thurst44

My favorite is he "never makes a big play." He may not rack up stats (yet), but I've re-watched games and see so many examples. He sacked a guy in the end zone for a safety. I also don't get the "lack of instincts" tag. He's captaining a lot of the defensive schemes, and led a top 3 D two years ago. Last year was ridiculous, so I'll give them a pass on the middle-of-the-league defense. Maybe when you think he's showing "bad instincts" he's actually doing what he's supposed to do?

Even if he ups his game to be in the consideration for DPoY as some experts have speculated he could?

He's been pretty close to elite to a lot of people. That said, I agree. I read your post as "sometimes you let good players go" with no caveat as to if he does have an elite season next year which there are many reasons to believe is possible. If I was wrong, I apologize. I'm just saying there's very good signs (i.e. Ravens game) that Edmunds can BE that elite LB they drafted him to be and will show that this year. If that's the case, there's no way they don't pay the man, and so far, this group of players has taken reasonable contracts to be a part of what's being built in Buffalo (to be the best version of themselves)

Yes, that's pretty close to exactly what I said (i just edited it a second ago and added two words in case i was not clear). Poster I was responding to implied that he was expendable regardless. I'm just saying that if he plays near his ceiling, that it would be ridiculous to think that Beane would let Edmunds walk. I'd argue in year two he was on the path to being worth the contract. Last year was a bit of a wash due to injury and the weirdness of the pandemic, so I believe there's a chance, especially based on the second-to-last game being the Ravens game where he took over the game and held the team to 3 pts., that he could play in year four in a manner that easily earns a second contract and while he can be polarizing, I'm not the only one who believes this.

Why wouldn't he pay him if he has a season like people expect he might. He's the captain of the defense, a leader: if he balls out and you let him walk in FA, that sets a terrible example for the rest of the team. You do have to let good players go sometimes--more likely that will be Poyer and/or Hyde as they get into their 30s, not a (then) 24 or 25-year-old, 1st round pick, head of your defense. They traded up to draft him ideally to lead their defense for the next decade. If he plays this year like he did in the Ravens game, then he'll be worth whatever the going rate is for a top 5 linebacker. If he plays closer to this year (which he was hurt often during), then maybe they let him go. At the very least, if they are dissatisfied, Beane will surely try to get something back for him.

That one did not bother me, but then he retweeted a guy who called people who believe in the science behind vaccinations nazis. My reactions to his trending on Twitter is starting to get like the guy in this series of sketches (he also plays ScarJo's publicist and Nic Cage's agent)...

Nothing's equivalent to the Buffalo, NY, State of Mind....

Bills fans regularly packed two bars which were next door to one another on 2nd Avenue & 42nd St. in NYC. Now it's a huge place called Public House that gets packed with Bills supporters every Sunday. I have Sunday Ticket now, but when I would go weekly, if you didn't get there by 12:30 or so, you were not getting into the main bar (which was fine with me, b/c it was just too crowded). Admittedly during the drought years, the crowd would dwindle as our hopes did until it could be a ghost town in December. I'm in Jersey now and have been to three different Hoboken Bills Bars, a Jersey City Bills Bar, and a Paterson Bills Bar that was at the edge of the universe. I also found a bar in DC, when we were visiting my mother-in-law, that had a pretty good crowd for that Christmas eve Miami game where Rex Ryan decided to punt with a few minutes left in OT even though there was still a faint chance of making the playoffs. On opening day in 2019, wound up scheduled to fly back from a wedding in Seattle and almost went to a Bills Bar there, but my wife drew the line there, worried we would miss our plane (I wound up watching the replay on GamePass as we waited at our gate (ffwding a lot) and I must have looked a sight as I went crazy when Allen hit Brown along the sideline to complete the comeback. There's even a tacky nightclub place a few blocks from me on the border of Bloomfield and Newark that supposedly shows the Bills games.

I cannot narrow it down to one player and that has a lot to do with why I'm so excited about this team--they were 13-3 yet have a bevy of players who could take a huge jump forward (my list in order of): Ed Oliver Dawson Knox Tremaine Edmunds (from marginal Pro Bowler to potential DPoY) AJ Epenesa Gabriel Davis Dane Jackson Cody Ford Devin Singletary and/or Zach Moss There are even players on the bubble like Efe Obada and Justin Zimmer who harbor the potential to make a jump. I'm giddy for this season!

That's a very good point--a lot of last year's offensive production could have been inflated by last year's weird nature. It's been what I've been arguing as to why our D slipped. The lack of practice might have hit defenses more than offenses--and certain sorts of defenses more than other. That said, the higher likelihood that our offense's needle is pointed up than down and the extra game should help Bills get over 500 yards.

Agreed! The flipside of the whole he's a raw player with only one year at his position is that he was second to Chase Young (just one QB takedown behind) in sacks in the whole country the first year he ever played that position.

I voted 500 or more, because I can't help but believe this team is only scratching the surface of what they are capable of both overall and offensively. As much as there's a possibility Josh could regress, he also could be continuing to improve. Knox could figure out his issues, a 30-year-old Ertz could finally arrive and rebound to the form he played the six seasons prior to his injury-riddled 2020. Gabriel Davis could evolve into a star. Singletary and Moss (and/or Breida or even Williams or Wade) could have breakout years and the running game could actually be a factor. A lot of people seem to completely dismiss Singletary, forgetting that he had an a great year just two seasons ago. Even last year he put up 4.4ypc and if you watch highlights he had well more than the zero big plays at big moments people attribute to him. Who knows what Moss can bring and Breida's still young and has had some moments over his career. I'm not saying I think it's guaranteed that they'll score over 500 pts again (despite my vote i'm not even sure it's 50/50)--and importantly, they might not need to given the defensive drop was a likely aberration--but it's more likely than not given that all the elements are still there and so many of them have quite possibly not neared their potential, including Josh Allen.

Sorry, that wasn't there when I started the post and with the heat I'm moving quite sloth-like and am easily distracted :).

Are we really not even mentioning a guy on our own favorite team who had the same number of INTs as Gilmore while allowing zero TDs in 2019--a guy whose numbers in pretty much every way were within range, the guy who was the other All-Pro CB that year?! I'd think we'd mention his name as contender for better CB of 2019 before Ramsey or Peterson :)!!!

Yeah, I think we are really ceding the Chiefs the offensive talent a bit fast. I'd say Mahomes is ahead of Allen, but how Hill/Hardman/Robinson/whoever is 4 that much better than Diggs/Sanders/Beasley/Davis. As down as we are on Singletary, his first year numbers were close to Edwards-Helaire's and Singletary's YPC were actually way higher. Singletary's numbers this year weren't that far behind. The Chefs O-Line is better names-wise but it's a mostly new line, but we'll see how it goes and PFF (not exactly Bills-friendly territory) rated our line as above average in both run (barely), pass (by a decent margin). Kelce really is the only reason I might put KC ahead. As a team, they've played better than we have recently and clearly (and with no mitigating circumstances) have played us like they are the better team. Hopefully, the third season of both our teams being contenders will have us catching up to them.

You might want to look at the rest of the Titans roster as it does not run deep. They have a solid o-line. There is practically zero at the skill positions behind those guys. Their secondary looks like it could be absolute trash save for Kevin Byard. Really! You really are going to act like there was NOTHING weird about that game, like it wasn't an anomaly. It's also weird that no one seems to get that they lost a ton of players on defense. The defense could turn out to be very good again. Autry is a solid pickup. It's hard to tell if Dupree was part of a system. Jeffrey Simmons has done well for them so far. Landry, Evans, and Brown are good young players. The Titans could be a contender, but I don't get why people are going so far out of their way to prop up a team that played worse than us last year, did not get as far in the playoffs, and have less talent and depth no matter how you slice it because of one game where we all know there were very weird mitigating factors--besides the fact of any given Sunday. Again, by your logic, the Jets are better than the Browns b/c they beat the Browns when the latter could still lose their playoff spot.

Oh for crying out loud, how am I "completely writing them off." I've never said they were a bad team nor even not a contender, but by your same logic, you are completely writing off your own team. You are also completely discounting the idea that losing players means something. Julio Jones is a great signing (how many times can I say that?), but it does not mean they got better as a whole from the last season compared to the Bills. Think of it this way: one team gains one major player and loses, let's say, six, while another team adds no significant players but loses no one either. Which team improved more? Also, look closely at the team. Yes, a team with Tannehill (IF he is the Tannehill of late 2019 through 2020 and not the Tannehill of the rest of his career)/Henry/Julio Jones/AJ Brown is not going to be terrible, but it is a steep drop-off of depth. Their slot receiver, Josh Reynolds, has gone over 500 yards once in his career. Their next two receivers are guys who have been on and off the roster all year. Their starting tight end is comparable to Dawson Knox, but with one more "meh" season under his belt (honestly, i think either Firkser or Knox could make a leap next year). There's a good chance we'll cut WRs as good as their third best pass catcher. And their defense could be a big ol' mess. There's a reason Vegas still gives us a much better chance than the Titans. And what's with your smug discussion earlier about "some people with one good season" etc. You realize we were also in the playoffs last year with a very good season and have improved year-over-year tremendously the last three years. If you think this is a fluke, well, you're at odds with most national experts and you're being unnecessarily negative at a time you really should be enjoying the direction of the team. Yes, it was a fluke. I'm glad we now agree

You realize there's more to teams than QBs who can improve, right. Edmunds, Oliver, Epenesa, Knox, Singletary, Moss, Ford, even Allen, White, Milano, and Dawkins are 27 or under and many have likely come nowhere near their peak. Their defense was top 3 in 2018 and 2019, and there's many reasons to believe they'll bounce back. When you knock us for not replacing our right tackle b/c he had a bad game you kind of gloss over the fact that Darryl Williams is still well under 30 was an all-pro just a few years ago and was considered one of the best in the league last year by most sources, even PFF. Do you really think replacing him will make us better. And if you're right, we drafted a huge right tackle prospect in the draft. Ok, if you want to go that way, I was arguing more about the idiom and the way you were using it. Yes, they are "excuses" but they are VERY VALID EXCUSES. "I lost to him in the marathon because I had a broken leg and he was on a scooter" "My cake was not as good as theirs because they were given flour and sugar and I was given rocks and gravel" My point was the loss was excusable. Anyway, we had 13 wins, they had 11, we won two games in the post-season, they won zero. If you look at the first five games of the Titans, they lost to the Vikings, Texans, Broncos, and Jaguars by a total of 6 pts (in regulation). Does it not seem like an anomaly that the 13-3 Bills were blown out? Again, should we consider the Jets better than the Browns last year b/c they beat them in a game that almost prevented the Browns from making the playoffs. Football is known for Any Given Sunday and that this game was played on a Tuesday should be all the more reminder that it was a weird game and we should not really use it as a major source for determining the strength of teams. They signed Jones, but they also lost a whole lot of their defense and a young WR with almost 1000 yards and their starting tight end. Oh, and you mention Clowney as a reason another team improved without mentioning that it was the Titans (the whole topic of this thread) who lost him. Their first round pick may not play next year. The Titans signing Julio Jones is a good move for them and makes them better than they were in May of 2021, but on the whole it does not likely make up for the net loss they've had of players since the end of 2020. It was an off-season that had many experts expecting they would be the team to collapse this year. Titans are still a tier below us and I predict we beat them for the third time in the last four years.

He wasn't nearly as much of a pain in the rear when in Miami and his OC just left for Atlanta coaching job and he'll be 33. He could be a late bloomer, even better in 2021 and play at a high level until he's 40, but there's probably better odds that he regresses this year and the last couple years were fluky or part of a system.

They also got worse before this during the off-season. They may have beat us, but you have to admit that it was absurd circumstances. It's not excuses, it's facts. Based on a whole season, the Titans were a lesser team to us. They also lost a lot in free agency and their top draft pick may not even play next year. It's a good pick up, but the Titans have way more question marks than we do. Tannehill has been meh most of his career and is now 32 and lost the only coach who has got the best out of him. Jones is a good pick-up, but we're still the much better, much more complete team and it's not that close, even if they beat us on one of the weirdest given Tuesdays.

Sorry, but that Bills-Titans game last year has a big ol' asterisk next to it, and I think you know that. The Titans had an astounding 16-day rest while the Bills had to practice for both Titans and Chiefs, not knowing which team they were playing. And if you're gonna say, well, the Titans had a lot of players out with COVID, we also had Tre White and Matt Milano out and Tremaine playing with one arm for all intents and purposes. Yes, they won, but it says nothing about whether they were better than us. Were the Jets better than the Browns last year--the Browns lost under normal circumstances with the playoffs still on the line. I'm impatient for the Titans rematch this year, b/c I could see it being a revenge game.

Yes, and there was nothing weird about that game at all. It's not like the Titans had 16 days rest or anything while Bills didn't know who they were playing against until the last minute. Also, he never took the field at the same time as Tannehill or Mariota. A win is a win is a win, so you can't say a team has another team's number when you've won against them two out of three times and the third time was one of the most asterisky situations. I want the Bills to beat the Chefs, because they clearly have our number and are the team to get past to get to the Super Bowl. I want the Bills to beat the Titans b/c last year's game still leaves a bad taste in my mouth (don't like how they flouted the rules then acted like the victims) and I want the beatdown to be thorough so there is zero doubt.

Enjoy your season. I'm fine with the Packers winning any game they are not playing the Bills.

Love choice 3 there going in a different direction, re-defining "drive."

My real pick would be the Colts drive people have mentioned--that was just a "you can't script it" moment that absolutely changed the momentum of a playoff game. My second pick and I'm surprised no one mentioned it since it's the flip of the Arizona game--our guys get the win after the opposing team took the lead on a dramatic drive that usually would win the game. Although there was 4:30 or so left (just checked: exactly 4:30). I'm talking about the Rams game. One of the announcers: "For the Bills this is not the time you panic, this is the time you win" Start at own 25 with 4:30 left 4th qtr: - (4:30) 1st & 10: Crisp pass up the center to Cole Beasley to own 43 - (3:51) 1st & 10: Allen spins out of the rush, looks like he might have gotten away and that's initial call, but he clearly was down and on challenge, it's a sack and big loss to own 31. - (3:44) 2nd & 22: Another messy play. Allen is running for his life, almost sacked twice, goes for a sideline pass where Gabriel Davis and Cole Beasley crash into each other and neither comes down with it. - (3:21) 3rd & 22: Needed 22, Allen to Beasley gets 23. What a big-time play and exactly why Beasley may have even been underrated last year as he always seems to be in just the right place on these long plays where we desperately need him. We're at Rams 47. - (2:31) 1st & 10: Low, slant pass to McKenzie behind line of scrimmage, he scrambles for 5. Dawkins hurt (but we're in future so we know it was ok). We're at the Rams 42. - Allen tries to get Rams to jump but takes it to 2-minute warning - (2:00) 2nd & 5: Wow, a run. A gutsy scramble by Singletary for 8 to the right for a 1st down. At Rams 34. - (1:37) 1st & 10: Neat pass right down the middle at about the first down marker to Beasley for a gain of 19 and Beas just keeps pushing. In the RZ at Rams 15. - (1:04) 1st & 10: Ugly play. Allen scrambles and throws an iffy but not dangerous lateral(?)/forward pass(?) and it goes out of bounds. Oh well, time off the clock, on to next play. - (0:49) 2nd & 10: Another ugly play. Allen is under attack, he manages to get out of a huge sack loss from about three Rams defenders and throws it out of the end zone. Unfortunately, he's called for a 15-yard face mask penalty. How often do you see that?!?!?! Do we let it get to us? We're all the way back to Rams 30. - (0:36) 2nd & 25: Allen under crazy duress overthrows sideline pass to Singletary into double coverage. It's not looking good, this is going to be a painful loss. - (0:31) 3rd & 25: Allen finally gets a relatively clean if small pocket and fires a perfect pass in the middle of the field to Diggs in double coverage for 17 yards. At Rams 14. - (0:25) 4th & 8: We know this one. Allen overthrows Davis in the end zone, it's over and this one is gonna really hurt. But there's a late flag. Holding on Rams. Was it the right call. Was that interception earlier a bs call?* I'm chalking it up to karma, but sometimes you gotta be a bit lucky and Allen put us in the position to win. I'll take it. Fwiw, Mike Pereira calls it a good call. We're at the Rams 4. - (0:21) 1st & 10: There it is. Line finally comes through. Allen backpedals and throws a high strike to a wide-open Tyler Kroft. TOUCHDOWN! - (0:15) Kick is good! There was surely some luck involved and it definitely wasn't pretty, but it's a lot of why this team will be dominant as long as Allen remains Allen (especially if he's not even at his peak yet). They calmly and collectedly took over 4 of the 4.5 minutes off the clock like a team that knew this wasn't desperation, like a team that knew they were going to get this TD and wanted to make sure they didn't give the Rams another bite of the apple. Allen was darting and diving and under attack the whole drive. There were two great plays at 3rd and 20-plus. Allen delivered a couple of head-scratchers but did not let it get him down. After blowing a 25-point lead in the second half, most teams would have been defeated, but the Bills got right back up and played like a championship team does. *Coda: The phantom interception still irks me and when analysts would say they won on a fluke blown call penalty, I would rage (i need to see someone about that ;)) that they should not have even been in this position if not for a call that made it seem like the refs wanted to make sure L.A. was in a game, but I saw something yesterday which mollifies me a bit. I was watching through the 2017 season in the background while working and in the first game there was a Poyer INT where the receiver caught it and had the ball at the end, but Poyer had got some control of the ball going down. So, at the very least, we had got the benefit of the same ridiculous call in the past. And it was the Jets driving in a position to change the momentum of the game.