Locker room privacy ??

[truth on hold]

Charles Barkley on the Ines Saintz/New York Jets locker room scandal:

 

"I gotta tell you something. When I watch TV now I feel bad for ugly women. Because if you are an ugly woman you got no chance of getting on TV now, especially in the sporting culture."

[starrymessenger]

Don't know how many times I (and others) need to repeat this before it starts sinking in, but reporters of both genders ARE allowed postgame locker-room access for high-profile women's sports. WNBA and the women's NCAA hoops tourney, to name two.

Then its my bad Lori. I've never been in a women's sports lockerroom after a game, so I don't know what its like or how its managed. I have been in men's locker rooms as a high school and college athlete however (not as a reporter) and I can tell you that they are not places for a woman to be. I don't say that because men don't know how to behave (some do, some don't). I say that because many male athletes subscribe to the same mores as the rest of the general population does. Is this starting to sink in?

Twenty years ago a lady was casually chilling out in our lockerroom. I told her to leave even though she was a physiotherapist and had legitimate reasons for dealing with us. Just wasn't the right time or the right place, it seemed to me.

[benderbender]

If this were a real issue, there would have been more accusations of harassment by this point.

Edited September 19, 2010 by benderbender

[Dan]

I don't have much to add to the content of the thread, because it's all been said and resaid to death. However, after reading 12 pages (mostly), I can say with certainty:

 

1. Lori - it's nice to see you post (even if sparingly). It's nice to have genuine and well-supported facts interjected into a discussion. It makes it so much easier for those of us without knowledge to more accurately gain knowledge and form an opinion.

 

2. Mr Weo - you're an idiot. Are you seriously debating with an AP reporter about how a reporter does their job? Think about that... you're tallking to a reporter about how a reporter does his/her job and you think he's wrong. What's next - debating with SDS how message boards are maintained?

[papazoid]

The television reporter (Ines Sainz) who said she was harassed while attending a New York Jets football practice expressed outrage Saturday with the women's media group that filed a complaint on her behalf -- and also said she was satisfied with the way the NFL handled the situation:

 

http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2010/09/18/sainz-women-set-years/

[Hapless Bills Fan]

The television reporter (Ines Sainz) who said she was harassed while attending a New York Jets football practice expressed outrage Saturday with the women's media group that filed a complaint on her behalf -- and also said she was satisfied with the way the NFL handled the situation:

 

http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2010/09/18/sainz-women-set-years/

 

See, here's the thing. When Ines Sainz herself has been quoted, she has not said she was harassed.

She has said she felt uncomfortable and embarrassed - I have felt uncomfortable or embarrassed myself in situations which stopped short of harassment.

Sainz herself made no complaint.

 

The rest of the article seems well-done; the start seems sloppy reporting.

 

Sainz is justifiably upset at the media group, because as one can see from this thread, many people are left with a mis-impression that she

"dressed for the kitchen but couldn't take the heat", so to speak, and that she is the one who filed a complaint.

That's not the way it went down - apparently the women's media group who complained didn't even talk to her before filing!

 

Sainz has said she felt the Jets could have treated her more professionally, which sounds inarguable, but that she never felt threatened or endangered or heard any sexual comments.

 

By the way, in the interview clip with Sanchez "from the day", she is wearing jeans, a leather belt, and a white long-sleeved shirt with a collar. She's an attractive woman, no doubt, but that's hardly nightclub attire as some here have mistakenly stated.

 

Note to Red: I appreciate the frustration of being stuck behind slow-moving vehicle be it bicyclist, bicycle pack, horse-and-buggy, or farm equipment.

I'd be happy to talk cycling traffic law and my own habits as a cyclist, it just seems off topic here. Just don't want you to think I'm ignoring you.

I'm still learning the forum. If I can find a way to re-direct a response to another forum (off the wall?), I'll do that.

[The Dean]

Don't have a problem with Kris Jenkins' comments. He was angry and he had every right to be. No woman, reporter or not, hot or not, has any business in a men's locker room. Oh but it is her business you say. I say "nuts", until they let men walk around women's locker rooms (which they won't and which they shouldn't)- that is the real double standard here. Athletes, male and female, are not just pieces of meat. They have feelings and for the most part they fully subscribe to conventional mores and societal norms, which by the way includes sexual probity. Sure they are in the public eye, but they have not foregone their rights to privacy.

 

I think the "conventional mores and societal norms" you subscribe to were outdated 20 years ago. You are a "throwback" to be kind. The world has moved on. Some individuals choose to remain behind.

 

 

Then its my bad Lori. I've never been in a women's sports lockerroom after a game, so I don't know what its like or how its managed.

 

Don't worry, even though you have no idea what goes on or how it's managed, feel free to criticize it! That's the norm around here.

 

 

I have been in men's locker rooms as a high school and college athlete however (not as a reporter) and I can tell you that they are not places for a woman to be.

 

 

Where should a woman be? In the kitchen? That has to be the most sexist comment in this thread, so far. This isn't about women or men, it's about professional reporters. It's not about SEX, it's about doing a job. Can't you understand how socially backwards your comments are?

 

 

Twenty years ago a lady was casually chilling out in our lockerroom. I told her to leave even though she was a physiotherapist and had legitimate reasons for dealing with us. Just wasn't the right time or the right place, it seemed to me.

 

My first question is, did she have reason to be there? You say she was "casually chilling out", but also say "she had legitimate reasons for dealing with you". If being in the locker room wasn't part of the legitimate reason, you are right. No outsiders, other than those doing jobs related to the team/sport, belong in the locker room. I'd prefer no reporters in locker rooms, but that isn't the way it is. Reporters are doing their jobs, as are trainers, etc. What if it was a woman trainer? Would it be OK for her to be in the locker room doing her job? Have you ever gone to a female medical doctor?

 

Seriously, the level of old-school sexism in your posts is at an unbelievably high level. Thankfully that kind of thought is dying out.

[Red]

See, here's the thing. When Ines Sainz herself has been quoted, she has not said she was harassed.

She has said she felt uncomfortable and embarrassed - I have felt uncomfortable or embarrassed myself in situations which stopped short of harassment.

Sainz herself made no complaint.

 

The rest of the article seems well-done; the start seems sloppy reporting.

 

Sainz is justifiably upset at the media group, because as one can see from this thread, many people are left with a mis-impression that she

"dressed for the kitchen but couldn't take the heat", so to speak, and that she is the one who filed a complaint.

That's not the way it went down - apparently the women's media group who complained didn't even talk to her before filing!

 

Sainz has said she felt the Jets could have treated her more professionally, which sounds inarguable, but that she never felt threatened or endangered or heard any sexual comments.

 

By the way, in the interview clip with Sanchez "from the day", she is wearing jeans, a leather belt, and a white long-sleeved shirt with a collar. She's an attractive woman, no doubt, but that's hardly nightclub attire as some here have mistakenly stated.

 

Note to Red: I appreciate the frustration of being stuck behind slow-moving vehicle be it bicyclist, bicycle pack, horse-and-buggy, or farm equipment.

I'd be happy to talk cycling traffic law and my own habits as a cyclist, it just seems off topic here. Just don't want you to think I'm ignoring you.

I'm still learning the forum. If I can find a way to re-direct a response to another forum (off the wall?), I'll do that.

 

Hopeful: Just because you can, does not mean you should. I always yield to bikes. I just wish bikers would understand that 'share' part of the road rules and kindly stay out of the flow of traffic.

[papazoid]

UPDATE...Ines Sainz coming back to work.....wants out of locker rooms:

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5685267

[The Dean]

UPDATE...Ines Sainz coming back to work.....wants out of locker rooms:

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5685267

 

 

Can't say I blame her.

[papazoid]

more bad news.....Ines Sainz says "No Gracias" to Playboy:

 

http://foreign.peacefmonline.com/entertainment/201010/93117.php

[Mr. WEO]

She's already signed with Spanish Hustler

[papazoid]

She's already signed with Spanish Hustler

 

i don't think so...

[starrymessenger]

I think the "conventional mores and societal norms" you subscribe to were outdated 20 years ago. You are a "throwback" to be kind. The world has moved on. Some individuals choose to remain behind.

It may be conservative, but I'm not sure its outdated.

 

 

 

Don't worry, even though you have no idea what goes on or how it's managed, feel free to criticize it! That's the norm around here.

Didn't criticize it. Said I didn't know how they handled it. If I did know I might criticize, might not. All depends.

 

 

 

Where should a woman be? In the kitchen? That has to be the most sexist comment in this thread, so far. This isn't about women or men, it's about professional reporters. It's not about SEX, it's about doing a job. Can't you understand how socially backwards your comments are?

Agree not about sex. Like I said, about sexual probity. Don't think a women's only place is in the kitchen. Have worked for a woman for twenty years. Have no problems. Just saying a woman should probably not be in a locker room with 54 naked men, that all. JMO. You don't have to agree.

 

 

My first question is, did she have reason to be there? You say she was "casually chilling out", but also say "she had legitimate reasons for dealing with you". If being in the locker room wasn't part of the legitimate reason, you are right. No outsiders, other than those doing jobs related to the team/sport, belong in the locker room. I'd prefer no reporters in locker rooms, but that isn't the way it is. Reporters are doing their jobs, as are trainers, etc. What if it was a woman trainer? Would it be OK for her to be in the locker room doing her job? Have you ever gone to a female medical doctor?

She was a physiotherapist, like I said, but was just chilling out at the time, like I said. So, no business there IMO.

Seriously, the level of old-school sexism in your posts is at an unbelievably high level. Thankfully that kind of thought is dying out.

Don't think I'm sexist. Maybe some would say a prude though.

Deano, happy to hear that there are policemen out there like you ready to spank the politically incorrect amongst us. I really feel edified by your five and dime platitudes. Let me leave you with a disturbing thought: there may be more things between heaven and earth than are drempt of in your philosophy.

[PromoTheRobot]

Privacy? I thought this was about locker room PIRACY!! Arrrgghh, me matey! Where be my soap and shower sandals?

 

PTR

[The Dean]

more bad news.....Ines Sainz says "No Gracias" to Playboy:

 

http://foreign.peacefmonline.com/entertainment/201010/93117.php

 

 

Good for her. She really seems like a person with some integrity.