DrDawkinstein Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 My opinion depends on the progress we make this year. If we don't finish with a winning record this year, with the roster we have, then the coaching staff needs to be changed... again. Which makes me depressed. Take a long, hard look at the Miami Dolphins Hard Knocks episodes this year, and re-think if you believe turning over the coaching staff so quickly is a good idea. I understand your frustration, but the alternative can be much worse. Especially without stating who your better option for a HC is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) I prefer Vince Young to any QB is next years draft, Buffalo will draft no higher then mid round. Also, a rookie QB will delay the team another 2 years This whole delay the team 2 years w rookie qb is old hat.......................Cam newton took 1 qtr to prove he's 10x the qb fitz will ever be..........Dalton, Luck, Tannenhill, Cousins, Mallett, RG3, all look pretty impressive. Its time to get a real qb as that is what this league is all about. I am giving Fitz 4 weeks to prove he learned something this offseason with david lee..............but i doubt it really......he is what he is. Edited August 24, 2012 by Ryan L Billz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmur66 Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) I think there is now a solid core of players to build a team around. They basically started with nobody 3 years ago. All of the dead wood has been trimmed. Could still use a stud middle linebacker and reciever. Maybe some tight end depth. If they can keep their own and upgrade these areas next year I think the sky is the limit. I expect them to make some noise this year. How much noise is yet to be heard. There is alot on Fitz's shoulders this year and he needs to step up. Edited August 24, 2012 by bmur66 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffBill Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 As a fan I think the Bills are rebuilding until the point they end a season with a winning record. That would show progression. The Patriots won't be on top forever. Reigns at the top are cyclical events. Rebuilding is an inevitable component for any team. It's at that point I want to see the Bills ready to start their own reign of supremacy of the division and I think they are on schedule. I think any team in the NFL should have the goal of winning the Super Bowl, so until that is accomplished they should always be rebuilding and trying to improve. If Nix thinks there is a QB worth taking he will. Up till now we had bigger holes to fill. Look at the Rams. They draft Bradford and they still suck. The best way to ruin a rookie QB is start him on a terrible team. PTR The Rams didn't suck because of Bradford though, that line was pathetic. Put Bradford on a good team and you have a Pro Bowler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeHateMe Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 I prefer Vince Young to any QB is next years draft, Buffalo will draft no higher then mid round. Also, a rookie QB will delay the team another 2 years Wrong in so many ways. You would seriously take VY over Matt Barkley? Fitz / VY are not winning any Superbowls anytime soon. You absolutely need to find a QB that can turn this franchise around. First round RBs and CBs are not going to do it. (although Stephon wasn't a bad choice) You can always trade up to get your guy, which is what Washington did for RGIII. They realized what Buffalo still hasn't. You build a winner starting with your franchise QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 I think any team in the NFL should have the goal of winning the Super Bowl, so until that is accomplished they should always be rebuilding and trying to improve. The Rams didn't suck because of Bradford though, that line was pathetic. Put Bradford on a good team and you have a Pro Bowler. You just made my point. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Take a long, hard look at the Miami Dolphins Hard Knocks episodes this year, and re-think if you believe turning over the coaching staff so quickly is a good idea. I understand your frustration, but the alternative can be much worse. Especially without stating who your better option for a HC is. I don't necessarily think it's a "good idea". Certainly not *right now*. But if we play the same as last year, with an improved roster, what else is there? Our record should be better this year unless half our team ends up on IR again. It's really a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. You either stick with coaches you know will fail you, or take a chance on someone new, who most likely will fail you, but maybe won't. That all being said, I'm hoping/expecting us to do better this season, and that this discussion will be proven moot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSE Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) Wrong in so many ways. You would seriously take VY over Matt Barkley? Fitz / VY are not winning any Superbowls anytime soon. You absolutely need to find a QB that can turn this franchise around. First round RBs and CBs are not going to do it. (although Stephon wasn't a bad choice) You can always trade up to get your guy, which is what Washington did for RGIII. They realized what Buffalo still hasn't. You build a winner starting with your franchise QB. Vince Young is the starter and Fitz is the perfect backup. Give it time.... Edited August 24, 2012 by HOUSE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) Vince Young is the starter and Fitz is the perfect backup. Give it time.... I have seen nothing in VYs entire career to date that leads me to your conclusion. He is better than Thigpen which puts him on the 53 man roster, but being better than Thigpen isn't saying much. Edited August 24, 2012 by CodeMonkey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsBiker Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Good morning guys..... We have 2 different groups of fans and opinion here.... Group #1 Yes, the rebuilding project is over. Buddy Nix had 3 years, The Bills still have all their 2013 draft picks and haven't made a trade in years..... If the Bills have flaws, fill them NOW.........win or see ya! Group #2 No, The rebuilding project is NOT Over, we still have holes to fill. Another draft or two should fix the team. I am defiantly in group #1 , make all the excuses you want. Buddy picked his quarterback and paid him well. He made his roster choices and the fans have been patient. Lets see what you got Buddy. We dont know till this season on how we did... but untill we have a superbowl the rebuilding shall never end!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris heff Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Don't get "haters" confused with "doubters". I root for Fitz every sunday and have met him and he seems like a great down to earth guy who after going to camp for years and years is probably the best I have seen with the fans. Do I think he is the long term answer at QB-No I don't, but I don't hate him by any stretch. A big difference at least for some of us. Perhaps "hater" is too strong but at least in your case "doubter" would also be incorrect, in that you have stated that the Bills need a franchise QB. That would indicate that you have no doubt that Fitz is not. I on the other hand am a doubter. I hope he is the guy but then again he may not be. Which ever is the case, where we agree, come next spring the Bills need to take long hard looks at young QBs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Vince Young is the starter and Fitz is the perfect backup. Give it time.... Maybe my sarcasm meter needs a new battery, but neither is the answer. Fitz a backup at 9 mil a year? VY a starter? Gailey has shown his hand that there clearly is no plan B on the roster. and if Fitz craps the bed this year, it could end Gailey's head coaching career on any other team. I am a VY fan and support Fitz as a starter. But history tells us it could get real ugly fast. While getting to 10-6 would be a good season (for the Bills) neither could take the team to the point of finally building a trophy case for a Lombardi. This team needs a young viable quarterback in the draft preferebly a first rounder. I seem to remember a lot of people laughing at Myami "reaching" for Tanny, he holds out for awhile, and the kid ends up a starter. Of course his career is yet TBD. The rebuilding is not over, we need receivers, lbackers, others YTBD. and most importantly a quarterback. And if the team sucks this year I can already hear ralph saying yet again to "be patient". Or a new one it's a "5 year plan". Because Nix and Gailey aren't going anywhere until Ralph passes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Wrong in so many ways. You would seriously take VY over Matt Barkley? Fitz / VY are not winning any Superbowls anytime soon. You absolutely need to find a QB that can turn this franchise around. First round RBs and CBs are not going to do it. (although Stephon wasn't a bad choice) You can always trade up to get your guy, which is what Washington did for RGIII. They realized what Buffalo still hasn't. You build a winner starting with your franchise QB. Disagree. They mortgaged their entire future before they had enough talent around him. The Bills have been building where it counts, and if everything works out, could be in a position to trade away most of their picks to move up and get the QB they want, without having to worry about too many other holes that need to be filled. I think the point that we can both agree on is that at some point, when rebuilding a franchise, you have to go "all in" on drafting the QB of the future. Additionally, if there had been a franchise QB available when we picked, we would have taken him. Example: Cam Newton in 2011. Had he still been there at #3, you would have seen the Bills sprinting to hand that pick in. There simply was no other QB worth the #3 overall pick, and we needed DL help. Not worth trading down to get a 2nd rate QB (yes even Dalton). When rebuilding, you need to add the highest level of talent, wherever that may be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSE Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 I have seen nothing in VYs entire career to date that leads me to your conclusion. He is better than Thigpen which puts him on the 53 man roster, but being better than Thigpen isn't saying much. What is he as a starter 31-19 ? What is Fitzpatrick again, I forget Just saying Maybe my sarcasm meter needs a new battery, but neither is the answer. Fitz a backup at 9 mil a year? VY a starter? Gailey has shown his hand that there clearly is no plan B on the roster. and if Fitz craps the bed this year, it could end Gailey's head coaching career on any other team. I am a VY fan and support Fitz as a starter. But history tells us it could get real ugly fast. While getting to 10-6 would be a good season (for the Bills) neither could take the team to the point of finally building a trophy case for a Lombardi. This team needs a young viable quarterback in the draft preferebly a first rounder. I seem to remember a lot of people laughing at Myami "reaching" for Tanny, he holds out for awhile, and the kid ends up a starter. Of course his career is yet TBD. The rebuilding is not over, we need receivers, lbackers, others YTBD. and most importantly a quarterback. And if the team sucks this year I can already hear ralph saying yet again to "be patient". Or a new one it's a "5 year plan". Because Nix and Gailey aren't going anywhere until Ralph passes. Your sarcasm meter is working fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhitewalkerInPhilly Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Group 2. Now, don't get me wrong. I love the improvement that we're showing. I do think playoffs are a real hope now. But there is a difference between a team which is in the playoff hunt like us, and the teams who are expected to be elite and vie for the Superbowl (the Pats, 49ers and Packers) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSE Posted August 24, 2012 Author Share Posted August 24, 2012 Group 2. Now, don't get me wrong. I love the improvement that we're showing. I do think playoffs are a real hope now. But there is a difference between a team which is in the playoff hunt like us, and the teams who are expected to be elite and vie for the Superbowl (the Pats, 49ers and Packers) Depressing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhitewalkerInPhilly Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Depressing Realistic. Even if things go great, I would still like us to upgrade our LB and WR corps. But if our D line is the real deal (K. Williams and Dareus are looking like beasts), our young CB corps matures over the next year and we get a solid lock on a #2 WR as the season goes on I think we have something more important than a winning season this year: winning seasons for the next three years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 Vince is a nervous breakdown waiting to happen Smart move handing him the reigns Tim Tebow just wins ... hand him the job too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luxy312 Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 If you look at what will likely be the roster at the start of this season and dial back 4 years, you will see about 50% turnover. Almost a third of the guys on the team were drafted last year or this year. While I would concur that every team should always be looking to improve, we've seen an unprecedented "rebuilding" of this team. Most teams that find themselves in the playoffs consistently have a nucleus of players that get the job done to which they might add a piece here or there. Regarding VY, I really don't get his addition. He adds nothing to the roster other than the fact that Thigpen is just bad. His completion percentage and QB rating is below Fitzpatrick. He has 58 touchdowns in his career to 72 turnovers for -14. Fitzpatrick is only slightly better with 73 touchdowns to 81 turnovers for -8. Sure, Vince could run, but he is borderline special ed. One other thing. Wins and losses are a function of TEAMS. Pulling out that metric is really stupid and doesn't address the players individual contribution to the game. Just take the two years that the Titans made the playoffs with Vince Young. Top-5 defense one year and top-10 the other year. They didn't win games BECAUSE of Young, but despite him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CodeMonkey Posted August 24, 2012 Share Posted August 24, 2012 (edited) What is he as a starter 31-19 ? What is Fitzpatrick again, I forget Just saying As they played for two very different teams up until now that really isn't a great barometer. Watching them both in camp and in the preseason games so far VJ has impressed me with his running ability and raw arm strength and nothing else. I don't think Fitz (as much as I like him) is the long term solution either mind you, but VJ thus far has shown me almost nothing. Edited August 24, 2012 by CodeMonkey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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