Rochesterfan

Very little take away - more like stupid excuses to click on their links. Wish you could undo clicks for poor lists like this.

That is totally incorrect and has been proven so far this year - Their play calling has been the same - the execution has been poor. They throw the ball at a similar percentage rate and have not gone to the run run pass punt or any traditional conservative play calling motifs. Please explain how they are very very conservative when they have a 10 point lead - I am very interested to understand your vision on this.

Not sure I get these responses. The Bills have covered in 4 out of 5 games and won 2 outright as an underdog. Cincinnati is the only game they did not cover and it was by 2 points in a game they had covered for 3/4 ths of the game. They were not expected to blow anyone out until now. Vegas thought they would be close games and they were.

Great a third useless thread - I can’t wait until next week.

No one is arguing that Mayfield was not bad, but just like NE and KC when winning big - pulling your QB does not mean the same thing as benching. Words have meanings and being benched means he was pulled because of his play and the back-up is playing the rest of the game you are trying to win - not one drive at the end of a 4 score blow out. Being benched does not meaning being pulled in a blowout even if it totally your fault for the blow out. Yes - other players are still on the field, but coaches can’t forfeit- so you need people out there. They had back-ups in at QB and WR to protect their investments. I honestly could not figure out why they let Chubb run the ball as he has been their entire offense, but I think Freddie is totally overmatched as a coach and really is not on top of things.

Ahh - so I get it - that means the Pats have benched Tom Brady several times this year as with big leads the NE offense is on the Field and Brady is on the bench - now I get it. I would have thought one of the best QBs of all time would not be repeatedly benched, but apparently NE when winning decides it is better to bench him. You are correct that he was not on the field in an game they were not winning and could not win for the last drive against a team that was trying to kill him. I would not say benched because if that was a 1 score game and they had a chance to win or tie - my guess is Mayfield is out there. He was replaced to protect him from injury. Kitchens would be getting destroyed if anything had happened to Baker on that last drive - just as he should be getting destroyed for letting Beckham return a punt down multiple scores where he ends up getting smacked around and fumbling.

I don’t think him not playing the last series constitutes a benching. They were blown out and he may suck or may have read his press clippings, but he was not really benched.

I don’t disagree with that - I would love to see the cut block eliminated just about everywhere for safety, but it has real uses. The only other thing that I would say is maybe after the penalty- Milano attacks that blitz differently. Maybe instead of the full tilt attack - that opened him up to the hit. He rushes a bit more under control to jump or better avoid the RB - lessening the chance he ends up flying through the air and landing there. In this case it was a double whammy - he took a nasty tumble and got flagged. If it was just the hit, but he got to hit the QB with no penalty - then the players are more likely to dive that way opening themselves, the QBs, and the blockers up to more potential big hits and injury. I feel bad for Milano because I was obvious that he was just the victim of the circumstance and the play was not dirty in any way, but I can also understand still calling it a foul to protect the player.

I understand, but the NFL seems to disagree as they called it a penalty and it gets called like that the majority of times a QB is hit low. You can say you do not agree, but if it is called a penalty the majority of the times it happens - then the obvious guidance behind the rules must be the NFL deems that a penalty. There are a lot of penalties I do not agree with or think are ticky-Tac, but if they get called most of the time - then what I think is unimportant because the league has decided to call it that way - until they change it up with new guidance. It is legal to cut block him at this time.

It should not prevent blitzing - why would they want to prevent blitzing? They want the defenders attacking, but under control. You had guys like JP Losman, Carson Palmer, and most famously Tom Brady get taken out by defenders that ended up hitting the QB low around the knees. They wanted to lessen that chance - so they started making it illegal to hit a QB in the pocket down low and put a lot of guidance around that. It seems to have helped as knee injuries to the QB are less frequent- especially in the pocket. I think that penalizing the defender seems to have helped, but in the end sometimes things happen and guys get hurt, but working to have them hit in the body increases the protection.

I have no issue if you want to ban the low hits, but that is not currently the rule. You see defensive players get upended like that in every couple of games - they are still responsible for their momentum. Whether it helps or not is up for debate because it happens infrequently and without that getting called would it happen more? Would defensive players launch themselves more frequently and with more abandon if they were not penalized if the blocker touched them? We won’t know - only that currently it seems to be illegal and is a very infrequent issue.

It does not necessarily mean push, the DE could be rushing and beat him to the outside and the tackle could grab the arm and pull causing him to go into the QBs legs. The DT could bull rush and knock a guard on his back and the guard could pull him down and they collide with the QBs legs and it does not get called. The defining part seems to be the “blocker” creates the momentum that causes the impact. In this case the blocker caused the player to flip, but did not cause the momentum that brought him in contact. The NFL rules as written just do not cover every situation - it would be impossible- therefore there is leeway and guidance that helps the refs make a call.

The rule was written long ago - which is why they create videos to show the refs every off season and throughout the season how they want these called. The NFL rulebook ends up being super complicated because most rules were written and implemented when blocking was blocking not guys flying through and getting upended. They do do not go through and rewrite every rule as things get updated - they amend some, but use more teaching guides to show what they want and do not want. If you go go through the rule book as a lawyer- you will find tons of things that contradict each other or you can argue against, but in the end they want to protect he guy - they are calling that a foul most of the time.

No you were exactly right it is just the reason others are disagreeing- the word blocked is causing issues.

The problem with the “literal” interpretation of an NFL rule book is that we are not always privy to what they show them as specific examples of fouls and not fouls and why they are called that way. I have seen several times them bring in the “rules experts” and they talk about the rules and how the NFL has bunches of videos of acceptable and not acceptable plays to help guide the Refs. This is one that they talk about a couple of times a year and it always revolves around definition and explanation. Technically Milano is not blocked into the QB because the blocking player is moving away from the QB and therefore his contact and movement would not move Milano into the QB. The momentum and speed of Milano is what causes the contact. Yes it would not occur if the guy did not cut him, but the action of the cut is independent of the outcome. Unfortunately as a lawyer- you are looking at it as a hard and fast rule, but the NFL uses previous plays to guide the refs to better understand the current interpretation of the rules and that can be fluid to some degree. They do not want guys lunging wildly or diving over piles and taking out planted QBs - so the rules are interpreted to ensure that is not the case. They place a ton of emphasis on the defensive player being in control of themselves and maintaining body awareness. It sometimes leads to near impossible things that defenders must do, but the QB should be protected as much as possible - just as defenseless receivers should.

I think blocked is the problem people have with this. The correct call was made and that is exactly how it should be called. When they talk talk about being blocked into the QBs legs - they are talking about 2 players engaged with one another and the O-line either driving or forcing the defender into the QBs legs. They are not talking about that type of chip block because the guy blocking is not the pushing or moving him toward the QB. Milano blitzed with recklessness straight at the QB. The RB chipped and caught him low, but it was all of Milano’s momentum that forced the contact. It was not dirty and I would not expect it to be fined other than the standard roughing fine, but it was still the correct call. The defender has some responsibility over keeping themselves in control and in this case he was out of control - got flipped - and tried to continue on - which led to the contact - correct call. It is also a penalty (as was seen and correctly called in another game) if you hit and try to sack the QB and the hit starts around the waist - if you slide down and end up below the knees. Sometimes it sucks, but it makes a big difference when these are called.

I think Kitchens should be one and done, but I think with the easy 2nd half schedule - they are going to end up with 8+ wins and it will seem like they got better late and they will keep him for next year. When they falter again a change will come, but I think they might waste this year and next.

Look - I am not going to try and equate anything we currently see with long term success. You saw some of the traits last year that you are seeing this year from Mayfield, but it was all done under a cover of anonymity. The Browns were coming off a winless season and although very talented they showed very little cohesion. Baker became a de facto on field leader and Greg Williams (uggh) got the team prepared and they won games. The hiring of Kitchens to placate Baker and then the bringing in of offensive and defensive talent ramped up the pressure, but ultimately has lead to the team being a train wreck from a coaching and leadership standpoint. Baker has taken a major step back, but by the end of the season - his numbers will end up fine - they may even win the division and make the playoffs, but right now I doubt it. The issue I would have is the lack of progress shown. He looks less prepared and less able to handle the pressure than he did as a rookie. Allen on the other hand has shown progression and growth and has come a long way to show true leadership under high pressure situations. Baker was significantly better than Allen last year, but has regressed and is now behind Allen. Allen had a long way to go, but has passed Baker at this point and time, but the important question is future development. Can Allen continue to grow and does Baker return to his 2018 form. The future for both players is yet to be written and I am not willing to say one is going to be better based on small snippets of the season.

I think the staff is in way over as over their own heads, but after they struggle in the next 2 games Seahawks/Pats - they have a bunch of games the rest of the season they should be in. I unfortunately think they will still be competing with Baltimore for the division title come the last 2 weeks and I think that will keep the coaching staff safe - even if they should make a change. A bad division will will end up masking a lot of issues later and will actually hurt the Browns long term as they won’t make the needed changes. JMO

I was going to say the same thing - I thought he was about as bad as could be in that game - slow reads - slow throws. I am happy for him, but it only goes as long as the D and the running game takes them.

Considering the FO works hard with their staff to be ready for job offers or promotion- I would be floored if McDermott is not the same. I also think right now - they are focused on game to game study. There will be time to be ready for getting other offers.

When the coach specifically mentions a lack of fight on 2 ints thrown your way - I think that was alarming about his play. Duke (along with others) praised Zay and his helping get Duke prepared and ready to play Sunday. I don’t think there was anything other than play on the field. Zay seems to have bought in to what the team is teaching, but right now physically he just is not doing enough. Mentally he seemed to handle the demotion ok and supported his teammates and really supported Duke before and during the game.

The reality is that the Patriots have made a living off making trades for guys like AJ Green and Trent Williams, but only at their price. They trade for an AJ Green - use him up even more - let him walk for comp picks that replace or improve on what you gave up for him. The Pats though are at a different point in the success curve and can afford that because the core team is so strong. The Bills are not there yet and even comp picks right now do not balance the ask. In a few weeks if AJ Greens asking price drops to a 4th or a 5th then it is right in the Pats wheel house because he will sign a large contract returning a 3rd or 4th down the road.

Guess his key ? will not work Monday morning. Oh well - I feel for him but that is the NFL and he seemed checked out already based on a few press conferences.

Perfect - I am in for someone that can be a part of the team going forward and will not disrupt the chemistry. I want no part of guys like AJ Green or Trent Williams that although they will help this year - they have no long term value to sustainable success. This is where the Sabres were a few years ago and GM Murray started trading assets for short term talent and destroyed both a young, up and coming core and long term depth. Be patient and let them continue to grow.