Russell Wilson to start Friday

[#34fan]

I'll answer all three of you simultaneously.

 

"TJ Graham's biggest asset is his ability to stretch defenses."

 

What a yawner. If you knew how ridiculously cliched and overused that statement is you'd be ashamed to use it.

 

"Kinda like how you already put Wilson there and know that TJ will be a bust? How about we let them play some games first."

 

We don't know how good Wilson will be, but right now both he and Cousins, both available in the mid-3rd, and I was actually thinking Cousins even more, who was a rated 2nd/3rd unlike Graham who no one had going until the late round if at all, are both playing well, much better than Graham in a position that is far more difficult to learn in the NFL. We more than likely easily could have had Graham in the 4th, maybe even 5th or 6th.

 

Otherwise no, we don't need to play any games to see how good Graham's going to be any more than we needed to see any to have realized that Hardy was a bust. Players like Graham are one-dimensional. All they bring is speed, and if you're not new to football, then you realize how little speed in and of itself translates to the NFL. (Clue: See CJ Spiller, the "blindingly fast RB" from GT)

 

Otherwise, if Graham's so lightning fast, then what happened in college where he averaged a paltry 14.6 yards per catch over four years and had a total of 1,430 yards receiving total in four seasons?

 

Are we supposed to believe that his speed did little for him in college, otherwise why the pathetically pedestrian average, but now at the pro level he's going to shake all that and beat players that he didn't beat in college?

 

Have you looked at his game logs and asked yourself why he flunked in spades against the best (meaning really just above average) defenses in his own conference? Just asking because it doesn't seem like it.

 

Anyway, so what we're supposed to believe now is that he couldn't get that done in college, against guys that didn't even get drafted, but that he's mysteriously going to get it done against the best that are in the NFL now? Because what I'm seeing is that of the 29 CBs drafted this year, he didn't have a good game against any one of those teams. Not that they would have assigned their best CB to him if he had.

 

So while you say that I have "strong opinions," if you mean strongly researched, yes, I fully agree.

 

I would argue that your opinions are all equally strong, yet without any evidence, since there is almost none given that players like him come and go like the leaves on the trees every season.

 

Graham won't even be on this team in three seasons. It was a wasted 3rd round pick. He brings nothing but speed and he's a project in that way otherwise. I wouldn't be surprised if he's released before next season.

 

Otherwise, we needed a QB, ... unless you're one of those people that actually believes Gailey, Mr. 10-22. LOL If Gailey were coaching the Browns you would all be laughing at him and his statements.

 

BA-ZING!

 

Couldn't agree more. T.J. may turn out to be good, but he has nowhere near the body of work amassed by Wilson and Cousins.

 

Watching those two square off twice last college season was a real treat! I prefer Wilson, but I'd be lying if I said Cousins didn't show some MAJOR upside.

[Herb62]

I said we should have taken Russell in round three ad cought a lot of flack for this, however, I do see now what they saw in TJ, my point was I thought at the very least Willson is your legit back-up and change of pace wild cat QB with his great speed, at best he is the next Drew Brees 1/2 inch shorter (we need to wait and see on both these guys)

[Thirty Year Fan]

I said we should have taken Russell in round three ad cought a lot of flack for this, however, I do see now what they saw in TJ, my point was I thought at the very least Willson is your legit back-up and change of pace wild cat QB with his great speed, at best he is the next Drew Brees 1/2 inch shorter (we need to wait and see on both these guys)

Great statement could not agree more.

[sllib olaffub]

I'll go on record here as saying Wilson was my greatest sleeper pick in this draft, relative to the potential he has, IMO. I know he is short - however, he played behind a massive O-line in college. When it comes to arm strength, he's got it. Speed - he's got it real good. Accuracy - he's on. If he were two inches taller, he'd of been a top 15 pick. The real debate about Russel Wilson should come down to just that - will his height stop him from utilizing his skills?

 

I say, for a team in need of a long term QB, who wasn't going to spend a high round pick on one - what better option? What are the Bills waiting for? I mean, the risk reward ratio here was so in favor of drafting him! When it comes to what the Bills are thinking - I can only guess this: Nix seems very much like he favors traditional type players - we've seen, in his time here, the kinds of players filling up this roster that we used to envy on other teams. Big, fast, strong. So, it seems like they were going all in with Fitz this year, with the obvious intention and acknowledgment that it is a prove-it year. If he fails, I see them having no other choice than to make every move possible next offseason to secure the top QB available.

 

My issue with all this is - in a case like Wilson's, when Buffalo already was going into a season with a QB, they could've only risked a 3rd round pick, and if Fitz failed, they'd of had a QB that gave them some leverage in the 2013 draft. As it is now, if Fitz fails, they'll be so obviously in need of a QB, any team ahead of them can demand just about anything it wants. Unless they think Young can be a future star here. I just doubt them counting on either - and so it seems Nix has really left himself open here to real vulnerability if Fitz fails to succeed.

[NoSaint]

 

 

BA-ZING!

 

Couldn't agree more. T.J. may turn out to be good, but he has nowhere near the body of work amassed by Wilson and Cousins.

 

Watching those two square off twice last college season was a real treat! I prefer Wilson, but I'd be lying if I said Cousins didn't show some MAJOR upside.

 

And yet the overwhelming odds are that one becomes a journeyman backup that gets a couple chances here and there, while the other never even gets that far. The 10th best qb in college football is a treat to watch in college but 95% of the time a tease at best in the nfl

[biglukes]

So what happens if Wilson falls on his face this week? I like Wilson, but holy crap some people are getting carried away here.

 

 

 

I'll answer all three of you simultaneously.

 

"TJ Graham's biggest asset is his ability to stretch defenses."

 

What a yawner. If you knew how ridiculously cliched and overused that statement is you'd be ashamed to use it.

 

"Kinda like how you already put Wilson there and know that TJ will be a bust? How about we let them play some games first."

 

We don't know how good Wilson will be, but right now both he and Cousins, both available in the mid-3rd, and I was actually thinking Cousins even more, who was a rated 2nd/3rd unlike Graham who no one had going until the late round if at all, are both playing well, much better than Graham in a position that is far more difficult to learn in the NFL. We more than likely easily could have had Graham in the 4th, maybe even 5th or 6th.

 

Otherwise no, we don't need to play any games to see how good Graham's going to be any more than we needed to see any to have realized that Hardy was a bust. Players like Graham are one-dimensional. All they bring is speed, and if you're not new to football, then you realize how little speed in and of itself translates to the NFL. (Clue: See CJ Spiller, the "blindingly fast RB" from GT)

 

Otherwise, if Graham's so lightning fast, then what happened in college where he averaged a paltry 14.6 yards per catch over four years and had a total of 1,430 yards receiving total in four seasons?

 

Are we supposed to believe that his speed did little for him in college, otherwise why the pathetically pedestrian average, but now at the pro level he's going to shake all that and beat players that he didn't beat in college?

 

Have you looked at his game logs and asked yourself why he flunked in spades against the best (meaning really just above average) defenses in his own conference? Just asking because it doesn't seem like it.

 

Anyway, so what we're supposed to believe now is that he couldn't get that done in college, against guys that didn't even get drafted, but that he's mysteriously going to get it done against the best that are in the NFL now? Because what I'm seeing is that of the 29 CBs drafted this year, he didn't have a good game against any one of those teams. Not that they would have assigned their best CB to him if he had.

 

So while you say that I have "strong opinions," if you mean strongly researched, yes, I fully agree.

 

I would argue that your opinions are all equally strong, yet without any evidence, since there is almost none given that players like him come and go like the leaves on the trees every season.

 

Graham won't even be on this team in three seasons. It was a wasted 3rd round pick. He brings nothing but speed and he's a project in that way otherwise. I wouldn't be surprised if he's released before next season.

 

Otherwise, we needed a QB, ... unless you're one of those people that actually believes Gailey, Mr. 10-22. LOL If Gailey were coaching the Browns you would all be laughing at him and his statements.

 

This is far too long and stupid to bother really addressing. Yes psychic, you know how Graham will turn out before he ever plays a game, and he'll be cut soon, and will never make. It'd be funny if you didn't sound like you actually believed this crap.

 

Edited August 23, 2012 by biglukes

[FastFreddy22]

It is still preseason, he hasn't taken a snap in a real football game yet... Neither has TJ.. There is nothing that we can compare at this point.

 

Bout time we've seen a post out of this guy

[thebug]

I think Wilson is going to be good, but that doesn't mean TJ won't.

[K-9]

So what happens if Wilson falls on his face this week? I like Wilson, but holy crap some people are getting carried away here.

 

 

 

This is far too long and stupid to bother really addressing. Yes psychic, you know how Graham will turn out before he ever plays a game, and he'll be cut soon, and will never make. It'd be funny if you didn't sound like you actually believed this crap.

 

12.6 ypc

11.5 ypc

15.4 ypc

14.2 ypc

15.4 ypc

 

Those were the yards per catch last season of the top five WRs selected in the draft (Blackmon, Floyd, Wright, Jenkins, and Quick). Graham's was 16.5 ypc last season. That and his career 14.6 ypc looks pretty damn good in that company.

 

Anyway, I agree whole-heartedly about that post. It shows a staggering lack of insight into the game in general and WRs in particular.

 

Nothing wrong with seeing the potential in Russel Wilson and hoping he turns into an HOF QB. But you don't have to denigrate another player in the process. But he doesn't stop with Graham. He manages to get his usual gratuitous shot at Spiller and Gailey as well.

 

TaskersGhost is a troll and not worth the time or effort to respond to this latest crock of crap.

 

GO BILLS!!!

Edited August 23, 2012 by K-9

[vincec]

 

 

I'm not saying late-round QB's never make it; only that it's rare.

 

Examples:

 

2008: 9 QB's drafted after round 2-- potentially 1 will start (Matt Flynn in Seattle)

2009: 8 QB's drafted after round 2--none of them starting

2010: 12 QB's drafted after round 2--potentially 1 will start (John Skelton in Arizona)

2011: 6 QB's drafted after round 2--none of them starting

 

In sum, over the last 4 years, you've seen 35 QB's drafted in the 3rd round or lower. From that group, you have, at most, two marginal starting QB's--both of whom are in neck-and-neck QB competitions.

Strange that no one bothers to respond to the most informative post in this thread. Perhaps there's nothing you can say against the facts. History indicates that Wilson is a longshot. He may work out and I may hit the lottery, but I wouldn't bet on it and I certainly can't fault the Bills for not doing so.

[djp14150]

Looks like Russell Wilson is going to win the starting QB job in Seattle , I believe we did make a huge mistake not grapping him in the 3rd round. I think he will be in the Doug Fluite mold (winner) with a stronger arm and 2 inchs taller.

I do like Fritz but did we see his ceiling last year in the spread 3 and 5 step drop short crossing routes?

Let's hope not.

 

Go Bills and go Fitz deep to TJ!

 

I live in the Seattle market so I know a tad more about this than most of you....

 

Russell Wilson will not start the season.

 

The coach does want to see how he can handle playing against the first team defense before week 4 rest period where many starters appear to sit out.

 

They travel to arizona then host dallas and green bay. a difficult start for them. Flynns experience with pro defenses will benefit.

 

Flynn has played fine in the preseason given the fact that the starting group of WR/TE have been injured and not playing.

[Malazan]

I live in the Seattle market so I know a tad more about this than most of you....

 

Russell Wilson will not start the season.

 

The coach does want to see how he can handle playing against the first team defense before week 4 rest period where many starters appear to sit out.

 

They travel to arizona then host dallas and green bay. a difficult start for them. Flynns experience with pro defenses will benefit.

 

Flynn has played fine in the preseason given the fact that the starting group of WR/TE have been injured and not playing.

 

pffft, we all know Wilson is going to start. You don't sit the greatest QB of all time. He hasn't even thrown an NFL pass and is already the greatest. You'd be dumb to sit him.

[NoSaint]

 

 

pffft, we all know Wilson is going to start. You don't sit the greatest QB of all time. He hasn't even thrown an NFL pass and is already the greatest. You'd be dumb to sit him.

 

The kid was drafted!

 

He's never thrown a pick!

 

No incompletions!

 

You ever seen him sacked in an nfl game? Nope.

 

Undefeated.

 

And will be allowed to scrimmage with some starters!

 

That's proof I should be a gm.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

One subtext to this discussion is Vince Young.

 

One's view of Young would have a lot to do with that same person's view of the Bills quarterback situation.

[ajzepp]

I'm not saying late-round QB's never make it; only that it's rare.

 

Examples:

 

2008: 9 QB's drafted after round 2-- potentially 1 will start (Matt Flynn in Seattle)

2009: 8 QB's drafted after round 2--none of them starting

2010: 12 QB's drafted after round 2--potentially 1 will start (John Skelton in Arizona)

2011: 6 QB's drafted after round 2--none of them starting

 

In sum, over the last 4 years, you've seen 35 QB's drafted in the 3rd round or lower. From that group, you have, at most, two marginal starting QB's--both of whom are in neck-and-neck QB competitions.

 

The thing about Wilson, though, is that it was pretty obvious that he has a first round brain, first round motivation, first round arm, first round accuracy, first round success as a starter, etc, etc, etc. The only knock was his height. Hindsight is 20/20, but considering all of his strengths and the fact that QBs have gone earlier than projected the last couple of drafts, the Bills really should have taken a shot with their 3rd pick. During the Gruden interview, this guy was not only able to talk about the system he ran at Wisconsin, but he was able to discuss in specific detail the system he ran at NC State (or wherever he went before Wisconsin). I'm sorry, but take away the height thing and you just don't get kids who are THIS solid in so many areas coming down the line very often.

 

It just seemed pretty obvious that he was going to become a significant player in this league, and he's already starting to show flashes. Maybe he'll end up being another failed QB, but I HIGHLY doubt it.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

To add to what AJ just wrote, several scouts made statements to the effect that "if Wilson was 2 inches taller, he'd be a top 5 pick."

 

It can be argued that the publicity surrounding Wilson's strong preseason is unwarranted and premature.

 

It can also be argued that some fans are being overly dismissive of him simply due to ingrained and dogmatic attitudes towards shorter quarterbacks.

[reddogblitz]

I live in the Seattle market so I know a tad more about this than most of you....

 

Russell Wilson will not start the season.

I live in the area as well as I don't think Russell will be the starter come 9/9 either. Pete Carrol is a nut. Just because conventional wisdom says your 3rd pre season game starter will be the starter doesn't mean Pete Carrol will do that. As I see it shaking out, it's Flynn and Wilson on the roster and Tarvaris as trade bait/waiver wire bait.

 

But then again Peter Carrol is nutty enough to start a rookie over a vet who set the Packers franchise record for most TDs in one game less than 9 months ago.

[ThurmasThoman]

for what it's worth, this man right here does not look like someone who is going to come to buffalo in april, learn gailey's offense by september, and lead the bills to the super bowl.

 

so the vaunted 7-9 seahawks, with a college flunkie for a head coach, made him their starter?

 

can you hear my tears hitting the keyboard from where youre sitting?

[Ronin]

I don't want to think about this because Wilson is a guy I wanted on this team.

 

Tough to say with draft picks, some work out and some don't, but it sure seems like with the new passing favorable rules that rookie QBs have it a little bit easier.

 

It's easy to sit here and say in hindsight that we should have grabbed this or that player, but they're all risks to some extent.

 

Like you, I wouldn't have minded at all taking Cousins or Wilson, either one, in round 3, where they wouldn't have been a big risk, but my point is that we've seen receivers like Graham come and go routinely without ever making any impact whatsoever.

 

There's more reason for the Pats to be excited over Demps who did a lot more at Florida than Graham did at NC State, but no one's making any bold predictions about that, which is somewhat amazing because it's the Pats and whenever Belichick picks his nose the media's there to see what carat size the diamond that comes out will be.

 

To me though, ultimately it's just poor planning. We know that Young and Thigpen, or Smith, aren't the answer at QB, and we also know that Fitzpatrick isn't. Which leaves the cupboard bare at the most important position for the future. At least with a Cousins or Wilson on the roster there's some hope and a chance of something for the future.

 

As it now stands we'll probably grab some other backup reject for the next few years after this season. Oh how exciting and encouraging.

Edited August 23, 2012 by TaskersGhost

[Ronin]

Drafting a QB in the 3rd round is usually a waste. In the 3rd, you can get a legit position player starter at almost any position. But by the 3rd, the odds of getting a starting QB go way down, unless you magically win the lottery (e.g., Brady).

 

The odds of guys like Mallett, Cousins, and Wilson becoming star QB's ever is pretty slim, IMO. The odds of TJ Graham being a starting slot receiver for this team within the next 2 years are pretty good.

 

Brady was a 6th.

 

I agree somewhat on the 3rd round QB thing, but not nearly to the extent that you do. We'll see on those three as well.

 

I completely disagree with you on Graham. There is no reason whatsoever to believe that he has a chance to become anything more than a 4th or 5th WR role player, and even then, he's got a few obstacles to overcome to even prove himself worth having around in that way.

 

Again, the number of fast players that come into the NFL with limited or often no other skils, is very high and the odds of success so very low.

 

And what do you mean by slot receiver? His sole asset is speed, that's not where you put a speed guy, in the slot, you line him up on the outside and send him flying and hope that your QB has the time, arm, and timing to get him the ball in stride, otherwise that speed advantage is neutralized. This isn't a 7-step drop OL either. That's why Fitzpatrick had near the bottom yards per attempt and completion last season, because just like it was for Holcomb and Edwards, and largely because of the OL, they had to create an offense designed around 3 and 5 step drops so that Fitzpatrick would have time to throw.

 

If Graham ends up a starter, talk about long shots. Yikes. At NC State Graham had more than about 300 yards receiving in only one of four seasons and even then he had a very pedestrian 757 yards, most of which were against South Alabama, Cincinnati, Louisville, and Wake Forest. That's hardly impressive and now he's set to become a starting NFL WR? You may want to rethink that.