Boom Jam Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Not to be disrespectful, but name one TE drafted in the top 15 this decade that's been worth the pick. Here's the list: 2000 - Bubba Franks @ 14 2002 - Jeremy Shockey @ 14 2004 - Kellen Winslow @ 6 2006 - Vernon Davis @ 6 Now contrast that with TEs taken in the first round, outside the top 20 picks this decade: 2001 - Todd Heap @ 31 2002 - Daniel Graham @ 21 2003 - Dallas Clark @ 24 2004 - Ben Watson @ 32 2005 - Heath Miller @ 30 2006 - Marcedes Lewis @ 28 2007 - Greg Olsen @ 31 2008 - Dustin Keller @ 30 To me, it's glaring that the value just isn't there in the top half of the first round. Based on draft history, team need, player value, and projections (where Pettigrew is expected to last into the 20's), it makes way more sense to pass on him. Take him at 28 if he's there, and if not, go with either a guy like Shawn Nelson at 42 or Chase Coffman/James Casey in the 3rd. Just my 1 cent. Nice post. I like what you are saying, but I'm hoping for a different outcome. I see the "value" at the 42nd pick in the interior OL, and that's the direction I hope they go. The 28 pick in my mind is the wildcard, and I haven't the slightest clue what they are going to do with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Our 2 biggest glaring needs are at OT and DE. I don't think we should reach for an offensive tackle at 11, especially if the top tier is gone. In addition, there are a lot of articles stating that this tackle group isn't all that great to begin with. I still think we need to go DE with 11. Either Brown, Orakpo, Ayers or Maybin. The problem with the 28, is that I think the Bills truly are alright with Walker at LT. I'm not sure if this is a smokescreen or not, but I seem to believe it. A great blocking TE would help the LT and RT and Pettigrew fits the Bill. All the mock drafts I have seen, unless they have us picking him, has him going to Philly with the 21 or Atlanta at 24. We should have DEMANDED the 21st pick. Getting a top flight DE and then getting the best TE in the draft would have been great. We could then use our 2nd round pick on a guy like Unger or Wood, and a 3rd on McKenzie or another backer. I just think the 21st pick would have worked out so well to our advantage, and we have too many needs to trade up to get Pettigrew if we don't take him at 11 Do you really think the Bills asked for the 28th pick instead of the 21st? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpcolosi Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Our 2 biggest glaring needs are at OT and DE. I don't think we should reach for an offensive tackle at 11, especially if the top tier is gone. In addition, there are a lot of articles stating that this tackle group isn't all that great to begin with. I still think we need to go DE with 11. Either Brown, Orakpo, Ayers or Maybin. The problem with the 28, is that I think the Bills truly are alright with Walker at LT. I'm not sure if this is a smokescreen or not, but I seem to believe it. A great blocking TE would help the LT and RT and Pettigrew fits the Bill. All the mock drafts I have seen, unless they have us picking him, has him going to Philly with the 21 or Atlanta at 24. We should have DEMANDED the 21st pick. Getting a top flight DE and then getting the best TE in the draft would have been great. We could then use our 2nd round pick on a guy like Unger or Wood, and a 3rd on McKenzie or another backer. I just think the 21st pick would have worked out so well to our advantage, and we have too many needs to trade up to get Pettigrew if we don't take him at 11 read what Peter king says about lower 1st round picks. this is why it was smart for us to do it, and it follows with the patriots in that regard as well. "I think it's hard not to love the Patriots being positioned the way they are -- at overall slots 23, 34, 47 and 58 -- on day one. Increasingly over the years, the value of low first-round picks, and all the picks in the second round, has grown. Someday I've got to study the true impact of the second round versus the first, because as Chicago GM Jerry Angelo told me recently, the value of first-rounders has decreased in his eyes because you can't tell how players will change when they get a boatload of money at age 21 or 22." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boom Jam Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Do you really think the Bills asked for the 28th pick instead of the 21st? Remember - Ralphie is a cheap old bastard... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrags Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 I would think that Franks and Shockey have had pretty darn good careers. So Shockey has some off the field issues, but that tecnically has nothing to do with how he plays football. And I would like to think that when all is said and done that Winslow will have a pretty darn good career also. Similar to Shockey, he has some off the field issues, and a few injury issues, but again that doesnt mean that he wouldnt be a beast if he were to stay healthy since hes been in the league. However I see your point but also say that if we can get the potential best TE in the draft you take him. And the thought is that hes not there at 28 because Atlanta and Philly. If you really want the guy you reach for him. They did that with Whitner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Watching since 1964 Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 I think we asked for the 21st pick and Philly said "not for what we saw on film!" I think they put it in nicer terms, but it may be close to their reaction. If the shoe was on the other foot and Philly was trading Peters to us, how many people would have said that the 28th overall, a 4th and a 6th is alot to give up for a guy who played like Peters did in '08. Plus what we'd have to pay a guy who right now can't be counted on as a true all-pro performer in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Nice post. I like what you are saying, but I'm hoping for a different outcome. I see the "value" at the 42nd pick in the interior OL, and that's the direction I hope they go. The 28 pick in my mind is the wildcard, and I haven't the slightest clue what they are going to do with it. Isn't "value" a silly concept? In the end a player has to contribute. It doesn't matter where he was drafted. "Can he play?" is all that should matter. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsCelticsAngelsBama Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 I would love to get Pettigrew, but would you rather a top DE and a somewhat lesser TE like Nelson, Ingram, Beckam, Casey. Or would you rather Pettigrew and then a much lesser DE like Barwin or Johnson? Pettigrew and Barwin. There are no "TOP" DE's in this draft. Barwin is not "Lesser" than a Maybin or Brown. The only consideration at all for DE should be Tyson Jackson or Robert Ayers but the dropoff from Pettigrew to #2 appears to be great. If they don't get Pettigrew, they might as well just wait intil Round 3 since there appears to be alot of TE's rated about the same after B.P. I think it would nice to use a novel approach and pick the best football player when it is your turn to pick. I would be very happy with a combination of: Cushing, Maualuga, Pettigrew, Oher, Mack, Unger, Ayers, Jackson, Barwin or J. Perry with our top two or three picks. Just my opinion but they look like they understand what the purpose of this game is. Guys like Orakpo , E. Brown and Maybin (most of all) scare me, especially at the #11 pick. Take Care, Hope to see some of you at the draft. Flying from California to Newark today and going to see the Mets as well. Good Luck Bills ------> and our Fans this weekend. Randy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boom Jam Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Isn't "value" a silly concept? In the end a player has to contribute. It doesn't matter where he was drafted. "Can he play?" is all that should matter. PTR I couldn't agree more Promo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffery Lester Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 If by all acounts Brandon Pettigrew is the most complete player at TE to come out in the draft in the last 5 years. Buffalo would be foolish to pass up on him. Even at 11, with Trents pention to check down ala west coast style. Brandon Pettigrew will do nothing but help that team get first downs next year. I hope they do not miss this opportunity and he is called when Buffalo picks at 11. I agree a pass rush needs to be found. I just do not think it should be found at 11. In fact the only defensive player I would consider at 11 would be Raji. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeastMode54 Posted April 23, 2009 Author Share Posted April 23, 2009 Pettigrew and Barwin. There are no "TOP" DE's in this draft. Barwin is not "Lesser" than a Maybin or Brown. The only consideration at all for DE should be Tyson Jackson or Robert Ayers but the dropoff from Pettigrew to #2 appears to be great. If they don't get Pettigrew, they might as well just wait intil Round 3 since there appears to be alot of TE's rated about the same after B.P.I think it would nice to use a novel approach and pick the best football player when it is your turn to pick. I would be very happy with a combination of: Cushing, Maualuga, Pettigrew, Oher, Mack, Unger, Ayers, Jackson, Barwin or J. Perry with our top two or three picks. Just my opinion but they look like they understand what the purpose of this game is. Guys like Orakpo , E. Brown and Maybin (most of all) scare me, especially at the #11 pick. Take Care, Hope to see some of you at the draft. Flying from California to Newark today and going to see the Mets as well. Good Luck Bills ------> and our Fans this weekend. Randy I'm starting to lean that way myself actually. But I think 11 is too high to take him. Maybe not though. I change my mind everyday. Saturday can't get here soon enough Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertpaul49 Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Just like Whitner was such a great prospect for the Bills. The Bills need to trade down, get an additional pick in the second round, pick up more players. Having more draft choices and not reaching for players reduces the bust factor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leonidas Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Do you really think the Bills asked for the 28th pick instead of the 21st? Thank you. Do people seriously think they preferred the #28 pick to the #21, still having $10M+ in cap room? You people are awfully hard on the organization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ1 Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Bills weren't in position to 'demand' anything. If they hadn't traded Peter's before the draft they would have had to put up with the unproductive fool for another year, likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJ (not THAT RJ) Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Thank you. Do people seriously think they preferred the #28 pick to the #21, still having $10M+ in cap room? You people are awfully hard on the organization. But, but , but, when me do trades on Madden, me always get what me want...!!!!1!!! Russ Brandon not do dat. Russ Brandon SUX!!11!!!!11!!! Mesa realist, mesa know what make good football team. Dat why mesa sit in mom's basement all day and comment on TSW. Scuse me. Time to stroke me draft board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
todd Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 While I think that trading Peters was a fantastic move because nobody in their right mind would pay a lazy SOB 60 million, I agree with you in that we should have pushed for the 21st pick. Our 2 biggest glaring needs are at OT and DE. I don't think we should reach for an offensive tackle at 11, especially if the top tier is gone. In addition, there are a lot of articles stating that this tackle group isn't all that great to begin with. I still think we need to go DE with 11. Either Brown, Orakpo, Ayers or Maybin. The problem with the 28, is that I think the Bills truly are alright with Walker at LT. I'm not sure if this is a smokescreen or not, but I seem to believe it. A great blocking TE would help the LT and RT and Pettigrew fits the Bill. All the mock drafts I have seen, unless they have us picking him, has him going to Philly with the 21 or Atlanta at 24. We should have DEMANDED the 21st pick. Getting a top flight DE and then getting the best TE in the draft would have been great. We could then use our 2nd round pick on a guy like Unger or Wood, and a 3rd on McKenzie or another backer. I just think the 21st pick would have worked out so well to our advantage, and we have too many needs to trade up to get Pettigrew if we don't take him at 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VOR Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 With no other team (except for reportedly the Giants, who own the 29th pick) wanting to trade for Peters, the way he handled last off-season, and played during the season, the Bills getting a 1st (even if it was "just" the 28th overall), 4th, and conditional 6th was pretty good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Not to be disrespectful, but name one TE drafted in the top 15 this decade that's been worth the pick. Here's the list: 2000 - Bubba Franks @ 14 2002 - Jeremy Shockey @ 14 2004 - Kellen Winslow @ 6 2006 - Vernon Davis @ 6 Now contrast that with TEs taken in the first round, outside the top 20 picks this decade: 2001 - Todd Heap @ 31 2002 - Daniel Graham @ 21 2003 - Dallas Clark @ 24 2004 - Ben Watson @ 32 2005 - Heath Miller @ 30 2006 - Marcedes Lewis @ 28 2007 - Greg Olsen @ 31 2008 - Dustin Keller @ 30 To me, it's glaring that the value just isn't there in the top half of the first round. Based on draft history, team need, player value, and projections (where Pettigrew is expected to last into the 20's), it makes way more sense to pass on him. Take him at 28 if he's there, and if not, go with either a guy like Shawn Nelson at 42 or Chase Coffman/James Casey in the 3rd. Just my 1 cent. Love that avatar! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 Love that avatar! Thanks! No matter how disappointed I may become with my team, that photo always makes me feel better! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted April 23, 2009 Share Posted April 23, 2009 lets face it, Peters and Co. made it IMPOSSIBLE for the Bills FO to "demand" anything. The Eagles, and anyone else who follows football, knew that the Bills were basically handcuffed. We had to trade him. They knew it, we knew it. Frankly, we're lucky we got what we did for him. It was the same Eagles who recently stated that their unhappy CB was doing nothing but devaluing himself when speaking out in public about his contract situation (the same contract he signed 2 years ago and which still has 4 years on it, sound familiar?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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