DaveinElma Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 so, you're saying there wasn't a conversation between two people at the 2010 NFL combine in regards to the discussion here at hand? so you're saying that if i got it from the agent, i would be wrong? cool, so i'm not wrong, then. so, you're saying that there wasn't more to Pat Williams departure than what's been detailed here? so you're saying, that the entire coaching staff knew Troy Vincent was placed on IR, when he was, and that a certain person in a great position of power on this team wasn't actually caught off guard by the move? it's all very intriguing. thanks for the response. jw sorry, one last thing: so Jim Overdorf didn't handle the trade? Just curious why if you have sourced information on things like these why wouldn't you write an article about them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevergiveup Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 so, you're saying there wasn't a conversation between two people at the 2010 NFL combine in regards to the discussion here at hand? so you're saying that if i got it from the agent, i would be wrong? cool, so i'm not wrong, then. so, you're saying that there wasn't more to Pat Williams departure than what's been detailed here? so you're saying, that the entire coaching staff knew Troy Vincent was placed on IR, when he was, and that a certain person in a great position of power on this team wasn't actually caught off guard by the move? it's all very intriguing. thanks for the response. jw sorry, one last thing: so Jim Overdorf didn't handle the trade? Handle the trade. He "handles" all trades. "behind the trade" Absolutely not. Big difference. At the 2010 combine? Could you have discussed the possibility of Evans being traded sure. Linking it to this deal is ridiculous. There are alot of trade scenarios discussed every day. I guess we now know why you are not privvy to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SDS Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 I am not hear to rile anyone up. I stand by my record. If John Warrow has a history of posting accurate inside information, I would love to hear about it. Of course someone could have told him that Jim Overdorf was behind that trade. For him to believe and report it shows he knows less about the inner workings of that organization than most of the people on the board. Your relationships there are superficial at best and I am quite confident that no one is feeding you any legitimate inside information. If it was someone outside the team, like Lee's or his agent, you should know better. Amazing that you all of a sudden have a pipeline into the team that would disclose something like that. More importantly it is completely inaccurate. Go ahead and stand by your report if it makes you feel better, but to believe it is hopefully just ignorance and not worse. He comes the journalistic integrity battle cry. Yes I am sure you are completely above reproach. And not revealing my identity does not make me wrong. I think I have been pretty accurate in the past. I apologize to the board. I am not trying to drive away someone you might want to pariticpate. However if you think you are getting inside info from him or anyone of the other beat writers for this team, you are wrong. I'm not sure why you would push the issue though. I imagine 99% of the things that happen behind closed doors never see the light of day. Frankly, I would be more concerned if more DID come out than if it didn't. With that said. The overwhelming consensus is that we value both of your contributions here. I think we should just leave this as an "exercise for the reader" to sort through and let any tension subside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveinElma Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Just curious why if you have sourced information on things like these why wouldn't you write an article about them? It would be an interesting article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outsidethebox Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Just curious why if you have sourced information on things like these why wouldn't you write an article about them? Great question. I'm sorry, I don't count that fluff piece with Wilson as inside info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ieatcrayonz Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 JW - I understand all that and agree generally.... But this thread probably reflects worse than any of his comments. You have established your rep here, a single anonymous poster isn't going to hurt it. There's no way it ends up hurting you professionally. It's not going to effect your career... Call out threads always come off as immature. I'm not saying you are, but there's no way around it. Even the most deserved or well intentioned- they all look silly in the end. You aren't going to get back whatever you thought you lost from that original post by running with this. All you've done is brought it to the attention of everyone reading on a probably higher traffic weekend with cuts and the opening weekend. Just my opinion but when someone calls your name and reputation into question, I think it is fair that you react in whatever way you feel is right. That could be ignoring it, getting angry, responding/not responding or whatever else. If you won't defend your own name and reputation, what will you defend? Some people on here think I don't have a Googlebot or that my Hamster Sammy can't talk. I choose to ignore those people, but if I chose to fight them or have Sammy post on Youtube and give everyone the middle claw, that would be valid as well. If it is your word, it is your choice on how to defend it. FWIW I think that NGU and jw both danced around their assertions about the team and the Evans situation. That is their prerogative and nobody should complain. I can easily come up with a scenario that if true would not diminish either man's claims about the Evans stuff. In fact I did in the other thread. I'm not sure how NGU can claim that jw has no sources. How could he possibly know? I think that is the part ticking jw off and since it is about his name/credibility I think it is fair to respond in whatever manner he sees fit. I sure hope NGU sticks around the board but I can't knock a guy being defensive of his own good name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delete This Account Posted September 3, 2011 Author Share Posted September 3, 2011 Handle the trade. He "handles" all trades. "behind the trade" Absolutely not. Big difference. At the 2010 combine? Could you have discussed the possibility of Evans being traded sure. Linking it to this deal is ridiculous. There are alot of trade scenarios discussed every day. I guess we now know why you are not privvy to them. i wasn't at the combine. there was a discussion that took place at the combine, which i've recently found out to be curious. jw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 And if you're connected to the team, you're going to toe the company line, and tell us all to ignore the man behind the curtain and continue buying tickets. You're pissed off because JW blew the doors off the mickey mouse way this franchise has been run for well over a decade (and for most of its existence) Face it, you're doing exactly what the Bills brass has been doing for years. Instead of defending the piss poor way the team has been run, the team attacks the journalists and reporters who dare to question the shenanigans of the Bills ownership. Thanks, Dad. jw broke that one huh? Jeez, I should write for the AP! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HalftimeAdjustment Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Of course someone could have told him that Jim Overdorf was behind that trade. For him to believe and report it shows he knows less about the inner workings of that organization than most of the people on the board. I am curious where you think JW reported that Jim Overdorf was behind the trade. The article did not state this nor did JW state this in any post that I read. The original article states: "Nix didn't handle trade talks, leaving that job with Jim Overdorf, the team's salary cap specialist and senior vice president of football administration." Since then many board posters have concluded that this sentence means that Jim Overdorf made the decision to trade Lee Evans. Jerry Sullivan also made this interpretation. Perhaps you should be directing your disdain and misspelling of a writer's name at Jerry Sullivan, or the board posters who read the above sentence to say something that it does not? Usually when someone writes that Nix "left that job" with someone, it means that Nix made the decision and delegated the execution. It makes me feel that you are attempting to provoke JW, not necessarily to leave the board, but to issue a clarification to the article that he already declined to clarify. I know you started by saying you are not trying to provoke, but if that is not your intent, you are not accomplishing your intent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Another thing that is somewhat lost in this is that jw writes for the AP. He deals in mostly facts, and much more restricted from opinions than a Buff News writer and especially a columnist like Jerry Sullivan whose entire job is to voice his opinion. Wawrow chose his words very carefully in the original AP article, and would not put them in the article without distinct and specific inner knowledge of that particular incident. So far, NGU has only spoken in generalities that Overdorf does not do this or that. That is not how he or the team operates. JW didn't put his reputation on the line on a message board, he did it on a national scale on public record, and flat would not do that on flimsy or baseless knowledge, rumor or innuendo. That's not what he or the AP does. He is not a blogger or columnist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevergiveup Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 jw broke that one huh? Jeez, I should write for the AP! I amn to defending anyhting and never have. All I have ever done hear is post accurate information. I simply tried to clarify a piece of information. I could do it more often, but this entire situatioin shoudl clarify why I don't. Blow the lid off of one bills drive? Now that is the funniest thing I have read today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joey greco Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 So they paid Evans $1.1M in bonus to avoid a backlash from fans for not getting a pick? Again if they cared mostly about the money and not the team, why would they care what the fans think? They gained about 7 million in real savings and a fourth round pick at a cost of 1.1 million. Not very hard to understand. And ngu is obviously playing the company stooge and trying to discredit a reporter who has let us all in on what really counts to this franchises. It's just a no u argument and there is absolutely no reason to believe it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EC-Bills Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Thanks, Dad. On the bright side, you could always think of him as the dad you never wanted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevergiveup Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 I am curious where you think JW reported that Jim Overdorf was behind the trade. The article did not state this nor did JW state this in any post that I read. The original article states: "Nix didn't handle trade talks, leaving that job with Jim Overdorf, the team's salary cap specialist and senior vice president of football administration." Since then many board posters have concluded that this sentence means that Jim Overdorf made the decision to trade Lee Evans. Jerry Sullivan also made this interpretation. Perhaps you should be directing your disdain and misspelling of a writer's name at Jerry Sullivan, or the board posters who read the above sentence to say something that it does not? Usually when someone writes that Nix "left that job" with someone, it means that Nix made the decision and delegated the execution. It makes me feel that you are attempting to provoke JW, not necessarily to leave the board, but to issue a clarification to the article that he already declined to clarify. I know you started by saying you are not trying to provoke, but if that is not your intent, you are not accomplishing your intent. If that is the case, there is nothing to argue about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 On the bright side, you could always think of him as the dad you never wanted. If DC Tom were my dad, i'd have strangled myself with the umbilical cord in the uterus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevergiveup Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 They gained about 7 million in real savings and a fourth round pick at a cost of 1.1 million. Not very hard to understand. And ngu is obviously playing the company stooge and trying to discredit a reporter who has let us all in on what really counts to this franchises. It's just a no u argument and there is absolutely no reason to believe it. Joey. Never said it wasn't about money. Just trying to clarify roles in the organization. There seemed to be some confusion. Another thing that is somewhat lost in this is that jw writes for the AP. He deals in mostly facts, and much more restricted from opinions than a Buff News writer and especially a columnist like Jerry Sullivan whose entire job is to voice his opinion. Wawrow chose his words very carefully in the original AP article, and would not put them in the article without distinct and specific inner knowledge of that particular incident. So far, NGU has only spoken in generalities that Overdorf does not do this or that. That is not how he or the team operates. JW didn't put his reputation on the line on a message board, he did it on a national scale on public record, and flat would not do that on flimsy or baseless knowledge, rumor or innuendo. That's not what he or the AP does. He is not a blogger or columnist. How specific would you like me to get? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramius Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Joey. Never said it wasn't about money. Just trying to clarify roles in the organization. There seemed to be some confusion. Glad to know that the inner circle values $7 million dollars in ralphie's pocket more than they do winning games on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nevergiveup Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 Glad to know that the inner circle values $7 million dollars in ralphie's pocket more than they do winning games on the field. How many more games do you win with him this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 They gained about 7 million in real savings and a fourth round pick at a cost of 1.1 million. Not very hard to understand. And ngu is obviously playing the company stooge and trying to discredit a reporter who has let us all in on what really counts to this franchises. It's just a no u argument and there is absolutely no reason to believe it. How do they have "7 million in real savings" when 2012's $4.75M isn't even close to being spent yet? Again they saved just $2.6M this year, despite paying out tens of millions on new contracts for this year alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted September 3, 2011 Share Posted September 3, 2011 so, you're saying there wasn't a conversation between two people at the 2010 NFL combine in regards to the discussion here at hand? so you're saying that if i got it from the agent, i would be wrong? cool, so i'm not wrong, then. so, you're saying that there wasn't more to Pat Williams departure than what's been detailed here? so you're saying, that the entire coaching staff knew Troy Vincent was placed on IR, when he was, and that a certain person in a great position of power on this team wasn't actually caught off guard by the move? it's all very intriguing. thanks for the response. jw sorry, one last thing: so Jim Overdorf didn't handle the trade? oh, sorry, it's Wawrow. you've had a few chances to get it right, not that i'm questioning your insights and accuracy, here. JW - This is the kind of thing that's only making you look less professional. Disagree, point to the track record you have and move on. There's no need for these unexplained half stories to come out in this manner. You stick to your guns on professionalism and sourcing in every other thread and because one guy got under your skin your going to just throw stuff against the wall to try and prove yourself against him? It's the very thing I've admired you for not doing around here. What has this all accomplished for you? What is your hoped for end game in this thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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