Beerball Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 Update Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 So are they suing the Bills next for our Wall of Fame 12th man? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammered a Lot Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 So are they suing the Bills next for our Wall of Fame 12th man? Nope. The Bills and Seahawks pay trademark fees for usage of 12th man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fingon Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 So are they suing the Bills next for our Wall of Fame 12th man? No, they settled on some measly cash payment like 5k per year. Probably because Texas A&M knew they would lose their trademark in a lawsuit, and the Bills decided it would just be cheaper to pay 5k per year than file a suit. They can bully someone with no money, but will bend over backwards for someone with money to avoid having their trademark challenged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Adams Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 By extension, shouldn't they also be suing the Bills for putting up the 12th Man on the Wall of Fame? I'd like to see them try that one and see if the trademark holds up. "Hinckley said Texas A&M, which has owned the trademark since 1922, only allows the Bills and Seattle Seahawks to pay licensing fees to use the phrase “the 12th man,” and under very specific conditions." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark80 Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 No, they settled on some measly cash payment like 5k per year. Probably because Texas A&M knew they would lose their trademark in a lawsuit, and the Bills decided it would just be cheaper to pay 5k per year than file a suit. They can bully someone with no money, but will bend over backwards for someone with money to avoid having their trademark challenged. What in the world makes you think they would lose their suit? They have had the trademark for over 90 years, long before anyone else was using that phrase, they routinely defend that trademark (as evidenced here) when it is utilized outside of the "fair use" standard and, accordingly, have not allowed it into the "public domain." Your legal knowledge is unfounded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_Pro_Bills Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 "Hinckley said Texas A&M, which has owned the trademark since 1922, only allows the Bills and Seattle Seahawks to pay licensing fees to use the phrase “the 12th man,” and under very specific conditions." I think the A&M trademark should be invalidated on the grounds it is discriminitory and offensive similar to the Redskins trademark issue. This is clearly a case of gender discriminition A more PC version for the current social environment would be "the 12th person". Really, I am just joking here because to I think A&M is making a mountain out of nothing. The BIlls fan site does not seek to exploit the term for profit or personal gain. Only to rally fans around a specific cause. The use of the term and the site will likely be transitory. So what financial damage can that cause some college football program down in Texas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campy Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 What in the world makes you think they would lose their suit? They have had the trademark for over 90 years, long before anyone else was using that phrase, they routinely defend that trademark (as evidenced here) when it is utilized outside of the "fair use" standard and, accordingly, have not allowed it into the "public domain." Your legal knowledge is unfounded. He offered a legal opinion, not legal knowledge. Your knowledge, however, is incorrect. Texas A&M were notified the mark was registered in 1990. In the 69 years since it was first used and became a registered mark, it became a common phrase used in multiple sports and at all levels of competition. So he was right, they very well could lose the mark if an infringement claim was adjudicated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark80 Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 (edited) Really, I am just joking here because to I think A&M is making a mountain out of nothing. The BIlls fan site does not seek to exploit the term for profit or personal gain. Only to rally fans around a specific cause. The use of the term and the site will likely be transitory. So what financial damage can that cause some college football program down in Texas? The point is that they are protecting their trademark. In trademark law, the more you allow it to be used, the more likely that eventually the trademark can fall into the public domain standard, thus invalidating your trademark. If you allow this one, then the next one, then the next one after that, you are starting down the path to losing it. The safest course of action is to protect it always for the holder. He offered a legal opinion, not legal knowledge. Your knowledge, however, is incorrect. Texas A&M were notified the mark was registered in 1990. In the 69 years since it was first used and became a registered mark, it became a common phrase used in multiple sports and at all levels of competition. So he was right, they very well could lose the mark if an infringement claim was adjudicated. You are correct, I mistakenly relied on another posters quote in my assertion of 1922. However, the Trademark office found their use of the phrase so set in their history that they approved the Mark at that time for them alone. (Forcing the Bills and Bears to stop using it at that time). The Seahawks also had to pay $100,000k and $5k annually for it's use and are not allowed to use it on any merchandising (thus the stuff with only "12" on it). Don't you think that if the NFL thought it would win a case on this they would file a suit just based off of what they could merchandise with it or allowed the suit A&M filed against the Seahawks to run it's course rather than settling out of court? They know they would lose. Edited July 31, 2014 by Mark80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extrahammer Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 If the Bills pay to use the trademark, common sense says fans usage of something the Bills paid for - paid to promote - should be under that umbrella. If A&M has a problem with that, they shouldn't license it out in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 If the Bills pay to use the trademark, common sense says fans usage of something the Bills paid for - paid to promote - should be under that umbrella. If A&M has a problem with that, they shouldn't license it out in the first place. Say what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blzrul Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 They sued the Seahawks and won - Seahawks had to pay them $ to "license" the 12th man crap they use here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsswansonjr Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 IMO, the decision should be made based on profit, if there is no monetary benefit received by whoever/whatever is using it, why penalize them? As usual, it comes down to greed!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark80 Posted July 31, 2014 Share Posted July 31, 2014 (edited) They sued the Seahawks and won - Seahawks had to pay them $ to "license" the 12th man crap they use here. Not exactly, they settled out of court. But I suspect they would have won or the NFL / Seahawks would have battled. IMO, the decision should be made based on profit, if there is no monetary benefit received by whoever/whatever is using it, why penalize them? As usual, it comes down to greed!! Of course it does. That's the law, and the law in our country (relating to business especially) comes down to greed and protecting rich people / corporations. If you don't like it, write your representatives, research and care about who you vote for, and influence others around you to do the same. Edited July 31, 2014 by Mark80 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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