Thurman#1

No, he's a terrific head coach. But yeah, having a terrific QB and roster is more important to winning than having a terrific coach.

Sure, there'll be examples both ways.

Yup, exactly.

Probably what changed within the organization is that before the season they thought he'd shut up about it during the season and at least follow the Covid rules. Then as he ran up fines, refused to follow rules he didn't like, kept talking during the season, and caused distractions and pissed and moaned about Bills fans, a lot of folks there lost patience. That'll change how people react to you. There are still at least a couple of guys on this team who were anti-vax. Whatever changed within the organization apparently didn't change much in relation to those guys. Just to Beasley. It's not hard to understand.

BADOL said "Brandon Beane said Shakir was a slot receiver." Thought not. Thanks for telling me where to find it. I went and listened. I've got to say, while I think you fairly summarized things, I didn't think that saying Kumerow's name first meant they're assuming he'll be the first guy in. Sounded to me more like he's the first guy of the guys who are not also running time at the slot. "We feel as a veteran big guy that he can help us." That's not a commitment of any sort as to who'll be in first. The question specifically said that they were strong in the slot but what about outside depth. Seemed natural to me that Beane would first mention a guy who was not running in the slot. And he immediately then added in Crowder, Shakir, Hodgins. "We like the depth where we're at there." https://www.audacy.com/podcasts/howard-and-jeremy-20258/hjs-bills-general-manager-brandon-beane-1516265348 If you're right and they're thinking of Kumerow as first in there, that would concern me a bit too. And he did say, "Shakir had a nice day yesterday, I think position 1 for him is probably right now slot as well, but he can play outside, he's got some versatility." Wouldn't be shocked to see them bring someone in, particularly in case of injury.

To quote your own self, "Where and when did Brandon Beane say this?" When did he say "Shakir was a slot"? I miss things, so I suppose it's possible. If I missed it, I'd love to see a link. Show me a link where he said that. What I've seen them say is that he may be primarily seen as a slot but that they're teaching him all the positions and that he's playing very well everywhere they put him and that he could see work in several places. Just yesterday we got this: "Offensive coordinator Ken Dorsey says he and the coaches are still getting to know Shakir’s skillset, particularly since the receiver missed some time during OTAs. “'He's going to continue to grow in his role, and we're going to continue to find out what he can do, whether it's inside, outside or anything like that,' Dorsey said. “I don't ever want to handcuff any of our guys. I want to be able to kind of see all of what they can do.” "Dorsey is also experimenting with all receivers as he molds the offense to his liking. It can be a lot to take in for a rookie such as Shakir, who’s already navigating the jump the NFL. But Shakir doesn’t mind that there’s still some ambiguity on what his role may be. “'I just keep an open mind every single day,' Shakir said. 'I'm not really one to try to figure out what they're trying to do with me. It's more of just show up, and wherever they put me, wherever they need me, keep an open mind, and make sure that whatever spot they do put me in, I go and attack it with the right mindset and a level of intensity that stands out and shows when I'm out there on the field.'” HERE'S THE LINK: https://buffalonews.com/sports/bills/rookie-receiver-khalil-shakir-is-a-special-kid/article_53136244-15cb-11ed-9994-27542e85ff0a.amp.html Chad Hall recently said pretty much the same thing, that he's running inside and outside, that he understands and performs very well at all of the positions and that his options are open. HERE'S THE LINK: https://www.buffalobills.com/video/chad-hall-on-the-slot-receiver-impact-in-the-bills-offense-bills-by-the-numbers- Again, I'll wait to see if you have a link that says anything anywhere near as cut and dry as that he's a slot. If you do, I'll give you your due. But I haven't seen anything like it, and my guess is you can't find one.

Cleared of charges means you were acquitted or exonerated. He wasn't. The charges were dropped, which is different. He might be innocent. Equally, he might be guilty but the victims figured they'd rather be rich than honest. ------------------- "Broward prosecutors dropped the robbery charges against Baker on Monday, the same day the Sheriff’s Office arrested Dean on a charge of extortion. "Baker’s attorney, Bradford Cohen, had argued from the start of the case in May that the alleged victims of the robbery were in it for the money. The men accused Baker of threatening them with a handgun and stealing thousands of dollars in cash and jewelry over a gambling dispute in Miramar. "Charges against a co-defendant, Seattle Seahawks player Quinton Dunbar, fizzled out after the victims signed affidavits swearing he was not involved in the robbery. According to case records, the men had been paid a combined total of $55,000 by Dunbar at a Miami law office days after the alleged robbery. "Earlier this month, the victims signed sworn statements saying Baker, too, was not involved in the robbery. "Dean, who represented three of the victims, tried to get Baker to pay each of them $266,000, promising they would stop cooperating with prosecutors in exchange. "According to the Sheriff’s Office, Dean made arrangements for them to sign the new statements exonerating Baker. Dean had told Cohen that the victims would do “anything" as long as they’re paid, the Sheriff’s Office said. "The affidavits were delivered. The money was not. "Cohen declined to discuss his role in obtaining the new statements, but said Baker paid the men “Zero dollars, with a capital Z.” Prosecutors said the conduct of the victims left them powerless to bring Baker to justice even if he did commit a crime. “Their credibility is inalterably tarnished,” prosecutor Paul Valcore wrote in a memo explaining the Broward State Attorney’s Office’s decision to drop the charge. Baker, 23, a cornerback, was the New York Giants' first round pick in the 2019 draft. He graduated from Miami Northwestern High School in 2015 and went on to attend the University of Georgia. "Baker was with the team until after prosecutors charged him with pulling a gun on the gambling party and stealing $73,500 in cash and valuables, including an $18,000 Rolex watch, a Hublot watch valued at $25,000, an Audemars Piguet watch valued at $17,500, a $600 Richard Mille knock-off watch, and at least $12,400 in cash. "Miramar police obtained arrest warrants for the two players. But before they could be carried out, the four victims attended a meeting at the Miami office of attorney Mike Grieco, a Democratic member of the Florida House of Representatives who just won re-election unopposed. At Grieco’s office on May 15, according to case documents, the four men signed the sworn statements clearing Dunbar, Grieco’s client at the time. When investigators confronted the victims about the flip-flop, the men confessed they had been paid off, according to records released by Miramar police. "The case against Dunbar was hopelessly tainted, and prosecutors cited “insufficient evidence” when they declined to formally charged him. Baker was charged with robbery in August and released from the Giants a month later. "Cohen, Baker’s lawyer, criticized the State Attorney’s Office for pursuing charges against Baker even after the case against Dunbar collapsed. Dean remained in custody throughout the day Monday. His record with the Florida Bar is unblemished, according to the Bar’s website. A message left at the office of his Miami firm, Ford, Dean and Rotundo, was not returned Monday." ------------------ https://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/crime/fl-ne-deandre-baker-charges-dropped-20201116-smav26dgf5c5dozkljliej4x6u-story.html His lawyers are saying it was all a setup. The city is implying they think it happened but there's no chance of getting a conviction with the witnesses so thoroughly tarnished. It's not clear what happened.

12 STs snaps in 2019, 3 in 2020 and zero in 2021. And around $1.4M more expensive than Kumerow. $1.4M is about 40% of their remaining cap space. They don't seem eager to kick more cans down the road and weaken their position next year. The Bills love Kumerow for STs. Wouldn't be too surprised to see another WR brought in if they feel they need one, and particularly in case of injuries, but I'm betting if they do, he'll be cheapish. I'm wondering if it might be Sanders. But my guess is they feel that in case of injury they could play a mix of Crowder, Shakir, maybe Kumerow and whoever's on the roster / practice squad. Maybe a lot of two TE formations or other groups. They'd like to bring someone in all being equal and the right guy being available. But they don't seem to think it's a necessity. Maybe they'll change their mind at some point but right now that seems to be where they're at.

Last year Peters played on a one-year $1.075M contract. I don't think money is going to be the problem, not when you're signing him in August. And Peters did play a solid competent 2021 at LT for the Bears. Played 15 games competently. There are many reasons competent guys might not be signed already beyond competence and money. Teams might want to give their current youngsters playing time, they might have a guy as good as Peters who they want to groom and give experience to. They might figure since Peters is still available now, he will probably still be available in case of injury. They might figure older guys are injury prone and want to bring in a younger guy. I don't think they'll bring in Peters, but my guess is he's still plenty competent. For how long is a very legitimate question, of course. This is what I think stops the deal from happening. It's also why the Giants may end up getting rid of him. If they even like Slayton, this is one of the main reasons they're not likely to trade for him.

Say what you will. The truth is anyone arguing that the round a guy is picked shows he's good or bad just doesn't get it. That goes either way. You can't use a first round pick to show the guy will be a success, and you can't use a late round pick to show he'll be a failure. The round a guy is picked is super-important right up to draft day. After you're picked, it's all how you perform. The reason your argument here is pulling so much crap is because it's simply a stupid argument.

This is the thing that has me in awe of Josh. He sees an area where he has to improve (doubtless with lots of consultation and advice but he knows good advice from bad and doesn't have an ego about constructive criticism), he figures out an efficient and effective way to make the improvement and he gets it done. It sounds so very easy, but so very few people manage it consistently, and even fewer do it as well as Josh does. Every year he picks a couple of areas where he wants to improve, and then the next year we see the changes on the field.

Yeah, he had a consistency problem. A very great deal of which was caused by his mechanical problems. Josh himself has gone on and on about how learning those mechanical things has made him both better and more consistent. The media did indeed go on about his problems with accuracy, but while they certainly did mention completion percentage as ONE of the things that backed it up, that wasn't all. It just wasn't. It was among other things throw after throw after throw where he would make an insane completion into the tiniest of windows followed immediately by another where he would throw to a guy who was wide open and overthrow him by five feet or bounce it three feet short of him. If you can't throw the ball to where it's supposed to be with consistency, you're not accurate. It doesn't matter whether you want to call it accuracy or consistency, guys who have this problem don't make it in the league. Josh fixed the problem by fixing his mechanics and fundamentals over the next two years. Throwing a ball through a tire isn't any kind of measure of accuracy in a football game. It's a measure of accuracy in throwing a football through a tire. Nobody's rushing you when you throw it through a tire. Tires aren't moving. You don't have to make two or three reads before you throw to a tire. Nobody's guarding them. Football will lay bare mechanical problems in a way that just hitting a target can't. He was not a great natural thrower. He was a guy with the potential to become a great thrower. He was a guy who had the body and the brain necessary to become a great thrower, with a ton of improvement and adjustment. He was a guy who was able to become a great thrower with a ton of work at improving his mechanics and fundamentals. He would tell you the same.

What in the world are you talking about? That article is overwhelmingly positive and excited. Sully gets it just fine and the article is a good one. Made me remember the Kelly - Thurman - Bruce days. Could you quick point out where Sully expressed resentment at the happiness of others? Because having read the whole article, I can't find one word to indicate this. What he said was about jealousy (referring to the wish that the Bills teams of his boyhood had been much better), not resentment of the good luck of the young Bills fans of today. He wants those young fans to deeply understand how good they have it, and to enjoy it to the fullest. I'm with him. I've got a 20 year-old nephew who grew up in Boston. He can't even begin to understand what Boston sports fans dealt with for the decades before he started to follow the Sox and the Pats. Now he often complains that it's no fun to follow those teams anymore. He was spoiled silly. I told him much the same thing Sully said here, enjoy the living hell out of this purple patch because it won't last forever. He told me I didn't know what I was talking about. Now he's starting to get it.

You may have thought there was anything wrong with his mechanics or his fundamentals, Shaw. Thing is, Josh himself did. Both he and his QB coach, Jordan Palmer, very publicly talked about mechanics changes he needed to make and was making. They talked early about standing with his feet too far apart, later about the fact that he was often stepping with his front foot in the wrong way, which essentially froze his hips and meant he was using only his upper body in the throw. They talked about needing to use his body differently when he needed to take something off the shorter throws and lobs, and later still about twisting his hips as part of the motion. All publicly, all on video, many times. Then after his third year you heard nothing more about physical mechanics and it was all about what he needed to think differently about. As I go through your post I lose track of what you're saying. You start out saying he had no mechanical problems. Then in the last paragraph you talk about his mechanical problems. Yeah, the mechanical problems you talk about in the last paragraph are exactly the mechanical problems people talk about when they say that it's huge for QBs and can destroy or create accuracy. Allen had major mechanical problems early on. And he wasn't consistently accurate. As he fixed those, he got much more consistently accurate, and the two are absolutely related in terms of cause and effect. Yes, Diggs also works on fundamentals and mechanics. All players do. Because bad fundamentals - and Josh had them - mean bad effects on your play, and good fundamentals mean you can play better and better access your body's full potential. Allen hadn't gone through the camp circuit that most highly ranked young high school and college QBs go through where they get coached on fundamentals and mechanics among other things. Allen hadn't been invited to those camps. And it showed in his game. Can't disagree that he needed to get his game under control, or that he needed discipline. He did. But he also, without question, needed to make and successfully made mechanical and fundamental changes to the way he physically threw the ball. Several of those changes contributed greatly to his getting his game under control. Your thoughts about baseball pitchers and how they can more easily groove their mechanics are very fair for baseball and pitchers. But there isn't the slightest question that QBs also have fundamentals and mechanics that can improve their game or greatly degrade it. You yourself point that out talking about Brady. Allen absolutely did have that problem. Again, lots of video out there with Palmer talking about the mechanical changes he and Josh were working on. "Diggs had natural talent that he had to refine to become who he is," you say. Yeah, without question. And part of that refinement was learning and honing his mechanics. You're precisely right that the same was true for Allen.

I totally understand the urge to jump in and protect Allen, and it's true that the supporting cast wasn't good. But no, Brady would not have looked like garbage. And part of the problem is that Allen's throwing just didn't look good most of the time. You could see he was competitive as hell, you could see he was a terrific athlete, but he absolutely needed to get a ton better at throwing the ball accurately in a consistent manner. Thing is, he did. He had already improved visibly and obviously through the draft process, but his fundamentals and his mechanics still needed a lot of work during that first year. And people are right when they say that it's fairly rare to make major improvements in accuracy and in mechanics. It's absolutely not impossible, and I among many others was screaming that at the time. But if his mechanics and the consistency of his accuracy had not improved vastly, he might not have made it. It was not at all a sure thing. But the thing that sets Allen apart is his ability to change whatever part of his game he aims at not just on a surface level but to make deep major improvements with time. He did that, and it has made all the difference.

I have some more religious friends who say this often and in case of problems not sized anywhere near as large as the language always makes me think. I hope that's what's happening here. Wishing you the best, Dion.

That's the situation. There are a lot of guys who might be able to fill in. This is an offense that has had smaller guys as their #3 receiver the last two years. If none of them work out, (my guess is they pepper them all in and out in case of an injury) the coaching staff will surely let Beane know. They could bring Sanders back. Sanders greatly outproduced Julio Jones last year despite not having a great year. If not Sanders, someone else decent, cheap and smart. Some people seem to want excellent players at every position. And it doesn't work that way. Even before the salary cap every team had weaknesses. It's just the way things work in complicated systems. When they fix the weakest position, then people complain about what used to be the second-weakest position which has now fallen to worst. Fix the weakest two positions and people will complain about the third-weakest which has now fallen to weakest. It never ends.

Not sure you understand the word "inevitably."

Precisely. That's exactly the question.

It's not the political views themselves. I really don't think that's it at all. It's the fact he's showed he's willing to take fines for ignoring league and team rules he doesn't like. It's that he feels the need to talk about his views even during camp, and even during the season. Teams want their guys focused. Beasley has showed he feels comfortable starting distractions during the season. There are several guys on the Bills who are anti-vax and are still on the team today. Not Beasley. And while part of that is absolutely that he's lost a step, a lot more of it is that he won't shut up and focus. And speaking of "lost a step," you ask if he can get a first down for the Bills when needed, and the answer appears to be that he's pretty likely to be able to do that if the defense is kind enough to play zone for him, but if they're in man his odds drop a lot. That certainly factors in, here and around the league.

Yeah, no. You can't even begin to guarantee that anymore than you can guarantee snow on Christmas Day this year. He didn't even come close to confirming that he's a lock. He did very clearly confirm that he thinks highly of Allen and Edmunds. But that's not the only factor. There's the cap. There's who else they sign. There's his performance this year. If Edmunds is asking to top the market he's unlikely to be here. If he's willing to take a good but not outstanding offer, he likely will, IMO. Not a sure thing, though. I see Roquan Smith isn't coming to camp. If Edmunds had pulled that, he'd be gone if we go by their regular M.O.

Oh, Golly, I hope he's OK. I'll send some good wishes his way.

Me too, but not for the Bears.

People have probably already answered, but he's writing a ton at the Athletic. EDIT: Sorry to pile on. Joe's coverage is thoughtful and good. He puts in a ton of time watching and dissecting the tape, and it shows.

The reason being that the News were wusses. This column is totally reasonable, particularly as he points out that he picked 'em for the SB last year. That could make you a little gunshy the year after. Jerry's never believed in the Bills? Despite picking them to make the Super Bowl last year? Despite having Cam as the leader for Coach of the Year seven games into the Trent season? Nonsense. He has covered them through a truly awful period. He is indeed skeptical and a pessimist. Call him a curmudgeon as well. But when they have looked good, he has had no problem acknowledging it. Oh, so Jerry predicted missing the playoffs? Oh, wait, he didn't. Yet another of the constant stream of straw man arguments we see on here so often.