Hapless Bills Fan Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 OK, I hear a bunch of chatter about how if Merriman is healthy, he should just play linebacker and be on the field every play. Surely he'd be a better player than Morrison? Maybe. Or maybe not. The missing factor seems to be understanding of the SAM lb role in the 4-3. Let's take a little look under the hood, from sources as basic as Wiki "The outside linebacker (OLB) is usually responsible for outside containment. This includes the strongside and weakside designations below. The "Sam" <...>usually lines up across from the tight end. Often the strongside linebacker will be called upon to tackle the running back on a play, because the back will be following the tight end's block. He is most often the strongest linebacker; at the least he possesses the ability to withstand, shed, and fight off blocks from a tight end or fullback blocking the backside of a pass play. The linebacker should also have strong safety abilities in pass situation to cover the tight end in man on man situations. He should also have considerable quickness to read and get into coverage in zone situations." So. Contain. Tackle the running back. Strong safety abilities, read and drop into coverage. Now granted, this is basic, but basic is another word for fundamental. Let's not forget fundamentals, it's what got the Bills into trouble years past. Merriman is a baller, no doubt. IMO our run defense fell off badly when he left. But where, in that description, do you see "rush the QB" as an important duty of a 4-3 LB? You don't. Now let's go look at a fundamental description of the role of a 4-3 end: "The defensive end's primary role in the 4–3 defense is to get to the quarterback and create pressure." Do you guys really think it's the best use of Merriman to be trying to drop into coverage and tackle the ball carrier? It might be the best thing for the team - if he proves to be better at it than Morrison - but it isn't what he was known for "back in the day" Maybe I just have a twitch on this topic: I have the uneasy feeling that those talking about how Merriman could play OLB for the Bills if he's healthy, may not be thinking about or understanding the fundamental roles of DE-OLB in a 4-3 D. Now granted, there are all sorts of variations on the basic concepts that may be employed. But fundamentally, play after play, it's the job of the 4-3 DE to get into the backfield and disrupt plays, and it's the job of the 4-3 OLB to contain, stop the run, and cover. And frankly, I hope we aren't going to be too cute and varied in roles on Wannstache's D. Because I think that's a big part of what was wrong with Edwards the DC's schemes: too complicated, required players to think too much instead of just flying around and attacking. When the Texans went from the NFLbasement to the NFL penthouse in one year on D with Wade Phillips installed as DC, I can't count the number of player interviews where "simplifying" the defense was cited as a significant factor. So, please guys. Let's not be rolling on about how Merriman (or any other D player) would make a great OLB (is, or would make a great X), without considering the fundamental role of the 4-3 OLB. The role of a 3-4 OLB (Merriman's previous success) is much better mapped to a 4-3 DE than a 4-3 OLB. If we have great depth at DE and are rotating players in and out all the time, that's just to our benefit - it means the guys can attack full-go and not need to catch their breath against a quick strike offense like NE"s no-huddle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I agree. but i will say, for the texans adding talent was also huuuuuge. that teams secondary was.... awful... in 2010. no doubt scheme helped, but i cant overstate how bad the secondary play was in 2010. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy10 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Also the All-World QB in Texas' division was replaced with a rotating cast of seniors. Of both the "high school" and "citizen" varieties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 (edited) Also the All-World QB in Texas' division was replaced with a rotating cast of seniors. Of both the "high school" and "citizen" varieties. that, and i believe i saw (once upon a time, so it might not be 100% accurate in memory, but something along the lines of....) they were the worst tacklers in the league with a huge percentage of plays having missed tackles. so not only did they get beat a lot, but when they did keep the play in front of them the guy still often took it to the house. when you struggle getting beat over the top AND underneath.... things are going to be obviously ugly. the few games i saw from that seconadary were brutal. Edited July 9, 2012 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FleaMoulds80 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Great another Merriman topic. I think this is being discussed in another thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 The only situations I think Merriman could play a role as a 4-3 OLB is on sure fire running plays and in situations where he's asked to blitz. Obvious to most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 The only situations I think Merriman could play a role as a 4-3 OLB is on sure fire running plays and in situations where he's asked to blitz. Obvious to most. as a 34 olb, odds are hes run in coverage some and is more serviceable than given credit for, but it just doesnt make sense to so greatly ignore playing to his strengths (moving forward, not back) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Sending out the Jboyst-signal ::Cow shadow in the sky:: So, please guys. Let's not be rolling on about how Merriman (or any other D player) would make a great OLB (is, or would make a great X), without considering the fundamental role of the 4-3 OLB. The role of a 3-4 OLB (Merriman's previous success) is much better mapped to a 4-3 DE than a 4-3 OLB. If we have great depth at DE and are rotating players in and out all the time, that's just to our benefit - it means the guys can attack full-go and not need to catch their breath against a quick strike offense like NE"s no-huddle. Excellent, informative post, Hopeful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorkington Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I think we should put 7 pass rushers in the box for every play. That'll do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I think we should put 7 pass rushers in the box for every play. That'll do it. That's honestly not a horrible idea, especially depending on who we are playing. Heck, I remember a game against Dallas where Bill Parcells knew how slow Bledsoe was, and he rushed 10 (that's right, 10!) on a few plays, leaving 1 safety back in coverage. They got a sack on every play they tried it, iirc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I think we should put 7 pass rushers in the box for every play. That'll do it. Well, if three of our DLmen require two offensive players to adequately block them on many plays, then it's like having 7 pass rushers. I submit that's the case with MW, MD, and KW at the very least. Four if Merriman is healthy and it's a damn shame for an OC if he thinks MA is the weak link. I know that's a very elementary viewpoint, but DAMN! I hope our secondary doesn't get bored out there. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Miner Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Well, if three of our DLmen require two offensive players to adequately block them on many plays, then it's like having 7 pass rushers. I submit that's the case with MW, MD, and KW at the very least. Four if Merriman is healthy and it's a damn shame for an OC if he thinks MA is the weak link. I know that's a very elementary viewpoint, but DAMN! I hope our secondary doesn't get bored out there. GO BILLS!!! Why would they get bored? There should be tons of opportunities to get a pick 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Why would they get bored? There should be tons of opportunities to get a pick 6. Yeah, you're right. I guess I was thinking how hard it is for opposing QBs to throw INTs from the prone position. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Hopeful, will you marry me? DrD can be best man. Whoever above said this is being discussedalready....no. no its not. There is a basic or fundamental lack of knowledge about the LB position. I blame our 90's teams when we had some pretty good LB's behind a very talented line with a top 10 NFL player of all time in Bruce Smith. Truth is I have never been too impressed as much as others by Merriman even in his best days. I was always in the point where I was like " Woah, just a lil bit more this guy will be among the best defenders in history...and it never panned out. Its hard for a pass rush specialist to do anything more then rush the passer because expectations are so great. In my case I expect more of him still. In many others they expect his level of play to be like it was no matter where he plays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owen Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 Does everyone think our defensive coordinator is going to play the 4/3 on all plays? Last year we switched it up with the 3/4 and 4/3 defenses. We will see it again this year with Merriman being the rusher in the 3/4 defense... He is just too good to keep off the field ... I expect to see a lot of new wrinkes in the Bills Defense compared to last year and the same for the Offense... We have two very good coaches that will not stand pat with the kind of tallent on both sides of the Ball that Buddy Nix has provided.... We are in for a very good season with good coaching and a lot of good talent on this team... We may just go all the way.... just dreaming but it is possible... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
You herd it hear last Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 That's honestly not a horrible idea, especially depending on who we are playing. Heck, I remember a game against Dallas where Bill Parcells knew how slow Bledsoe was, and he rushed 10 (that's right, 10!) on a few plays, leaving 1 safety back in coverage. They got a sack on every play they tried it, iirc. draw play to FJ...touchdown!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cincinnati Kid Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 This is a good point. Playing the OLB in the 4-3 is extremely different than in a 3-4. 3-4 OLB is very similar to 4-3 end which is why Kelsey went to OLB and now back to DE. Merriman is very good at holding contain on the edge on running plays, and he is an excellent pass rusher. I do not think "Zone Cover Guy" or "I need that dude on Gronk!" when I think about Merriman. I want him getting after QBs and not messing around in the secondary. Let Morrison do that. It'll work out better for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
You herd it hear last Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 wilson, byrd, williams (x2), dareus, merriman...that's 6 playmakers on the field at once!!! (and finally some of the other guys are pretty good too) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted July 9, 2012 Author Share Posted July 9, 2012 Does everyone think our defensive coordinator is going to play the 4/3 on all plays? Last year we switched it up with the 3/4 and 4/3 defenses. This may be rhetorical but I'll answer it literally: except for nickel and dime, I hope so. Seriously. IMO a big flaw of last year's defense was that it was too complicated. We were playing a hybrid 3/4 and 4/3, where the players seemed to be expected to make pre-snap reads and change roles on the fly. I'd like to see us play a straightforward, relatively simple defense where we dominate based upon sheer athletic ability and skill, and nobody has to think too much on the field. Before we go switching every player around to learn 2 or 3 roles, let's just show we can be competent at one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted July 9, 2012 Share Posted July 9, 2012 I would seriously like for them to be put to use as a DE in a reserve role......would REALLY like to see Merriman make it through the season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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