Sierra Foothills

I appreciate your well-considered opinions. I shouldn't have actually asked you for names and numbers because I'm still firm in my belief that it's uncommon for teams to break-in two rookie WRs in the same year and even more uncommon for those rookies to make an impact... so I'm still laboring under the belief that it's the exception and not the rule... but I certainly concede your point was proven in the case of the Packers and I thank you for the excellent documentation. As far as championship roster-building, I don't believe that there's one strategy. The best teams have solid rosters with few weaknesses. Super Bowls have been won in many different ways. It's hard to argue against the opinion that the reason the Bills haven't been able to beat KC is due to the failings of their defense. It's too bad the Bills suffered so many significant defensive injuries at the end of last season. And there's certainly a 2024 scenario whereby the Bills score plenty of points (as they did in 13 Seconds) and lose again due to the losses of Poyer and Hyde. It'll be very interesting to see how things play out and who ends up being right.

I'm on lunch break so please excuse me for asking you to back your assertion. Who were the two rookies and what were their stats? Thank you. To the bolded, I know that though you occasionally affirm that none of us can know for sure, it's pretty clear that you don't think Coleman will succeed... based on the body of your comments about him since before he was drafted. Most of your secondary arguments seem like they are built on that single belief. If on the other hand you believe that Coleman will succeed, then IMO there's no reasonable basis to think that with the continued development of Shakir and Kincaid, the additions of Samuel, MVS, and Claypool, atop the baseline established by Cook and Knox, that the Bills will have surrounded Josh with enough good weapons... and that there's no reason to double down. Many other posters on this board agree with you... they don't like the Coleman pick so they wanted to double down, even though as @folz pointed out, how do you justify doubling down when Hyde and Poyer are no longer on the roster? So the people who wanted to double down should at least say which round and which player they wanted instead of the player we drafted. THEN we're having a worthwhile conversation. Again that's your opinion and it's not necessarily wrong... but I believe that if Coleman has a good rookie season, that the state of the WR corps will not be the reason the Bills don't win the Super Bowl. Regarding MVS, there's no reason to believe he's slowing down. From Sal's article (PTSD spoiler alert): "... last January when Valdes-Scantling made two huge plays for the Chiefs when they defeated the Bills in the divisional playoff game at Highmark Stadium. On the first play of the third quarter, he lined up in the slot and drew man coverage from Taron Johnson who is five inches shorter. Patrick Mahomes recognized the matchup and Valdes-Scantling ran a seam route and despite tight coverage, he made a superb catch for a 30-yard gain. Five plays later the Chiefs were in the end zone and in the lead, 20-17. Then later in the third, after the Bills had regained a 24-20 advantage, Valdes-Scantling struck again. On a second-and-7 from the Buffalo 48, he was again in the slot and ran a route where he found a hole in zone coverage between Rasul Douglas and Micah Hyde and Mahomes hit for a 32-yard gain. That big play led to Isaiah Pacheco scoring what proved to be the winning touchdown." Some people here belief that the addition of Curtis Samuel, MVS, and Chase Claypool are equivalent to signing Trent Sherfield and Deonte Harty. I'm not one of those people. To the bolded, that's a good question and one the Vikings are asking themselves about Justin Jefferson. But you didn't address the draft compensation issue. Unlike Jefferson who is simply a matter of re-signing, the Bills would have to send multiple high draft picks to the Niners for Aiyuk. Tell me, what would you be willing to trade for Aiyuk?

Egads... I see in today's Buffalo News that they're now saying he's 5'11" I really hope he has LONG ARMS... I'd like to boil it down to the original question that @Rampant Buffalo asked? Should a person who is drunk be held responsible for their actions?... or put differently does being drunk absolve a person of responsibility for their actions? I think that's a very interesting question. Some people have the strength of character to give up drinking because they cannot deny that it brings out something in them that shouldn't be brought out.

The bolded is what I believe as well. I'll go further and say that good luck is an ingredient in pretty much every Super Bowl winning season (there are never guarantees) and that the Bills as currently constituted are good enough to win the 2025 Super Bowl. Are they the favorite? No. Are they one of only a handful of teams with a realistic shot? Yes. Have they previously fallen short as favorites? Yes. Can they win even though they are not the favorites? Absolutely. Yes, there was an angry and emotional response from much of the fanbase when the Bills didn't double down on WR. Regarding doubling down, firstly as @Sammy Watkins' Rib pointed out, the Bills top picks in each of the last two drafts were receiving weapons for Josh. So there's that. One thing that I don't believe has been mentioned in the innumerable and endless WR conversations is how difficult it is to bring 2 rookie WRs up to speed in one offseason. Already the Bills are trying to assimilate two young veterans in Shakir and Kincaid as well as other receivers who were not with the team last year. A legit argument can be made that those precious snaps should go to young veterans with NFL seasoning (and accomplishments) more than they should a second rookie WR. I'd be curious to know when the last time two rookie WRs both had a significant positive impact on an NFL team. I think it's not even attempted much because of the difficulty and downside to building trust with two rookies during the same offseason... at the expense of others who may be more positioned to contribute. According to ESPN's Jeremy Fowler, Aiyuk wants a deal that would exceed the one recently given to Amon Ra St. Brown. The Bills cannot pay a WR $28-30 million per year and they certainly won't give up multiple high draft picks for the "privilege" of doing so. Any credible opinion about the Bills wide receiver situation should not include a mention of Brandon Aiyuk. Just as an interestingly side conversation, there is a Patriot who will be in the Hall of Fame soon and played 9 seasons with Brady but never won a Super Bowl. That player is Logan Mankins. If I remember correctly the Patriots won a Super Bowl just before his rookie season and also the season after he retired. As @LeGOATski and others have mentioned, you do need very good players BUT it's also the mix of skills which are important. Please don't misconstrue what I'm about to write but I found the following information in Sal Maiorana's recent D&C piece pretty interesting: "For his career, Valdes-Scantling’s average depth of target it 16.3 yards and his yards per reception is 17.0... for comparison, Diggs’ average depth of target is 11.2 yards and his yards per catch is 12.3. A closer comparison would be the career of John Brown who was with the Bills in 2019, 2020 and part of 2022 and was always considered a vertical threat. His career depth of target was 15.5 yards and his yards per catch was 14.9." In the leadup to the draft, selecting a player that could "take the top off a defense" was BY FAR the biggest trait that all of us wanted to see from a rookie wide receiver. Again I'm not heralding the addition of MVS and Chase Claypool as saviors for the Bills passing game BUT the Bills now have 2 players who have proven in the NFL that they can take the top off a defense. Last year, the Bills had zero players of that type. I'm probably in the minority but I'm happy and satisfied with the moves the Bills have made this offseason. I accept that we're not going all-in this offseason (for the first time in several seasons) but I know with the salary cap projections and the stockpile of high draft picks that the Bills will be loaded for bear next offseason. People can understand differing viewpoints without necessarily agreeing with those viewpoints.

The one thing I like about both Epenesa and Rousseau is probably what the Bills liked about them... they are long and rangy and can create problems in the passing lanes. That's something that doesn't really show up in the box scores except in passes defensed and INTs (Epenesa had 2 last year). On passing downs where Ed Oliver is taking a blow, I like the idea of Epenesa and Rousseau taking turns in the middle to place their length in the central passing lanes and where their athleticism is more of a mismatch against interior O-linemen. Also, teams have a tendency to want to give second contracts to players they've drafted. It doesn't always work out but it helps foster good chemistry when a team rewards its own.

I can spell his name but I'm not sure how to pronounce it.

I'll let others discuss whether Steveson is deserving of this opportunity. I'm more interested in finding out whether one of the greatest wrestlers of all time has the ability to play NFL football after having never played organized football at any level. It's really quite an intriguing experiment. His height is similar to Donald though Donald was listed at 285 and Steveson is listed lighter than that. I'd really love to know his measurables... particularly his arm length. If I had to guess I'd say he never plays in a regular season NFL game... but hopefully this is a fun diversion from the usual offseason story lines and I'd love if he proved me wrong.

Just for the sake of clarity, you're talking about Steve Diggs... correct?

For context, the article featured 14 rookies and 9 notable mentions so it wasn't one of these "one player per team" click baits. Sedrick Van Pran-Granger, C, Buffalo Bills Round 5, Pick 141 I was probably higher on this center class than some, but even those who weren’t feeling the group as a whole could agree Van Pran-Granger was a great value in Round 5. A three-year starter, two-time national champion and two-time captain, Van Pran-Granger was the backbone of Georgia’s powerful and nasty rush attack after earning the starting job in 2021. He’s probably only a center in the NFL, which is likely why he fell as far as he did. However, the Bills needed center help and Van Pran-Granger is powerful enough to earn reps as an NFL starting offensive lineman right now. If he’s healthy, watch for him to turn heads early in fall camp once the pads come on. Another center pick I liked on Day 3: NC State’s Dylan McMahon to Philadelphia in the sixth round. Don’t be surprised if he outperforms his draft slot. https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5511949/2024/05/23/nfl-draft-2024-rookie-sleepers/?campaign=5888993&source=dailyemail&userId=555233 Mods, please merge if you feel it's necessary.

Thanks for posting the video. I did a basic audit and found this: Josh's Interceptions Vs Yards beyond LOS Intended Receiver NYJ 60 Harty NYJ 41 Diggs NYJ 15 Davis WAS 40 Davis JAX 50 Diggs NYG 11 Sherfield NE 18 Knox TB -2 Kincaid CIN 19 Davis DEN 22 Davis DEN 16 Harty NYJ 48 Kincaid PHI 3 Diggs KC 14 Sherfield LAC 43 Diggs NE 40 Kincaid MIA 8 Davis MIA 40 Davis Ave 28.67 yards INTs per intended receiver Player INTs % Target % reg season Davis 6 33% 14% Diggs 4 22% 27% Kincaid 3 17% 16% Sherfield 2 11% 4% Harty 2 11% 4% Knox 1 6% 6% Shakir 0 0% 8% I think it's really interesting that Josh's average depth of interception is almost 29 yards. On many of those plays it seems he was just chucking the ball downfield and not showing much discipline. Also interesting how incommensurately high the INT% to target % is for Davis, Sherfield, and Harty. Note also that Shakir was not the intended receiver for any of Josh's INTs.

Apparently I'm the only one who didn't know the new stadium will have a grass field? I'm surprised that hasn't been a bigger topic of conversation here. Super happy to hear this... might playing on grass have some impact on the roster building strategy?

Gauntlet time?

Quinton Morris anyone? Seymour or Norty? That is wild. Isn't Knox a bit shaky in the catching department? It's been brought up by others elswhere that between Knox, James Cook and Gabe Davis that the Bills had too many players with undependable hands.

We're at our usual ratio of one good post per every 4 pages. Thank you @section122 for the one good post. Agree with all of the above and would have made the same arguments had you not posted. All of your points are excellent. To point number one, of course Parry will have involvement in training camp and practices. Why would they pay him as an officiating/game management coach and not have him do so????? To point number two, of course he'll advise the coaches on officiating nuances which can be taught to the players. And of course he'll know the tendencies of the various officials and crews and of course his hiring will generally play positively in the officiating community. And yes, there is zero downside... which makes you wonder why anyone would have a negative view of this hire. The Bills have just done something that makes total sense... and that no other NFL team has done before... to a generally lukewarm and negative response here. Other points to consider: In 2020, the Bills hired Marc Lubick as their Game Management Coach. You think that maybe Parry will be assisting Lubick in these duties? Half of all NFL games are decided by 7 points or less. You think maybe that Parry's hire might have a generally positive effect on game outcomes?

Bill, you can call it what you want. Scouting consists of more than just video analysis or attending games or practices in person. Was McDermott scouting or not when he was almost run over by Ed Oliver at the Oliver's Pro Day Workout? Do you think the Bills drafted Tre'Davious White and Ed Oliver without McDermott doing a fair amount of "talent evaluation" beforehand?

Then they’d have enough for a Venn diagram.

I have to amend the above bolded to "there are very few O-linemen in the NFL that don't cross train at another position." I would say that it's common for players to have center-guard flexibility and guard-tackle flexibility. It's not as common for a tackle to train at both ends of the line as a swing tackle. From comments players have made over the years it seems like swing tackle is the most difficult adjustment for an O-lineman. I would imagine that for the same reason (reverse mirroring), that guard-guard flexibility would also be difficult. On another topic, in the Buffalo News today Bills Director of Player Personnel Terrance Gray said the following about SVPG: “(Kromer) had a chance to simulate some things you would see at the guard position that confirmed, at least for us, that he has the interior line flexibility center and guard,” Gray said. “He also stood out in the classroom with his football intelligence and an ability to process.” How does an evaluator look at Van Pran-Granger’s video of him playing center and project him to guard? “One is a consistency to play on his feet and his ability to bend and seeing him get out in space and hit his target.” Based on those comments it seems SVPG will cross train minimally at one of the guard spots.

Trying to stay warmed up and ready to go!

Yeah, McDermott goes to the Scouting Combine but he has no interest in scouting the players. Got it.

You'll have to ask him and until you do, it's your conjecture vs mine. I'll add that you cannot argue that 1) The Defense is McDermott's Baby and 2) McDermott is a renowned control freak. Believe what you'd like but I'm not here to debate. P.S. - Tre'Davious White was not Doug Whaley's idea.

Sounds like a Beast!

Hopefully this doesn't rekindle the debate... There's absolutely no question in my mind that McDermott has definite opinions about SOME of the players in the draft. The question is how many? (this is essentially what we can't agree about) There's zero chance in my mind that McDermott doesn't have a strong opinion about any players the Bills pick in the first 3 rounds. For instance, tell me with a straight face that McDermott doesn't have a very strong opinion about DeWayne Carter. JMO.

I don't wish to debate this but I will say that the cliche amongst NFL teams which normally holds true is that "we'll start our 5 best offensive linemen." I am expecting that to be the guiding principle.

Very true. Collinsworth's excitement made me feel a bit uncomfortable and a bit queasy as well. I had to watch some Josh Allen highlights in order to feel better again.