Cash Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 there is no guarantee he's be there, if that's the guy you want, pull the trigger. my question is which has more value? ebron at 9 and whichever receiver is there that you like in the 2nd, or evans at 9 and whichever te you may like in the 2nd? (this is assuming you want a wr, te combo with the first two picks, which i would love to see) Me personally, I would prefer Evans at 9 and a TE (ideally Niklas) in the 2nd. Niklas won't be the game-breaker we'd love to have at TE, but I don't know if any of these guys will. Ebron's hands scare me, and beyond that, I think that Marrone favors a TE who can spend more time on the line than Ebron or Amaro is used to. Niklas spent the vast majority of his time lining up as a true TE in-line (see link below), and looks to me like an upgrade over Chandler. Kind of a Heath Miller/Brandon Pettigrew type who can block, catch a few first downs, and be used as a solid red zone threat, but who won't terrify opposing defenses. That's what Evans is for. He just strikes me as the perfect weapon for EJ, especially as EJ works on developing his accuracy. http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/cfb/46006/349/peshek-top-4-wr-metrics http://www.rotoworld.com/articles/cfb/46280/349/peshek-te-metrics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris heff Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I think that you are right on with the guys gone. Barr seems to be slipping. Free agency will be interesting for sure. All it takes is one team in the first eight to do something unexpected to make either Mack or Watkins fall to nine. In free agency I think it is easier to get a serviceable LB or OL, whether it be a tackle or guard, than it is to get a number one WR or a top TE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 All it takes is one team in the first eight to do something unexpected to make either Mack or Watkins fall to nine. In free agency I think it is easier to get a serviceable LB or OL, whether it be a tackle or guard, than it is to get a number one WR or a top TE. I am with you 100%. I can find a pretty good RT (ie Strief) in free agency but I can't find a #1 WR there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 What this would very likely mean iin two years or whenever Glenn's contract is up, he will be gone. In two years that he's already been here, he's played well enough to prove he can play LT AND more importantly be paid as a LT. So unless Buffalo want's to pay him LT money to play RT, he's gone. That's the problem I see with all these "draft a tackle at nine" threads, you're not drafting a RT at nine and as soone as you move Glenn, you'll lose him. On a side note: I would love the Bills to see if Joe Thomas is available. He has made 7 straight Pro Bowls and arguable the best LT in the NFL. He has been critical of the Browns front office and we are a couple years ahead of the Browns in the rebuild. Maybe if we offer our second round pick we could snag him up. He is 29 but has 4 years left on his contract and will likely play at a Pro Bowl level until he is at least 35. Even if you had to give up a 3rd or 4th next year I would still do it. Thomas at LT, Wood at C, Glenn at RT, Ubrik at RG, and sign a quality free agent LG. Then you would probably have the best offensive line in the NFL or close to it. An offensive line like that with, Jackson, Spiller, Ebron, Stevie, Woods, and Goodwin as targets... That would show me the Bills are serious and would give Manuel a sick surrounding cast. If they did that I could forgive them for then trading Byrd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris heff Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 What this would very likely mean iin two years or whenever Glenn's contract is up, he will be gone. In two years that he's already been here, he's played well enough to prove he can play LT AND more importantly be paid as a LT. So unless Buffalo want's to pay him LT money to play RT, he's gone. That's the problem I see with all these "draft a tackle at nine" threads, you're not drafting a RT at nine and as soone as you move Glenn, you'll lose him. I agree, I said the same thing in another thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 That's the problem around here, too many posters think they are playing Strat-O-Matic Football where things like this will work great! I agree, I said the same thing in another thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris heff Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 That's the problem around here, too many posters think they are playing Strat-O-Matic Football where things like this will work great! If you want to create a problem, draft a guy that believes he is a LT and play him at RT, or move Glenn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enlightener Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 (edited) jaxbills "301 catches and 3,832 yards after being drafted in the seventh round, all we remember is a drop, and a fumble. Amazing." yes all we remember are the big plays that he cant seem to make....all you can do is quote stats amassed in 4 years as the unquestioned starter on a team that had to pass quite a bit since we are usually losing and forced to pass in the second half....A guy that gets targeted that much should have had 400 catches and 4000 yards by now. Maybe because he cant go deep, stay healthy, avoid penalties or even hold on to the football now..that and the drops make me remember those things about Steve Johnson...can we draft a real #1 now pleeeeease!! P.S. Him being a 7th rounder doesn't mean he's accomplished more...it means he kinda sucked in college as he is showing he kinda sucks now Edited February 25, 2014 by enlightener Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I would prefer to Draft a big WR in Round 1 or 2 and then Draft the Iowa TE, Fiedorwicz (spelling?), in the 3rd but preferrably the 4th.... jaxbills "301 catches and 3,832 yards after being drafted in the seventh round, all we remember is a drop, and a fumble. Amazing." yes all we remember are the big plays that he cant seem to make....all you can do is quote stats amassed in 4 years as the unquestioned starter on a team that had to pass quite a bit since we are usually losing and forced to pass in the second half....A guy that gets targeted that much should have had 400 catches and 4000 yards by now. Maybe because he cant go deep, stay healthy, avoid penalties or even hold on to the football now..that and the drops make me remember those things about Steve Johnson...can we draft a real #1 now pleeeeease!! +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsBytheBay Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 (edited) My point was not to say that we don't need another playmaker at wide receiver. It was just that people hang a lot of hate on stevie after ONE down season...played with 3 QB's, with one collective start between them..... Watkins won't be available to us IMO. I would love to have a dominant O line, that can make a mediocre QB look good (SF49). And a run stuffing line backer. Enlightener: more like opinionated, and dosent hear what was said... And makes angry incorrect assumptions at other posters intent. Edited February 25, 2014 by JaxBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 I absolutely think Ebron should be the pick at 9 IF Mack doesnt fall to us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsBytheBay Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 (edited) I would LOVE mack..... But I don't see that happening. I don't think any of the QB needy teams ahead of us take a QB. To have a chance at Watkins or Mack, QB's and OT's need to be taken early. Edited February 25, 2014 by JaxBills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbosrrgood Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 (edited) Ebron is nice player but he's a bit overrated at TE IMO. He's not Vernon Davis, he's not particularly big, and he didn't run a 4.38 he ran a 4.6. Keep in mind he rarely even played as a TE, most of the time he was split out as a WR anyway. He may go in the first, but I'd be shocked if he went in the top 10. Furthermore that doesn't seem like the type of guy Marrone really wants. Judging by what the Bills did last year, they need a true INLINE TE. Something Ebron simply is not. Just look at Gragg, despite looking pretty good in his tiny amount of snaps, Marrone wanted nothing to do with him because he felt he could not be an inline TE. He said as much in the preseason as well. Luckily there are plenty of talented TE's in this draft, my favorite by far is ASJ. He has the receiving skills of Ebron (not as fast, but much bigger, and better hands), but is a very good INLINE TE with good blocking skills. Next on that list would be Niklas, who is one of the best blocking TE's to come out in a few years...and he's probably at least as good as Chandler catching. Guys like Ebron and Amaro could be very effective for certain teams (NE, NO for instance), but don't seem like they fit in with Marrone/Hackett's style as they are one dimensional. Edited February 25, 2014 by Turbosrrgood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Ebron is nice player but he's a bit overrated at TE IMO. He's not Vernon Davis, he's not particularly big, and he didn't run a 4.38 he ran a 4.6. Keep in mind he rarely even played as a TE, most of the time he was split out as a WR anyway. He may go in the first, but I'd be shocked if he went in the top 10. Furthermore that doesn't seem like the type of guy Marrone really wants. Judging by what the Bills did last year, they need a true INLINE TE. Something Ebron simply is not. Just look at Gragg, despite looking pretty good in his tiny amount of snaps, Marrone wanted nothing to do with him because he felt he could not be an inline TE. He said as much in the preseason as well. Luckily there are plenty of talented TE's in this draft, my favorite by far is ASJ. He has the receiving skills of Ebron (not as fast, but much bigger, and better hands), but is a very good INLINE TE with good blocking skills. Next on that list would be Niklas, who is one of the best blocking TE's to come out in a few years...and he's probably at least as good as Chandler catching. Guys like Ebron and Amaro could be very effective for certain teams (NE, NO for instance), but don't seem like they fit in with Marrone/Hackett's style as they are one dimensional. +2....I just wish more people "got it" when it comes to TE...fans see Graham and Gronk and assume that means 1st Round TE, but then fail to see that neither of those guys were 1st rounders...moreover, the better TEs over time, Gates, Witten, Graham himself, and the new-comers in Julius Thomas and Jordan Cameron were all 3rd and 4th round guys...just say, Fiedorowicz in the 4th... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 (edited) Ebron is nice player but he's a bit overrated at TE IMO. He's not Vernon Davis, he's not particularly big, and he didn't run a 4.38 he ran a 4.6. Keep in mind he rarely even played as a TE, most of the time he was split out as a WR anyway. He may go in the first, but I'd be shocked if he went in the top 10. Furthermore that doesn't seem like the type of guy Marrone really wants. Judging by what the Bills did last year, they need a true INLINE TE. Something Ebron simply is not. Just look at Gragg, despite looking pretty good in his tiny amount of snaps, Marrone wanted nothing to do with him because he felt he could not be an inline TE. He said as much in the preseason as well. Luckily there are plenty of talented TE's in this draft, my favorite by far is ASJ. He has the receiving skills of Ebron (not as fast, but much bigger, and better hands), but is a very good INLINE TE with good blocking skills. Next on that list would be Niklas, who is one of the best blocking TE's to come out in a few years...and he's probably at least as good as Chandler catching. Guys like Ebron and Amaro could be very effective for certain teams (NE, NO for instance), but don't seem like they fit in with Marrone/Hackett's style as they are one dimensional. You're right, Ebron isn't Vernon Davis because I think he is going to be better than Davis. Why? Because while the guy looks just as good skill wise, he comes across as a player with a much tougher "baller" style and a more driven personality. Davis is a very good TE, but he's not a great monster game changer like Graham. I think that Ebron's going to be a game changing NFL star. Once Watkins is off the board, I'm at a toss up with picking either Evans or Ebron. I might eventually lean to Ebron because he seems to have a real "baller" edge and style to him that this team seriously lacks, especially when it comes to the offense. Remember how many of those types we had in the Jim Kelly era? This team needs those kind of players. Just look at the last few 1st rounders...Manuel is low key, Gilmore is low key, Dareus is low key...I think I'm ready for a great player who's tightly wound, has a chip on his shoulder and isn't afraid to express it. Edited February 25, 2014 by 1billsfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbosrrgood Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 +2....I just wish more people "got it" when it comes to TE...fans see Graham and Gronk and assume that means 1st Round TE, but then fail to see that neither of those guys were 1st rounders...moreover, the better TEs over time, Gates, Witten, Graham himself, and the new-comers in Julius Thomas and Jordan Cameron were all 3rd and 4th round guys...just say, Fiedorowicz in the 4th... I'm a fan of Fiedorowicz if we don't take a TE earlier. He's like Niklas, with less proven production. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Ebron is nice player but he's a bit overrated at TE IMO. He's not Vernon Davis, he's not particularly big, and he didn't run a 4.38 he ran a 4.6. Keep in mind he rarely even played as a TE, most of the time he was split out as a WR anyway. He may go in the first, but I'd be shocked if he went in the top 10. Furthermore that doesn't seem like the type of guy Marrone really wants. Judging by what the Bills did last year, they need a true INLINE TE. Something Ebron simply is not. Just look at Gragg, despite looking pretty good in his tiny amount of snaps, Marrone wanted nothing to do with him because he felt he could not be an inline TE. He said as much in the preseason as well. Luckily there are plenty of talented TE's in this draft, my favorite by far is ASJ. He has the receiving skills of Ebron (not as fast, but much bigger, and better hands), but is a very good INLINE TE with good blocking skills. Next on that list would be Niklas, who is one of the best blocking TE's to come out in a few years...and he's probably at least as good as Chandler catching. Guys like Ebron and Amaro could be very effective for certain teams (NE, NO for instance), but don't seem like they fit in with Marrone/Hackett's style as they are one dimensional. Couple things: 1) Davis and Ebron are the same height and Davis is only 4 lbs bigger. That said, Davis has freak speed. 2) You got me interested in ASJ. 3) Are we sure Marrone didn't unse a TE like because those we his options? Gragg was an undersized 7th rounder. Chandler was our leading wr and split out a decent amount. If he had better options at TE, maybe he would have tried different thing. But it does seem like EJ loves throwing to the TE (like most young QBs). I'd love to have a more explosive palyer than Chandler, who is solid but limited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 My point was not to say that we don't need another playmaker at wide receiver. It was just that people hang a lot of hate on stevie after ONE down season...played with 3 QB's, with one collective start between them..... Watkins won't be available to us IMO. I would love to have a dominant O line, that can make a mediocre QB look good (SF49). And a run stuffing line backer. Enlightener: more like opinionated, and dosent hear what was said... And makes angry incorrect assumptions at other posters intent. Not to be too nit-picky about your choice of words but when you say "another playmaker", that would insinuate the BILLS have one?? SJ isn't a playmaker...Dez Bryant, Megatron, AJ Green, Julio Jones, even Randall Cobb to a lesser extent so far...those are playmakers in my mind...guys, who be definition make plays when it matters and make them consistently, guys who can make a catch when it seems impossible and guys who can make it to pay-dirt when it seems they will come up short...SJ has done well overall, but he's also made his share of mistakes, i.e. dumb penalties, fumbles, and yes, the give up on the KC Int return does count....you can love SJ and think the BILLS need to keep him and play him...I respectfully disagree, given his salary and what he does NOT bring to the table...but to say the BILLS *don't need "another playmaker" at WR, is incredulous in my mind, b/c that's EXACTLY what the BILLS need...do they need it at 9th overall?? Probably not this year, but that is just b/c WR is so deep...I certainly think you can wait to Round 2 and maybe Round 3, depending on how the Draft is progressing to get an impact outside, playmaking WR...but don't be mistaken, the BILLS could use one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Not to be too nit-picky about your choice of words but when you say "another playmaker", that would insinuate the BILLS have one?? SJ isn't a playmaker...Dez Bryant, Megatron, AJ Green, Julio Jones, even Randall Cobb to a lesser extent so far...those are playmakers in my mind...guys, who be definition make plays when it matters and make them consistently, guys who can make a catch when it seems impossible and guys who can make it to pay-dirt when it seems they will come up short...SJ has done well overall, but he's also made his share of mistakes, i.e. dumb penalties, fumbles, and yes, the give up on the KC Int return does count....you can love SJ and think the BILLS need to keep him and play him...I respectfully disagree, given his salary and what he does NOT bring to the table...but to say the BILLS *don't need "another playmaker" at WR, is incredulous in my mind, b/c that's EXACTLY what the BILLS need...do they need it at 9th overall?? Probably not this year, but that is just b/c WR is so deep...I certainly think you can wait to Round 2 and maybe Round 3, depending on how the Draft is progressing to get an impact outside, playmaking WR...but don't be mistaken, the BILLS could use one... Um, Stevie Johnson makes plenty of plays. Thus, he's a playmaker. That said, he's not an elite guys like some of the guys you named (let's relax on Cobb for a second). If you're receiving core consisted of SJ, Woods, Evans, and Goodwin, that's a damn fine group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted February 25, 2014 Share Posted February 25, 2014 Not to be too nit-picky about your choice of words but when you say "another playmaker", that would insinuate the BILLS have one?? SJ isn't a playmaker...Dez Bryant, Megatron, AJ Green, Julio Jones, even Randall Cobb to a lesser extent so far...those are playmakers in my mind...guys, who be definition make plays when it matters and make them consistently, guys who can make a catch when it seems impossible and guys who can make it to pay-dirt when it seems they will come up short...SJ has done well overall, but he's also made his share of mistakes, i.e. dumb penalties, fumbles, and yes, the give up on the KC Int return does count....you can love SJ and think the BILLS need to keep him and play him...I respectfully disagree, given his salary and what he does NOT bring to the table...but to say the BILLS *don't need "another playmaker" at WR, is incredulous in my mind, b/c that's EXACTLY what the BILLS need...do they need it at 9th overall?? Probably not this year, but that is just b/c WR is so deep...I certainly think you can wait to Round 2 and maybe Round 3, depending on how the Draft is progressing to get an impact outside, playmaking WR...but don't be mistaken, the BILLS could use one... It's tough to wait on playmakers here are some 1st round WR off the top of my head: Julio, Megatron, Demayrius Thomas, AJ Green, Dez Bryant, Roddy White, Michael Crabtree, Andre Johnson, Reggie Wayne, Kendall Wright & Larry Fitzgerald Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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