jonramz Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Just taking a look at some old stats about that team... http://footballoutsiders.com/stats/teameff2004 Football outsiders had them as the 3rd best team in the league w/ 11.8 estimated wins. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/buf/2004.htm 7th in the league in scoring, 8th in the league in scoring defense, 6th in point differential, +10 turnover ratio and 4 losses of 5 points or less... Probably our best team since the 1999 team, so it seems like every 5 years we have a good team... which leads us to 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jax bill backer Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 this is actualy a great observation...thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOBILLS78 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Ernest Wilford! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuffMuff Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Mularkey screwed us, he wasnt even around long enough to feel the wrath of a true Bills fans... See Skeletor comments....or ask G. Williams. Good points though - they did lose some close ones and any year sweeping the Fish is a +. Malarkey was a spinless weasel. Long live Skeletor! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Knock the ball down, Nate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOBILLS78 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Almost felt like the old days in the second half of that season when they were really rolling. Loved beating the piss out of the Seahawks. And Jason Peters' touchdown on the punt block in Cincinnati. Sacking Cleveland seven times and holding them to 29 yards on the ground. That was one of the worst offensive performances I have ever seen first-hand. Good stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phlegm Alley Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Knock the ball down, Nate! Jimmy Smith. 4th and long. Under 2 minutes remaining. Home opener. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VJ91 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Jimmy Smith. 4th and long. Under 2 minutes remaining. Home opener. Get over that hail mary by Leftwich in week one already. When it really counted, late in the season, the Bills came home off a 6 game winning streak. Six straight wins leading up to week 17....(poor DJ would probably have a heart attack if his Buffalo Bills could end a season like that) Last home game of the season, against the Steelers who had everything sewn up and were only playing a choice few starters. We had no way of knowing until late that night, but with a win over that less then full strength Steelers team would have put the Bills in the playoffs....even though Nate didn't knock the ball down in week one. What happened? Of course Bledsoe played like a frieghtened rookie, the defense could not stop third string Wille Parker running behind 2nd and 3rd string blockers, and the Bills lost the damn game that Cowher was trying to hand them. The fact that Parker ending up being a premier running back the next couple years did not make me feel any better. He was the 3rd stringer for that game, and the Bills "great" defense sucked when it needed to be at it's best. Sorry, but I had to remind the 2004 fans that the season was worse then they think. And the way they fell apart in 2005, dumping Bledsoe and starting Lost-man finishing 5-11-0, was a more fitting season then the "fake" success of '04. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turn Down For Watkins Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Just taking a look at some old stats about that team... http://footballoutsiders.com/stats/teameff2004 Football outsiders had them as the 3rd best team in the league w/ 11.8 estimated wins. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/buf/2004.htm 7th in the league in scoring, 8th in the league in scoring defense, 6th in point differential, +10 turnover ratio and 4 losses of 5 points or less... Probably our best team since the 1999 team, so it seems like every 5 years we have a good team... which leads us to 2009 I was comparing that team to our team this year and their are alot of similarities. Here's the breakdown. QB's- Even RB- Were better this year Wr's- Very similar 2 WR tandem this year compared to 2004, Even Offense- Potential to be better Defense- Potential to be even, That's unlikely though Coaching- Mularky isn't great but Jaruon isn't either, I'll say Even. I'd certainly take a 9-7 record with our schedule this year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Well, there wasn't much in the ways of prestige for the NFC West in 2004, just like it cushioned 3 wins for us in 2008. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San Jose Bills Fan Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Week 17 against Pittsburgh. They had clinched a playoff spot and played many reserves. We were in a "win and in" situation. The score was closer than the actual game. We got our butts kicked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Mike Mularkey is a lot better coach than a lot of people gave he credit for. Losman killed him here, as he killed Jauron's first 2 seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Get over that hail mary by Leftwich in week one already. When it really counted, late in the season, the Bills came home off a 6 game winning streak. Six straight wins leading up to week 17....(poor DJ would probably have a heart attack if his Buffalo Bills could end a season like that) Last home game of the season, against the Steelers who had everything sewn up and were only playing a choice few starters. We had no way of knowing until late that night, but with a win over that less then full strength Steelers team would have put the Bills in the playoffs....even though Nate didn't knock the ball down in week one. What happened? Of course Bledsoe played like a frieghtened rookie, the defense could not stop third string Wille Parker running behind 2nd and 3rd string blockers, and the Bills lost the damn game that Cowher was trying to hand them. The fact that Parker ending up being a premier running back the next couple years did not make me feel any better. He was the 3rd stringer for that game, and the Bills "great" defense sucked when it needed to be at it's best. Sorry, but I had to remind the 2004 fans that the season was worse then they think. And the way they fell apart in 2005, dumping Bledsoe and starting Lost-man finishing 5-11-0, was a more fitting season then the "fake" success of '04. Lot of revisonist history here..... Cowher wanted desparately to beat the Bills and show that he was better than TD. The Steelers used their 1st string OL for the first 3 qtrs of the season. Willie Parker and James Harrison were awesome gems in the dirt that showed their flashes of brilliance when given the chance. It is not a surprise that the two players have gone on to have an exteremely good careers in the 4 seasons. Willie was too fast for Takeo Spikes....spikes and bledsoe just could not get the intensity up...The D could not stop a 4th and 3 call late in the 4th qtr when the Bills were sitll within reach of the steelers...Sad day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Mike Mularkey is a lot better coach than a lot of people gave he credit for. Losman killed him here, as he killed Jauron's first 2 seasons. I can't say that I blame Mularkey for leaving (the front office was in a complete mess), but I would have liked to see him stick around another season. He had his problems (name me a post-Levy coach who hasn't), but I think he was a pretty good coach too. I can tell you, he was very liked by his players, and there were many tears shed in the Bills offices when he quit. I think he and Marv would have worked well together. Given what he has done with the Falcons offense, I won't be shocked to see him get another chance somewhere down the road. btw- if you ever got Mularkey to talk about his tumultuous final season in Buffalo, he would tell you he was not in favor of dumping Bledsoe, without another experienced, starting NFL QB to take his place... he knew JP wasn't ready to start... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chandler#81 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Well, there wasn't much in the ways of prestige for the NFC West in 2004, just like it cushioned 3 wins for us in 2008. 2, actually. StL, Sea= W's, Ari, SF= L's. More to the point of the OP, IMO, just 2 wins vs the Division last year would likely have gotten us in playoffs. For sure, if Lindell makes the kick vs. Cleveland. We're close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Get over that hail mary by Leftwich in week one already. When it really counted, late in the season, the Bills came home off a 6 game winning streak. Six straight wins leading up to week 17....(poor DJ would probably have a heart attack if his Buffalo Bills could end a season like that) Last home game of the season, against the Steelers who had everything sewn up and were only playing a choice few starters. We had no way of knowing until late that night, but with a win over that less then full strength Steelers team would have put the Bills in the playoffs....even though Nate didn't knock the ball down in week one. What happened? Of course Bledsoe played like a frieghtened rookie, the defense could not stop third string Wille Parker running behind 2nd and 3rd string blockers, and the Bills lost the damn game that Cowher was trying to hand them. The fact that Parker ending up being a premier running back the next couple years did not make me feel any better. He was the 3rd stringer for that game, and the Bills "great" defense sucked when it needed to be at it's best. Sorry, but I had to remind the 2004 fans that the season was worse then they think. And the way they fell apart in 2005, dumping Bledsoe and starting Lost-man finishing 5-11-0, was a more fitting season then the "fake" success of '04. Call it "fake" if you like, but the Bills, that year, did something they haven't been able to do most of the last decade, which is beat bad football teams on a regular basis. If they could do that every year, they wouldn't have such a piss poor record over the last 10 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chandler#81 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Call it "fake" if you like, but the Bills, that year, did something they haven't been able to do most of the last decade, which is beat bad football teams on a regular basis. If they could do that every year, they wouldn't have such a piss poor record over the last 10 years. 'Zactly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Lieutenant Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Week 17 against Pittsburgh. They had clinched a playoff spot and played many reserves. We were in a "win and in" situation. The score was closer than the actual game. We got our butts kicked. That game was maddening. In retrospect it's not quite as bad now considering the careers that Willie Parker and James Harrison have enjoyed but Brian St Pierre? Seriously? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bufcomments Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Mike Mularkey is a lot better coach than a lot of people gave he credit for. Losman killed him here, as he killed Jauron's first 2 seasons. Did anyone find out the REAL reason he just up and quit?? I thought he did a decent job with the talent he had. The Seattle game that year was well called. The Steelers game Bledsoe didnt not get the job done, and the Bills were right in getting rid of him. But the Defense sucked that game, although we know know that Willie Parker was the real deal and he happened to have his breakout game against us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Lieutenant Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Did anyone find out the REAL reason he just up and quit?? Completely unverified rumor that I have no idea where I heard it from- his kids were taking alot of crap at school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metzelaars_lives Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 I was comparing that team to our team this year and their are alot of similarities. Here's the breakdown.QB's- Even RB- Were better this year Wr's- Very similar 2 WR tandem this year compared to 2004, Even Offense- Potential to be better Defense- Potential to be even, That's unlikely though Coaching- Mularky isn't great but Jaruon isn't either, I'll say Even. I'd certainly take a 9-7 record with our schedule this year Bledsoe of 2004 even with Edwards this year? That's optimistic. McGahee was absolutely insane in 2004 WR's probably better this year Offense potential to be better than 7th in the NFL in scoring? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bufcomments Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Completely unverified rumor that I have no idea where I heard it from- his kids were taking alot of crap at school. That's just something to say to the press I think but I heard that also. There had to be something with the organization that Coach didnt agree with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Lieutenant Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 McGahee was absoluetely insane in 2004 He was. I remember how everyone was giddy about how good Willis was going to once he got his top end speed back. Turns out we're still waiting! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Griffin Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Tim Euhus, Ryan Neufeld and Mark Campbell...............Wow, what a group of tight ends! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Its funny I was playing NFL 2K5 the other day and it featured the 2004 Bills and I realized how nasty that D was and that the offense was decent too. The only real weakness the Bills had that year on defense was a pass rush next to Schobel the rest of the D was really good. You had Pat and Sam clogging up the Middle as well as Schobel attacking from the outside. London and Spikes were really nasty Line backers. The secondary featured Nate and McGee with Troy Vincent and Lawyer Milloy at safety a really solid bunch. The offense had Moulds and Evans along the outside as well as Wills and Travis Henery running the ball. Bledsoe still had something left in the tank. The O-line was suspect (Even though Jonas Jennings was better than expected) and the Tightend position was nothing to brag about so the offense wasn't a good unit but a middle of the road unit. The 2004 season was the culmination of the TD era. All his big free agent signings, big trades, and draft picks were in place and we got to 9-7 and no playoffs. Than thanks to letting Pat Williams go and Letting Bledsoe walk a year early. The team got old quick and what big name players that were left and still producing wanted out. Yet had things gone a little differently we would have had at least one trip to the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Lieutenant Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 You had Pat and Sam clogging up the Middle as well as Schobel attacking from the outside. London and Spikes were really nasty Line backers. The secondary featured Nate and McGee with Troy Vincent and Lawyer Milloy at safety a really solid bunch. And people still claim that no FA's want to play in Buffalo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Knock the ball down, Nate! No chit. I've never been happier to see a Bill leave Buffalo. That guy was all about show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Lieutenant Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 Knock the ball down, Nate! Didn't London Fletcher take some ridiculous penalty on that final drive as well? I seem to remember him trying to be slick and keeping a Jag pinned to the ground for an extra second or 2 and he got called for delay of game or possibly unsportsmanlike conduct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted July 23, 2009 Share Posted July 23, 2009 2, actually. StL, Sea= W's, Ari, SF= L's. More to the point of the OP, IMO, just 2 wins vs the Division last year would likely have gotten us in playoffs. For sure, if Lindell makes the kick vs. Cleveland. We're close. Wow, you're right. I was even at the SF game, and for whatever reason, in my mind I still have it chalked up as a win. Speaking of the SF and Lindell and just a few more wins... I maintain that if he would have made the two chip shots he missed, we wouldn't have had to go for it (and fail) on fourth down in the redzone and that's 9 more points we SHOULD have had in a game decided by only 7. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Completely unverified rumor that I have no idea where I heard it from- his kids were taking alot of crap at school. Mularkey mentioned it when he was left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 And people still claim that no FA's want to play in Buffalo. Well Pat Williams and Schobel were draft picks so was McGee and Nate Clemens. Troy Vincent was a guy few teams wanted because of his age. True we were able to grab guys like Milloy, Sam Adams, London Fletcher and Spikes all of whom were fairly desired guys when they entered free agency. Players will come to Buffalo you will just have to over pay them a little until we become a contender again. Dockery was a sought after free agent and he came here but he came for the money and it didn't work out so well. Drafting will always be so important to the Bills success but you have to supplement a team with a few free agent grabs. Even if you are only adding a piece or two you still have to spend money to keep some of the players you draft/develop. The big issue with the Bills to me is that they are a 7-9 team who will get better in two or three areas with the draft, trades, developing players, and mid level free agents but than you loose 2-3 players of your own and than it amounts to no progress. This year we took a chance on a guy like TO and we had one of the guys we lost Greer replacement waiting in the wings McKelvin. So I hope despite DJ's best efforts we improve and make the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweatpantsjoe Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Didn't London Fletcher take some ridiculous penalty on that final drive as well? I seem to remember him trying to be slick and keeping a Jag pinned to the ground for an extra second or 2 and he got called for delay of game or possibly unsportsmanlike conduct. Yes he did.......just like he did pretty much every other game of his career in Buffalo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 And people still claim that no FA's want to play in Buffalo. As much as we knock Tom Donohoe around here, the franchise had a bit more, uh, "juice" when he was calling the shots... he had a way of making things happening off the field...he wasn't complacent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louie Armstrong Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 As much as we knock Tom Donohoe around here, the franchise had a bit more, uh, "juice" when he was calling the shots... he had a way of making things happening off the field...he wasn't complacent. Is that you, Chris Mortensen??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stussy109 Posted July 24, 2009 Share Posted July 24, 2009 Two words, Pat Williams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 Is that you, Chris Mortensen??? No... just making the observation, when TD was here, the Bills franchise was thought of much more highly, and better run, than it was after he was fired. If TD targeted a FA, that FA was a Buffalo Bill. FA's weren't using Buffalo to up their offers elsewhere, like they did to the "Bungles" for years... true, the post-TD Bills have picked up Stroud (a trade) and Terrell Owens, but, this current FO normally seems afraid to dream too big...they target guys that few other teams want, and then still manage to figure out a way to miss out on them... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SectionC3 Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 Completely unverified rumor that I have no idea where I heard it from- his kids were taking alot of crap at school. I heard the same thing - second hand, so I don't know the source, but the second hand info is usually right on the mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted July 25, 2009 Share Posted July 25, 2009 I heard the same thing - second hand, so I don't know the source, but the second hand info is usually right on the mark. The source was Mularkey himself, he said it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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