John from Riverside Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 I think you're exaggerating ALL, a little bit. I think there was a pleasant surprise at some of his throws, but rest assured not EVERYBODY was happy that he came into camp as the incumbent back up, with Tuel & Dixon in tow. Oh for Heavens sake, get the point. If you don't have the draft position to take a top QB, then you shouldn't reach for a project late in round one. If they want to preach analytics, they should have learned the basic statistics of success rates of late first round QBs. OK......so here is where I ask what you would have done. - Fitzpatrick not the answer - Dont throw out some 3rd round drafted QB.....because the chances of hitting on a QB past the first round become even worse Who lines up behind center in your world? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Aaron Rodgers says hi. Drew Brees missed the bus, barely, but is also present. Good points. But they're not true. Bree's would have been a sure fire top 15 pick if he were 2 inches taller. And I don't remember Rogers being a project. He was a guy that slid. And I did say never. Hyperbole. I use it and it's not a crime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 To sum up this insae thread: Group 1: EJ sucks and I can't wait to brag that I was the first one who said he sucked. It's going to be so awesome. Group 2: Let's be patient and give him the season. Good points. But they're not true. Bree's would have been a sure fire top 15 pick if he were 2 inches taller. And I don't remember Rogers being a project. He was a guy that slid. And I did say never. Hyperbole. I use it and it's not a crime. I love when folks make statements that can't be proven. If Tom Brady was better in college, he would have been the #1 pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Good points. But they're not true. Bree's would have been a sure fire top 15 pick if he were 2 inches taller. And I don't remember Rogers being a project. He was a guy that slid. And I did say never. Hyperbole. I use it and it's not a crime. Rogers was absolutely a project.....he did not look good in pre season when given his opportunites. He was just in a good situation behind Farve "if only he was taller".....if its and buts were candy and nuts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbosrrgood Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Time to get on the bandwagon? Go Bills.. Abandon ship! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 To sum up this insae thread: Group 1: EJ sucks and I can't wait to brag that I was the first one who said he sucked. It's going to be so awesome. Group 2: Let's be patient and give him the season. I love when folks make statements that can't be proven. If Tom Brady was better in college, he would have been the #1 pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Rogers was absolutely a project.....he did not look good in pre season when given his opportunites. He was just in a good situation behind Farve "if only he was taller".....if its and buts were candy and nuts If Charlie Ward was white, he would have been drafted in the NFL. Stuff we can never prove. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 To sum up this insae thread: Group 1: EJ sucks and I can't wait to brag that I was the first one who said he sucked. It's going to be so awesome. Group 2: Let's be patient and give him the season. I love when folks make statements that can't be proven. If Tom Brady was better in college, he would have been the #1 pick. You can't invalidate my argument by substituting it with a ridiculous statement like that. I know it's standard message board practice but it just doesn't work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 You can't invalidate my argument by substituting it with a ridiculous statement like that. I know it's standard message board practice but it just doesn't work. Why not....you do it all the time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Good points. But they're not true. Bree's would have been a sure fire top 15 pick if he were 2 inches taller. And I don't remember Rogers being a project. He was a guy that slid. And I did say never. Hyperbole. I use it and it's not a crime. Rodgers was considered a project; he was considered a "system" guy, "too mechanical," and not NFL ready. Supposedly (I didn't follow that closely, and am going off anecdote), the Packers had to re-teach his throwing mechanics. Of course, they had the luxury of doing that, with him on the bench for three seasons behind Favre. Fact is, most college QBs are not "NFL ready" coming out. It's not like 30 years ago - the college and pro games have diverged significantly. College doesn't prepare you nearly as well for the pros nowadays as it did Theisman, Montana, or Kelly, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 I'll speak only for myself... I don't believe EJ is the answer and am ready to give up on the guy. I don't care about winning message board arguments and reminding people I was right. I want playoffs and I think Orton can get us there. That's all. You're not a superior fan if you want to keep EJ as starter and nor are you inferior if you're ready to pull the plug. But to the EJ supporters; how much time is enough? When's that magic number of games that we need to cross before we can say whether EJ has 'it'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Rodgers was considered a project; he was considered a "system" guy, "too mechanical," and not NFL ready. Supposedly (I didn't follow that closely, and am going off anecdote), the Packers had to re-teach his throwing mechanics. Of course, they had the luxury of doing that, with him on the bench for three seasons behind Favre. Yes, this is well-documented. His throwing motion was a mess and Mike McCarthy rebuilt him. He was a mess with his first coaching staff. He slid, yes. But sliding or moving up based on prognostications doesn't really have much to do with how you do. Brady Quinn slid, and he was for a time a highly-regarded prospect. That didn't work out so well. We need to stop basing analysis on draft position, especially when the Bills moved back to acquire EJ and Kiko using their one pick. The move was already an unqualified success. If EJ can grow, it'll be a home run. This is not so hard to understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Rodgers was considered a project; he was considered a "system" guy, "too mechanical," and not NFL ready. Supposedly (I didn't follow that closely, and am going off anecdote), the Packers had to re-teach his throwing mechanics. Of course, they had the luxury of doing that, with him on the bench for three seasons behind Favre. Fact is, most college QBs are not "NFL ready" coming out. It's not like 30 years ago - the college and pro games have diverged significantly. College doesn't prepare you nearly as well for the pros nowadays as it did Theisman, Montana, or Kelly, Completely disagree. High schoolers have QB coaches these days. I think QBs are coming out far more prepared. Dalton, Luck, Wilson, Ryan, Stafford, Newton, Foles, Cousins, these guys are winning early. EJs the exception. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 But to the EJ supporters; how much time is enough? When's that magic number of games that we need to cross before we can say whether EJ has 'it'? I'll take "there isn't one"? The magic number is the number of games it takes for them to find someone better. That person does not exist right now, despite protestations to the contrary and Orton's presence on the roster for all of 4 weeks, without a training camp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 I'll speak only for myself... I don't believe EJ is the answer and am ready to give up on the guy. I don't care about winning message board arguments and reminding people I was right. I want playoffs and I think Orton can get us there. That's all. You're not a superior fan if you want to keep EJ as starter and nor are you inferior if you're ready to pull the plug. But to the EJ supporters; how much time is enough? When's that magic number of games that we need to cross before we can say whether EJ has 'it'? I sure do wish you were the GM of the Bills. I want EJ benched so I can get EJ production from a more experienced QB with EJ like statistics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 Completely disagree. High schoolers have QB coaches these days. I think QBs are coming out far more prepared. Dalton, Luck, Wilson, Ryan, Stafford, Newton, Foles, Cousins, these guys are winning early. EJs the exception. Kaepernick, Alex Smith, Foles (?) -- sat for a year, sucked when he was out there. We could go on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Dude Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 I said I wouldn't get into this...we're using other QBs to validate or demonize EJ. This is dumb. EJ will make his own bed, not the history of past successful or failed QB prospects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 I'll speak only for myself... I don't believe EJ is the answer and am ready to give up on the guy. Thats your problem I don't care about winning message board arguments and reminding people I was right. To air on the side of negative will cause you to be right when bills have been in such turmoil over the past 14 years.....your just playing the odds your not really going out on a limb I want playoffs and I think Orton can get us there. That's all. You dont take a QB that was behind center out when you are 2-1 and made plays that actually got you to that record. And this is even IF Orton is a good QB.....you have locker room issues....you have a QB that you will NOT be able to insert back into the lineup if you yank him (if Orton goes in and shows his age) because you will have destroyed his confidence...and you will have blantantly wasted a 1st round pick on a improving QB when you dont have a 1st round pick next year to replace that QB. Now......if EJ starts regressing? Im with ya.....but one game against a good Chargers team does not count as regression. You're not a superior fan if you want to keep EJ as starter and nor are you inferior if you're ready to pull the plug. No fans that stick up for the currently playing players are not "superior" fans.......and your not inferior if you want to pull the plug and start over....in my opinion plug pullers on a 2-1 team are just impatient and WRONG But to the EJ supporters; how much time is enough? When's that magic number of games that we need to cross before we can say whether EJ has 'it'? The same as it was for me at the beginning of the season.....this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrod's Tailor Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 We could go on. Something everyone can agree on. At least another 60 pages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted September 23, 2014 Share Posted September 23, 2014 ... But to the EJ supporters; how much time is enough? When's that magic number of games that we need to cross before we can say whether EJ has 'it'? A good historical threshold is 1,000 pass attempts. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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