Wayne Cubed Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 Seems to me that it would be much easier to change the way you set your feet to throw than it would be to, say, change your actual throwing motion like guys such as Tebow are trying to do. Seems like the likelihood of reverting back to your old ways would be much higher with the throwing than the setting of the feet on certain throws. Was just going to comment about this after reading through most of the responses. The article talks about fixing his footwork, doesn't really say anything about his throwing motion needing correcting ala Tim Tebow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 Ask Chad pennington how David lee helped him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 What's tough is turning that into second nature physically. It's tough to turn 30 years of slinging the rock into precision in just a few months. If he can, perhaps he has a shot at that late career spike, but its rare for a reason - its very hard. I don't doubt his will (though did he not see the issues? Why not seek help earlier?), so fingers crossed! I think the complication to the picture is that Fitz isn't been uniformly poor. Sometimes he can thread the needle, sometimes he throws these "WTF?" ducks. In that situation, it's probably not enough to just work with a QB coach. It's necessary to work with someone who is motivated and able to take the time to slice-n-dice a season or two's worth of film, to look for patterns. I'm not sure the Bills would be happy handing over two seasons of team film to someone not on the payroll? Fortunately, they have a good QB technician on the payroll now. Since Fitz doesn't have to rebuild everything from scratch, if he could just make 2-3 additional completions a game and eliminate some INTs, that would have a big impact on the team's success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 i wish there was some way to bring great shame to those that bring up kellys stats in comparison to fitz. just immense amounts of it. I Hear That, Saint. Among other things, in the early '90s, top-10 QB had 58% completions. 61-63% completions could lead the league. It's apples to kumquats, I'm sure that's one of your points. Let's just talk about Fitz, then. It's a significant change to improve completion percentage from 58% to 62%. It moved Fitz from 27th in the league in 2010 to 9th in 2011. Top-5 QB in the modern NFL are >65%. If Lee's coaching can help Fitz bump completions up just bit, say 2 more completions a game, then we'll have something - the difference between 65% completions and 62% completions for the number of throws Fitz made is, in fact, 1 additional completion per game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 First....I hope all this works.... I worry about what messing with Fitz mechanics will do to his quick release...... Meaning...I hope that Lee doesn't mess with him so much that he stops firing it out quickly on designed 3 step drops.....now where this WOULD be of great benift are..... - Drop backs where Fitz has time and needs to throw the deep outs.....that pass needs to be accurate - His throwing mechanics on deep balls through play action....he uses his WHOLE body when he throws the ball deep....which takes extra time and is very labored AND it is thrown in a way that is more like a jump ball If his mechanics can be fixt so that he is just using the corret parts of his body for his throws....this will greatly help ESPECIALLY if he gets improved pass protection. The underlying theme on this? a coach like that could probably help Vince Young immensely as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 If Lee's coaching can help Fitz bump completions up just bit, say 2 more completions a game, then we'll have something - the difference between 65% completions and 62% completions for the number of throws Fitz made is, in fact, 1 additional completion per game. Fantastic Post. A little improvement can mean big things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 I Hear That, Saint. Among other things, in the early '90s, top-10 QB had 58% completions. 61-63% completions could lead the league. It's apples to kumquats, I'm sure that's one of your points. Let's just talk about Fitz, then. It's a significant change to improve completion percentage from 58% to 62%. It moved Fitz from 27th in the league in 2010 to 9th in 2011. Top-5 QB in the modern NFL are >65%. If Lee's coaching can help Fitz bump completions up just bit, say 2 more completions a game, then we'll have something - the difference between 65% completions and 62% completions for the number of throws Fitz made is, in fact, 1 additional completion per game. I'll agree on pretty much all fronts and maybe add pushing the ball downfield a bit more. Better line and receiver play should hopefully help too. If ever someone was in a position to bump up - its him. I just am cautious to say "sweet interview - now he will be elite." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UpperDeck Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 Another thing that can greatly improve Fitz's mechanics is an improved O-line. If he has time to step into his passes his completions will improve. Not that our line was all that bad last year but it looks like it'll be even better this year. If Glenn develops like we think he can and even just having everyone healthy is an improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 For whats its worth, Fitz has a career 59.2% completion percentage, and went 62% last season. Jim Kelly for comparison had a career completion percentage of 60.1%. Y'all need to lay off Cinci Kid a bit. For what it's worth means for what it's worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 Y'all need to lay off Cinci Kid a bit. For what it's worth means for what it's worth. No offense but... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 (edited) Something had to be done and, Cincy Kid, that does not make me a hater, though it's convenient message board speak to say so. You cannot look to a completion %, say "hey, it went up" and be satisfied with that. As any athlete will tell you, the power comes from your legs and your core. If Fitz's mechanics were often removing these areas from the equation, then it's great that they are addressing it. He threw two costly, underthrown INT's vs. the Giants in a game we should have won. I want the guy to succeed. Hell I want him to win a SB and doubt anyone who posts here thinks differently. The difference is that we can look critically at a player and hope he improves. Everyone in the country agrees with the need for improved play at the QB position for the Buffalo Bills. Take the Bills' blinders off and be objective about it. There is a lot of room for improvement and I am hoping the horrendous play in the second half of the season was injury related. However, those throws vs. the Giants came from a healthy Fitz. Couple things to consider...that team went on to win the SB. The Bills lost Parrish early, and nobody has stepped up to be a decent 2nd or 3rd WR. Defending one good WR is so easy for most secondary's, and it gets tougher the more good receivers you have. Kinda why teams like the Patriots and Packers can throw with so much success. Its not just they have a great QB, they also have great receiving corps. Welker was #2 in the NFL last year in receiving yards and Gronk was 6th. While Rodgers spreads the ball around so much that no one receiver is usually in the top ten. When the Bills had Lee Evans on the field the opposing defenses had to roll coverages towards him because he had a reputation for the deep ball and teams didn't ever want to get burned by that long bomb. So that opened up the underneath and middle. With Evans gone it was all underneath quick stuff that is sorta easy to defend. Probably the reason why the Bills went after a TJ Graham in the 3rd. By the Bills choosing that 3rd round pick tells me they missed the threat of Evans on the field, while perhaps not missing that particular player. I just hope this new QB coach* doesn't make Fitz stop and think about his every move, everything needs to become instinct and instant reactions. Lastly, I gotta wonder if the Bills did enough this off season to get more weapons for Fitz. Buddy Nix counting on Easley and Graham and they might not be enough. Edited May 25, 2012 by Fear the Beard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChasBB Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 It will be interesting whether or not lee can do the same thing for Vince young... The article only mentions Fitz, Thigpen, & Smith as being in attendance for the film study -- anyone know why Vince Young not in attendance for that, as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt in KC Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 The article only mentions Fitz, Thigpen, & Smith as being in attendance for the film study -- anyone know why Vince Young not in attendance for that, as well? It says the following: Sitting there with the other quarterbacks on the roster at the time in Tyler Thigpen and Brad Smith, Fitz watched a healthy number of his misfired passes from 2011. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoretalk Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 (edited) I love that we have a quarterback willing to examine what he's done wrong and willing to admit he has just been 'heaving' the ball at times. This also says a lot about Gailey and Nix who brought Lee in. Fitz is admitting he is learning from Lee and Young has stated that Coach Lee is important to him as he tries to comeback from whatever quarterback misfit island he has been on. How can any true fan not be excited about the direction that the Bills are heading in and this coming season. The article only mentions Fitz, Thigpen, & Smith as being in attendance for the film study -- anyone know why Vince Young not in attendance for that, as well? Could it be that the reporter visited on a day when Young was out of town (they are not in mandatory practice mode yet)? Young has been quoted saying he wanted to be coached by Lee so I am sure that when Young is in town he will be at the film study too (Or, Lee might be accumulating the Eagles' film from last year still ...). Edited May 25, 2012 by shoretalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DefenseWinzChampionshipz Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hapless Bills Fan Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 Another thing that can greatly improve Fitz's mechanics is an improved O-line. If he has time to step into his passes his completions will improve. Not that our line was all that bad last year but it looks like it'll be even better this year. If Glenn develops like we think he can and even just having everyone healthy is an improvement. One of the interesting comments I heard from Lee was, when he was analyzing film, he said Fitz throws well in the off-balance, "funny body" throws he has to make under pressure - which are hard to coach or fix He commented that sometimes when Fitz had time to set up on the pocket and step into his throws, they were off. I think some here have commented, especially when throwing to the left. The good news is, those aren't the "instant decision" kind of throws, they're the throws where there might be time to think about where are the feet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XrazyBillsFan Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 Golfing mechanics and throwing mechanics are not even close to the same things. Throwing is a much more natural motion and golfing goes against the natural kinetics of the body. I've never heard of a QB going David Duval one day. I'm sure that Lee had a nice long talk about Fitz's play-fakes as well. He just got straight up lazy at the end of the year and wasn't fooling anyone. I agree with CodeMonkey that this is as big as any off season move. It shows that the coaching staff is evolving and the players are accountable. This has truly been a dream off season. Wow david duval?? I haven't heard about him in YEARS...LOL. not the best swing neither... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 Couple things to consider...that team went on to win the SB. The Bills lost Parrish early, and nobody has stepped up to be a decent 2nd or 3rd WR. Defending one good WR is so easy for most secondary's, and it gets tougher the more good receivers you have. Kinda why teams like the Patriots and Packers can throw with so much success. Its not just they have a great QB, they also have great receiving corps. Welker was #2 in the NFL last year in receiving yards and Gronk was 6th. While Rodgers spreads the ball around so much that no one receiver is usually in the top ten. When the Bills had Lee Evans on the field the opposing defenses had to roll coverages towards him because he had a reputation for the deep ball and teams didn't ever want to get burned by that long bomb. So that opened up the underneath and middle. With Evans gone it was all underneath quick stuff that is sorta easy to defend. Probably the reason why the Bills went after a TJ Graham in the 3rd. By the Bills choosing that 3rd round pick tells me they missed the threat of Evans on the field, while perhaps not missing that particular player. I just hope this new QB coach* doesn't make Fitz stop and think about his every move, everything needs to become instinct and instant reactions. Lastly, I gotta wonder if the Bills did enough this off season to get more weapons for Fitz. Buddy Nix counting on Easley and Graham and they might not be enough. Another thing to consider in that Giants game is that Bell was already out and Hairston, with whom Fitz wasn't comfortable, got injured with a little over 11 minutes to go in the game, forcing them to move Levitre to LT and insert Rinehart into the game. And yet he still completed 70% of his passes for 8.1 YPA. To go along with missing Williams, Merriman, and Donald Jones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malazan Posted May 25, 2012 Share Posted May 25, 2012 When the Bills had Lee Evans on the field the opposing defenses had to roll coverages towards him because he had a reputation for the deep ball and teams didn't ever want to get burned by that long bomb. Lee's reputation is much larger on this board than it is in the NFL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAWNDO Posted May 26, 2012 Share Posted May 26, 2012 The article only mentions Fitz, Thigpen, & Smith as being in attendance for the film study -- anyone know why Vince Young not in attendance for that, as well? I think VY has been getting a crash course in the Bills Offense the past few weeks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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