps did not utilize Sammy to his full ability yet finished with our first winning record in years. Beckham is similar to the Brady draft rule. No one believed he would be this good, otherwise he would have challenged for the #1 pick. It takes a tremendous amount of hindsight to say "we really screwed the pooch there, could have had Beckham and our pick". No one is operating in hindsight in the draft and Sammy looks like a real player as well. If anything we should be more inclined to believe in Whaley as Beckham and Zach Martin were the other guys besides Ebron we were targeting at 9, both of those guys were panned as reaches there and they look like two of the best rookies so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsfan1972 Posted January 7, 2015 Author Share Posted January 7, 2015 The point simply is that we got a great player, and actually had a winning season in spite of putrid offense and qb play. I'm excited that there should be improved O next year and that this will be a point of focus (at least hope so). Beckham on the Bills would have been derided for missing 4 games and have caught (if he did catch 70% of the balls thrown to him like he did in NY) 62 passes..... If KO as inaccurate to ODB as he was with Watkins that # would be 46 (51% completion rate) and Bills fans would be up in arms that he was chosen too high...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Green Lightning Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Just when i got done reading the 2,800 posts on the Sammy Watkins trade, yet another Watkins trade thread. Maybe I'll start an E.J. thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I think a lot of it is people seeing the opportunity cost, mainly Odell Beckham. However, something that clearly stands out is Beckham's targets (132 in 12 games, 116 in his last 9 games) vs Sammy's targets (128 in 16 games, 67 in his last 9 games). Simply put the Giants were forcing the ball to Beckham while losing games (4-8 in games beckham played, 1 win was his first game where he only had 5 targets). We had our offensive struggles and perhaps did not utilize Sammy to his full ability yet finished with our first winning record in years. Beckham is similar to the Brady draft rule. No one believed he would be this good, otherwise he would have challenged for the #1 pick. It takes a tremendous amount of hindsight to say "we really screwed the pooch there, could have had Beckham and our pick". No one is operating in hindsight in the draft and Sammy looks like a real player as well. If anything we should be more inclined to believe in Whaley as Beckham and Zach Martin were the other guys besides Ebron we were targeting at 9, both of those guys were panned as reaches there and they look like two of the best rookies so far. Good post... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Because the draft is the Bills' Super Bowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billsfan1972 Posted January 7, 2015 Author Share Posted January 7, 2015 Great and I only start caring after Labour Day!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 This Watkins back and forth for 9 months now I find ridiculous. There are so many hits and misses and so few sure things..... Yep get lucky in the draft or draft well and it will reap rewards, but I posted this elsewhere and don't understand how this actually was the impetus for Marrone leaving (not that I really care that he's gone)..... How terrible it is to be a Bills fan and get excited about a gifted offensive player as opposed to lamenting what we may have drafted at # 19 in 2015...... Maybe we should have kept the pick, drafted Ebron & gone 6-10 again? Would that make people here happy? Can we all agree that Watkins is a very good player and could be great? BTW First Round Buffalo picks..... Not too many All-Pros http://en.wikipedia....und_draft_picks it's fun to argue about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSOL Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Im pretty supportive of Whaley, but it was a dumb move. Plus, i dont think Ralph would have allowed the trade, making it even more dubious, in my eyes. I dont think it cripples us, but, trading a future 1st rounder for a WR? DOH! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beef Jerky Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Whaley just needs to hit this year and most people will forget about the Watkins... Most people... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerme1 Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Whaley just needs to hit this year and most people will forget about the Watkins... Most people... If he can hit in 2,3 and 4 he should get a pass. If it turns out like last year he should be fired. Unless last years guys blossom under someone other than st doug. A highly likely scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sodbuster Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 If he can hit in 2,3 and 4 he should get a pass. If it turns out like last year he should be fired. Unless last years guys blossom under someone other than st doug. A highly likely scenario.He's done pretty well in the second and third rounds, so that's a possibility. The whole point of the draft is to pick up as many contributors as you can for your team. Does it really matter when they're drafted? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickelCity Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 (edited) I'm still ok with the trade. If there were a can't miss QB prospect where we would have been drafting, maybe I'd feel differently. Sammy is a phenomenon. Edited January 8, 2015 by NickelCity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beef Jerky Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 If he can hit in 2,3 and 4 he should get a pass. If it turns out like last year he should be fired. Unless last years guys blossom under someone other than st doug. A highly likely scenario. It's hard to hit on 3... I was thinking 1-2 depending on how good they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hplarrm Posted January 8, 2015 Share Posted January 8, 2015 Is losing our 1st a fatal blow? Naw- One certainly would rather have a #1 than not. However, the current braintrust finds with our second a player with the production of past #2 Alonso, or even get an everyday starter of former #2 Woods, then I am unconcerned. In fact even if this next #2 has the disappointing season of last year's #2 Cujo, back in the real world we found a great replacement for our Cujo hopes in 7th rounder Henderson. This loss of our #1 is a small prob but Whaley's team has shown this problem may well get fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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