Direhard Fan Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 It's not Brandon We paid Williams 100m. It's the past that is hurting. Give the new group three years and see. Than complain. Have to agree a backup QB plan was not in place. Now we need to address our new needs. Vet QB to steady the ship for afew games and a punter. Did we forget about the punter? Lick our wounds and suck it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TXBILLSFAN Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 It's not Brandon We paid Williams 100m. It's the past that is hurting. Give the new group three years and see. Than complain. Have to agree a backup QB plan was not in place. Now we need to address our new needs. Vet QB to steady the ship for afew games and a punter. Did we forget about the punter? Lick our wounds and suck it up. I know we paid Williams $100M, but why didn't we spend the other $20M that is available this year ?? -- if not on new players, extend existing players to free cap space up next year ? --- if not extensions, how about restructurings to free cap space up next year and year after ? -- again, it's playing with one hand tied behind your back -- can you win that way, of course, except, it's much harder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 (edited) I know we paid Williams $100M, but why didn't we spend the other $20M that is available this year ?? -- if not on new players, extend existing players to free cap space up next year ? --- if not extensions, how about restructurings to free cap space up next year and year after ? -- again, it's playing with one hand tied behind your back -- can you win that way, of course, except, it's much harder The truth is this team has gambled with the middle and the bottom of this roster and it's cost them again on the field...It's not as much about top tier spending as it is about spending to find better players than the likes of Rogers, Tuel, Colin Brown, etc...The cost differential to fill positions like that is minimal, and certainly within the $20 mil or so they are under the cap...But the Bills tried to buck the odds and got caught by the injury bug...Lesson learned? We'll see next off season... I should note that they actually did the right thing in retaining Tavaris Jackson as an insurance policy at QB...Then they cut him 4 months later...So even when they got it right, they got it wrong... Edited October 5, 2013 by KOKBILLS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noodlearm Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 How about this defense with Jabaree Greer and Drayton Florence? And they almost lost Fred Jackson because they didn't want to pay him either. Everytime we've had a playmaker and his contract is up, there are a dozen reasons why it doesn't "make sense" to pay. It only doesn't make sense if you don't care about fielding a competitive team! The only way that business model (not resigning star players) works (see Tampa Rays or Oakland As in baseball) is if you can draft impact replacements which hasn't happened here for a while. Hopefully things will change. If they are not considering Josh Freeman to avoid a qb controversy the season is lost, and I mean four wins max. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keukasmallies Posted October 5, 2013 Share Posted October 5, 2013 On the other hand, the Bills organization is definitely NOT a joke if you accept the premise that the objective is to make money. After all, the "Buffalo Bills" is a business, businesses operate to make money; fortunately for the Bills, their customers are satisfied with an inferior product year after year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 How about this defense with Jabaree Greer and Drayton Florence? And they almost lost Fred Jackson because they didn't want to pay him either. Everytime we've had a playmaker and his contract is up, there are a dozen reasons why it doesn't "make sense" to pay. It only doesn't make sense if you don't care about fielding a competitive team! The only way that business model (not resigning star players) works (see Tampa Rays or Oakland As in baseball) is if you can draft impact replacements which hasn't happened here for a while. Hopefully things will change. If they are not considering Josh Freeman to avoid a qb controversy the season is lost, and I mean four wins max. actually 2013's draft may be viewed as the best in over a decade because of alonso and woods and possibly manuel. the question of determination to win will come if they do progress to the top of their position and want top money. based on history they'll be going somewhere else (and honestly, even if the money is the same as offered elsewhere, who can blame them). the only hope is that the bills have a new owner and new bean counters in place by then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jkgobills Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 How about this defense with Jabaree Greer and Drayton Florence? And they almost lost Fred Jackson because they didn't want to pay him either. Everytime we've had a playmaker and his contract is up, there are a dozen reasons why it doesn't "make sense" to pay. It only doesn't make sense if you don't care about fielding a competitive team! The only way that business model (not resigning star players) works (see Tampa Rays or Oakland As in baseball) is if you can draft impact replacements which hasn't happened here for a while. Hopefully things will change. If they are not considering Josh Freeman to avoid a qb controversy the season is lost, and I mean four wins max. Every time I watch Greer and Florence play (and Winfield for years before that), I wonder what other players we could have if we weren't chasing their repkacements. Gilmore is looking like a great player and pick, but who could we have taken instead at number 10? Who could we have taken instead of McKelvin? This is a reason for our lack of overall depth. Every team misses from time to time in the draft (we seem to miss a bit more often than average). To build a team with starters and depth they will have to be willing to retain their players that they drafted and developed into quality starters. No one drafts well enough to consistently replace starters every year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 (edited) LOL, think lack of depth is bad here? The Jaguars are using ball boys as wide receivers... http://fansided.com/...ers-scout-team/ Seriously though, I don't get all of the sudden frustration and outrage regarding the backup QB. Maybe I missed it, but I didn't see one person up in arms about Tuel being our backup before the Manuel injury. The hand wringing this week on this board has been so over the top. I've seen nothing yet that signals the Bills are not on the same track as they were in the mid-eighties. IMO, if not for the key injuries to Gilmore and Manuel, they'd be 4-1. As Bills fans I would hope that more fans would see this. I can understand the national media not bothering to look just below the surface, but I'm extremely excited for the future of this team. Once healthy, I think they are shaping up to be a Pittsburgh Steelers type of team. Strong defense, big/strong/athletic/opportunistic QB, and a great running game. I can't wait till the last seven games when the team is at full strength and we can see what we really have going on. Edited October 6, 2013 by 1billsfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigK14094 Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 How about this defense with Jabaree Greer and Drayton Florence? And they almost lost Fred Jackson because they didn't want to pay him either. Everytime we've had a playmaker and his contract is up, there are a dozen reasons why it doesn't "make sense" to pay. It only doesn't make sense if you don't care about fielding a competitive team! The only way that business model (not resigning star players) works (see Tampa Rays or Oakland As in baseball) is if you can draft impact replacements which hasn't happened here for a while. Hopefully things will change. If they are not considering Josh Freeman to avoid a qb controversy the season is lost, and I mean four wins max. Greer, ok, Florence....was washed up when let go, he would be faster in a wheel chair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mannc Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 (edited) And if you think Tavaris Jackson was decent, then why did he never see any game action for the Bills when he was here? see title of this thread. Edited October 6, 2013 by mannc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jkgobills Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 LOL, think lack of depth is bad here? The Jaguars are using ball boys as wide receivers... http://fansided.com/2013/09/27/jacksonville-jaguars-using-ball-boys-wide-receivers-scout-team/ Seriously though, I don't get all of the sudden frustration and outrage regarding the backup QB. Maybe I missed it, but I didn't see one person up in arms about Tuel being our backup before the Manuel injury. The hand wringing this week on this board has been so over the top. I've see nothing yet that signals the Bills are not on the same track as they were in the mid-eighties. IMO, if not for a the key injuries to Gilmore and Manuel, they'd be 4-1. As Bills fans I would hope that more fans would see this. I can understand the national media not bothering to look just below the surface, but I'm extremely excited for the future of this team. Once healthy, I think they are shaping up to be a Pittsburgh Steelers type of team. Strong defense, big/strong/athletic/opportunistic QB, and a great running game. I can't wait till the last seven games when the team is at full strength and we can see what we really have going on. FWIW I didn't post that I thought it was a bad idea to have an undrafted rookie free agent QB backing up a rookie QB. I thought that was obvious enough that it didn't merit a post. I agree with your point that this is the best the organization has looked during its' 13 year rebuild process. A comparison to the state of the team in the mid eighties is a good one. If our team is following the "Pittsburgh Way" I will be very happy. I also agree with the "Big Ben" comparison for EJ in regards to physical attributes (although my guess is that EJ has significantly higher intelligence than Ben). BUT, injuries happen to every team, every year. I understand that the is a "start over" year for the Bills. As such the depth is awful (not Jax awful though LOL). My hope is that the new regime will be better at understanding what players to retain, and who to let walk than the previous several regimes. That will be the Bills path to victories when injuries occur next year, they have to be able to win some games when they are playing "the next man up". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsMagic1 Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 When the Pats brought in Brady for Bledsoe injury they also had 4 QBs on roster at that time i believe. we have just tuel? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 (edited) Didn't read all three pages. Just looked like OP forgot about the guy named Kolb. Re: Kolb--lol at all the people who NOW say that Fitz was better. Kolb for Fitz was a push. Always was. A durable guy who threw for 25 TD's the past two seasons versus a guy who was always hurt and had never even thrown 10 TD's in a season? Not even close to a push. His lousy play, his glass chin, his being traded for a high pick and his getting a huge contract..........these are the reasons why Kolb was the laughingstock QB of the entire NFL. And the Bills brought him in here knowing he may well have to play. It doesn't matter in what capacity.......Kolb has no business in the NFL. If Buddy wasn't anxious to swing a trade for Josh Freeman......getting sucked into that Deadspin cell phone fiasco.....perhaps Fitz is still here and Manuels gimpy knees would have been properly insured. Edited October 6, 2013 by BADOLBEELZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 A durable guy who threw for 25 TD's the past two seasons versus a guy who was always hurt and had never even thrown 10 TD's in a season? Not even close to a push. His lousy play, his glass chin, his being traded for a high pick and his getting a huge contract..........these are the reasons why Kolb was the laughingstock QB of the entire NFL. And the Bills brought him in here knowing he may well have to play. It doesn't matter in what capacity.......Kolb has no business in the NFL. If Buddy wasn't anxious to swing a trade for Josh Freeman......getting sucked into that Deadspin cell phone fiasco.....perhaps Fitz is still here and Manuels gimpy knees would have been properly insured. It was my understanding Fitz had no desire to stay in Buffalo unless he was to return to the team as the unquestioned starter under his current deal at the time...Once the Bills started asking him about re-doing the deal it was over... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 It was my understanding Fitz had no desire to stay in Buffalo unless he was to return to the team as the unquestioned starter under his current deal at the time...Once the Bills started asking him about re-doing the deal it was over... Fitz was reportedly upset by Nix comments to the Tampa Bay GM. The Bills were apparently trying to sell Fitz on the idea that he might still end up as the starter if he took the paycut and Nix inadvertently squashed that idea publicly in that phone call. I am not saying they needed to keep Fitz. Jackson would have made a cheap and adequate backup. The cutting of Jackson.....leaving the laughingstock QB of the entire NFL as the only veteran QB on the roster.........was inexcusably dumb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 Fitz was reportedly upset by Nix comments to the Tampa Bay GM. The Bills were apparently trying to sell Fitz on the idea that he might still end up as the starter if he took the paycut and Nix inadvertently squashed that idea publicly in that phone call. I am not saying they needed to keep Fitz. Jackson would have made a cheap and adequate backup. The cutting of Jackson.....leaving the laughingstock QB of the entire NFL as the only veteran QB on the roster.........was inexcusably dumb. Agreed...If nothing else they cut Jackson WAY to early...Tuel is a UDFA, and Kolb had been VERY injury prone in the past...They cut Jackson, then it's not even the 1st game into the preseason and Kolb is already out...Then EJ gets hurt, Kolb gets hurt again...Why they cut jackson when they did is a complete mystery...There was no good reason for it...They just resigned the guy 4 months prior... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 I know we paid Williams $100M, but why didn't we spend the other $20M that is available this year ?? -- if not on new players, extend existing players to free cap space up next year ? --- if not extensions, how about restructurings to free cap space up next year and year after ? -- again, it's playing with one hand tied behind your back -- can you win that way, of course, except, it's much harder Williams has been money well spent. He played at an All Pro type level in the past season and a half. He is an NFL DPOY candidate this year. I doubt he will stay on pace and get 23-24 sacks but he has been an absolute force against the pass and in run defense. Without him this team is probably winless because each game has been decided late and the offense has been feeble courtesy of a rookie QB, the special teams have been a negative and the defensive secondary has been comprised of nothing but players who had been disappointments in their career. This team has rode the pass rush all season. If it is great, they win. If it is less than dominant, they lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marv Levy Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 Dude I can't agree more! Name one other team that has an undrafted rookie qb as a #2.. We the fans should be furious! This organization is a joke. R Johnson in, D Flutie out was the turning point. LOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ny33 Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 Actually the Redskins did last year with RG3, Kirk Cousins...but then Rex Grossman was #3. Tuel looked like he was crapping in his pants, he wasn't ready. The Bills need a vet. Kirk Cousins wasn't undrafted. He was a mid-round pick who has proved to be a quality backup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted October 6, 2013 Share Posted October 6, 2013 Kirk Cousins wasn't undrafted. He was a mid-round pick who has proved to be a quality backup. Exactly...Some Scouts thought Cousins would go higher than he actually did (#102 overall)...He also had a much, much, much better College career than Tuel... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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